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Did you reply to the wrong comment? OP said nothing about L1?
by _ea1k 4y ago
Did you reply to the wrong comment? OP said nothing about L1?
- falcolas 4y agoNope, right comment. > or electric cars, no-one needs 48A (11.5kw) charging refers to L2 DC fast charging. The next level down (which is implied by "nobody needs L2") is L1 charging, which is done on a household 120V or 220V circuit. In other words, if you don't supply L2 (and L3) DC fast charging for customers who need it, EVs will never replace ICE.
- bryanlarsen 4y agoNo, he's saying that 24-32A charging is enough. > The city can start denying permits for charging at more than 24-32A unless you have enough battery storage to cover it up.
- falcolas 4y ago32A at 240V (the standard for DC fast charging) is ~8kw, so you'd still be looking at 10 hours for a battery charge. Sufficient for my construction workers, insufficient for supporting long distance driving.
- bryanlarsen 4y agoI think we can agree that anybody who averages more than 400 miles a day is going to need more than 24A charging. Commercial drivers should be using commercial facilities, not residential ones.
- falcolas 4y agoAnybody taking a road trip falls into this category. You couldn't drive from San Francisco to LA without access to L3 charging.
- bryanlarsen 4y agoBoth 24A and 48A charging are both similarly insufficient for a road trip, so I'm unsure how your comment relates to thatfrenchguy's original comment.
- falcolas 4y agoHis original comment says no L3 capable charging should be allowed, with the only exception requiring a huge investment in expensive battery storage (Lithium Ion packs cost around $200 per kWh, built at a MWh scale) - something unprecedented with gasoline infrastructure.
- sokoloff 4y agoCan you link to the comment you're referencing? I can't see where anyone said that.
- bryanlarsen 4y agoThe original comment says nothing about L3 charging. It says nobody needs 48A charging, which is a type of L2 charging.
- sokoloff 4y agoEven 11.5kW is not DC fast charging. That's still an AC charge typically.
- falcolas 4y agoFWIW, I'm using the following as my guide for what level each kW is: https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/what-is-dc-fast-charging https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/what-is-dc-fast... And 11.5kW is in the mid-L2 range per that. It could be out of date, for sure.
- kgermino 4y agoThat's a good guide, but L2 is standard AC charging (usually with a 240V outlet in your garage/driveway) not DC Fast Charging
- falcolas 4y agoA good point, thanks!
- _ea1k 4y agoYou seem to be confusing a lot of terminology. DC charging is a separate thing from L1-L3, though some people mistakenly describe DC charging as "L3". L1 = single phase 120V power. People typically think of common household outlets, which will be limited to 12A or 16A, but it could also be a TT-30 at 24A. L2 = Split phase 240V. Typical amperages are 32 and up, but lower is possible with some cars and higher is common. Eg, the F-150 Lightning can charge at 80A. L3 (very uncommon) = 3 Phase AC at up to 400A - Could be >300KW. I've never seen this.
- sokoloff 4y agoFrom that article: "Both Level 1 and Level 2 charging utilizes alternating current (AC)"
- kgermino 4y agoYou're confused. L2 is not DC fast charging, it's just 240V AC charging. Most home chargers will likely be 240V at ~24 Amps, that's about 6 kW and plenty for the vast majority of users. People who regularly need more can easily install more. DC Fast Charging, (L3) is done at 400-800V and really only needed for road trips so few places outside of highways will likely have it
- _ea1k 4y agoHe was referring to reduced amperages, not switching down to single phase (L1). It'd be enough for most people, but significantly less peak load.