4 ms·

Normally I avoid sounding critical but since you vociferously defend the article's merit, here is what I honestly feel: As people deeply involved or passionate

Normally I avoid sounding critical but since you vociferously defend the article's merit, here is what I honestly feel: As people deeply involved or passionate about tech, we hope HN to be a place where * Read something we know from a different perspective (a.k.a the hacker way) * Read something deeper which explains the (usually simpler) stuff in due course (i.e. deepdive) I get it, you love the article and you want it on HN. But it does nothing more than regurgitating what we learned in university already. And the treatment of the topic is pedestrian (Please see why I critiqued it in terms of absence F/R bias & charge flow etc. Just having a sketch of the BJTs & FETs is extremely low bar)

sheusndudn 4y ago
I didn't learn about this in university and was interested by the article. Maybe consider that not everyone took electric engineering and move on with your day?
- srvmshr 4y ago
  Absolutely. But would you like to base your understanding on something well written, intuitively illustrated (not necessarily math or physics heavy) OR something which is a refined copypasta from any garden variety electronic textbook? If I could show you where to find a better place to learn, would you still consider me to "mind my own business" I am not HN's knight crusader. But I would be happy if people got a better appreciation of things others love. And that needs some constructive critique at times. At HN discussions I try to do that whenever I can.
  - subhro 4y ago
    Could you please share the source you mentioned above. Although a computer scientist by profession, I had to "just accept" lots of basic electrical engineer concepts in my undergrad days just because there was no one available that I could ask.
    - srvmshr 4y ago
      For a very quick reference, if you don't know anything (Edit: A grandpa level introduction) https://www.digikey.com/en/articles/transistor-basics https://www.digikey.com/en/articles/transistor-basics And then, https://youtu.be/qhJaq3kl6Dc https://youtu.be/qhJaq3kl6Dc https://youtu.be/AnEVas6cl6Y https://youtu.be/AnEVas6cl6Y Someone even mentioned Ben Eater's videos on SC & PN Diodes & P-N-P/N-P-N transistors. I liked those too when I was learning. Finally the first 10-15 pages in Chapter 1 of Milman & Halkias (PDFs widely circulating) are such a clear read, if something still doesn't click. For the deep dive details I mentioned in parent post, follow 6.004 Computation Structures' first few lectures. Nand2Tetris lectures also cover how circuits are built from these basic units to make functional units of computer (Bonus: they used to have a simulation software with the book which was neat). This will build a conceptual model of whats going on in these tiny semiconductor bits - unlike other places which throw in a bunch of facts & expect you to build on top of them
      - cweagans 4y ago
        See also https://nandgame.com https://nandgame.com -- it's not nearly as comprehensive as the nand2tetris simulator, but it's a lot of fun to work through.
      - itishappy 4y ago
        I think the Digikey page is a far worse introduction than the article. It explains what transistors are, but not at all how they work. It doesn't mention what N and P type silicon are, no mention of depletion zone, there are tables filled with PNs before we even get to the word "electron", and the history is fascinating but not particularly illustrative or helpful for how transistors actually work. I think they're intended for different audiences. I think the article is an excellent introduction to the subject. Maybe the videos explain things better, but I didn't watch them, sorry. I'd much prefer to read a 5m article than 2hrs of video, and I think that's pretty common here. I personally think this fits great on HN. Edit: Second video was very nice; it's short and sweet and covers the same material as the article. I still prefer the article, but some may prefer the different format.
purpleblue 4y ago
You don't have the right to gatekeep on HN. There are plenty of people here that aren't Electrical engineers and the article will be great for them. I certainly enjoyed it. The thing I love about HN is exposure to various types of articles, even things not even remotely related to tech, and certainly YOU should not be some sort of purveyor about what belongs on HN or not.
- srvmshr 4y ago
  > You don't have the right to gatekeep on HN. Absolutely not. But I have a right to point out where an article does a lot of handwaving & is plainly shallow. > There are plenty of people here that aren't Electrical engineers and the article will be great for them. Neither am I. Thats the best thing about being on HN. People are very passionate about the wave of information & its quality. Also if the SNR of articles weren't high (& it was just another Medium-types) you & I won't be discussing its merits here. Thankfully HN posts manage to attract the curious minds. > YOU should not be some sort of purveyor about what belongs on HN or not. I am not, by any means. @dang does that - and very effectively. My job is to express views constructively & debate with facts, without resorting to emotional barrage. You shouldn't either.
  - purpleblue 4y ago
    >> You don't have the right to gatekeep on HN. >Absolutely not. Then I suggest you stop. If you don't like an article, then you can skip it. There's nothing worse than people not liking an article and then decrying about it on the comments when all they need to do is move onto the next article.
    - srvmshr 4y ago
      "And who should you be to command me that, Mi'lord?" You are guilty of the very things you _presume_ I am doing: Gatekeeping. I have as much entitlement to expressing myself, as you, on this site if I am doing a constructive discussion. You don't like my critique of the post? Then move on - just like you suggest. Not my suggestion but yours Trolling me is such a wasteful spending of your time. Better would be to mind your own business instead of telling me what topics I am allowed to post or not.

sheusndudn 4y ago

I didn't learn about this in university and was interested by the article. Maybe consider that not everyone took electric engineering and move on with your day?

srvmshr 4y ago
Absolutely. But would you like to base your understanding on something well written, intuitively illustrated (not necessarily math or physics heavy) OR something which is a refined copypasta from any garden variety electronic textbook? If I could show you where to find a better place to learn, would you still consider me to "mind my own business" I am not HN's knight crusader. But I would be happy if people got a better appreciation of things others love. And that needs some constructive critique at times. At HN discussions I try to do that whenever I can.
- subhro 4y ago
  Could you please share the source you mentioned above. Although a computer scientist by profession, I had to "just accept" lots of basic electrical engineer concepts in my undergrad days just because there was no one available that I could ask.
  - srvmshr 4y ago
    For a very quick reference, if you don't know anything (Edit: A grandpa level introduction) https://www.digikey.com/en/articles/transistor-basics https://www.digikey.com/en/articles/transistor-basics And then, https://youtu.be/qhJaq3kl6Dc https://youtu.be/qhJaq3kl6Dc https://youtu.be/AnEVas6cl6Y https://youtu.be/AnEVas6cl6Y Someone even mentioned Ben Eater's videos on SC & PN Diodes & P-N-P/N-P-N transistors. I liked those too when I was learning. Finally the first 10-15 pages in Chapter 1 of Milman & Halkias (PDFs widely circulating) are such a clear read, if something still doesn't click. For the deep dive details I mentioned in parent post, follow 6.004 Computation Structures' first few lectures. Nand2Tetris lectures also cover how circuits are built from these basic units to make functional units of computer (Bonus: they used to have a simulation software with the book which was neat). This will build a conceptual model of whats going on in these tiny semiconductor bits - unlike other places which throw in a bunch of facts & expect you to build on top of them
    - cweagans 4y ago
      See also https://nandgame.com https://nandgame.com -- it's not nearly as comprehensive as the nand2tetris simulator, but it's a lot of fun to work through.
    - itishappy 4y ago
      I think the Digikey page is a far worse introduction than the article. It explains what transistors are, but not at all how they work. It doesn't mention what N and P type silicon are, no mention of depletion zone, there are tables filled with PNs before we even get to the word "electron", and the history is fascinating but not particularly illustrative or helpful for how transistors actually work. I think they're intended for different audiences. I think the article is an excellent introduction to the subject. Maybe the videos explain things better, but I didn't watch them, sorry. I'd much prefer to read a 5m article than 2hrs of video, and I think that's pretty common here. I personally think this fits great on HN. Edit: Second video was very nice; it's short and sweet and covers the same material as the article. I still prefer the article, but some may prefer the different format.

purpleblue 4y ago

You don't have the right to gatekeep on HN. There are plenty of people here that aren't Electrical engineers and the article will be great for them. I certainly enjoyed it. The thing I love about HN is exposure to various types of articles, even things not even remotely related to tech, and certainly YOU should not be some sort of purveyor about what belongs on HN or not.

srvmshr 4y ago
> You don't have the right to gatekeep on HN. Absolutely not. But I have a right to point out where an article does a lot of handwaving & is plainly shallow. > There are plenty of people here that aren't Electrical engineers and the article will be great for them. Neither am I. Thats the best thing about being on HN. People are very passionate about the wave of information & its quality. Also if the SNR of articles weren't high (& it was just another Medium-types) you & I won't be discussing its merits here. Thankfully HN posts manage to attract the curious minds. > YOU should not be some sort of purveyor about what belongs on HN or not. I am not, by any means. @dang does that - and very effectively. My job is to express views constructively & debate with facts, without resorting to emotional barrage. You shouldn't either.
- purpleblue 4y ago
  >> You don't have the right to gatekeep on HN. >Absolutely not. Then I suggest you stop. If you don't like an article, then you can skip it. There's nothing worse than people not liking an article and then decrying about it on the comments when all they need to do is move onto the next article.
  - srvmshr 4y ago
    "And who should you be to command me that, Mi'lord?" You are guilty of the very things you _presume_ I am doing: Gatekeeping. I have as much entitlement to expressing myself, as you, on this site if I am doing a constructive discussion. You don't like my critique of the post? Then move on - just like you suggest. Not my suggestion but yours Trolling me is such a wasteful spending of your time. Better would be to mind your own business instead of telling me what topics I am allowed to post or not.