4 ms·

I like your explanation for why the word might be drift prone but I think the explanation is much simpler: In contemporary social and political conversations di

I like your explanation for why the word might be drift prone but I think the explanation is much simpler: In contemporary social and political conversations disagreement isn’t an acute occurrence. People who share even a slightly different view are not just wrong, they’re rotten to the core and consciously systemically undermining good in the world. Words like wrong, disagree or even lying don’t express this sentiment. They give the person who disagreed with you a pass on what they really are: A manipulator who is attempting to assault your psyche and break you down. I really hope we as a society get out of this mode of thinking soon. I’d love to be able to have rational discourse again in my lifetime outside of a very small circle of trusted people.

jfengel 4y ago
The problem, as I see it, is that individuals may not be "rotten to the core", but movements can be. The most active participants are often the worst ones, and the less-awful ones will often make excuses for them. Even by saying nothing, but simply ignoring it while identifying with the group, they will be seen by both enemies and allies as approving of the worst behavior. In my opinion, the best way to "get out of this mode of thinking" is for people to look at their allies and say, "Hey, can we tone it down a little?" As it is, right now, it's the ones who are not "rotten to the core" with the most ability to change things. And failing to do so means that they are, indeed, "systemically undermining good in the world". Unfortunately, asking people to tone it down is a dangerous tactic. It may improve the world, but at a cost of decreasing your own power. That's why the nastiness not only persists, but expands.
- polishdude20 4y ago
  Sometimes, asking your allies to tone it down a little puts you in their enemy list.
  - jfengel 4y ago
    And with good reason, in the sense that the extreme rhetoric can be very successful. It is a way to excite the base. The trick is to avoid alienating the people who imagine themselves to be centrists. So asking your allies to tone it down a little is a genuine risk. You have to be willing to take up the side of the people who are being harmed. Or you can accede to the harm. But you don't get to opt out of that choice -- one thing or another happens.
    - itsdrewmiller 4y ago
      I opt out every day by not logging into twitter. We don't have a moral obligation to intercede in every argument.

jfengel 4y ago

The problem, as I see it, is that individuals may not be "rotten to the core", but movements can be. The most active participants are often the worst ones, and the less-awful ones will often make excuses for them. Even by saying nothing, but simply ignoring it while identifying with the group, they will be seen by both enemies and allies as approving of the worst behavior. In my opinion, the best way to "get out of this mode of thinking" is for people to look at their allies and say, "Hey, can we tone it down a little?" As it is, right now, it's the ones who are not "rotten to the core" with the most ability to change things. And failing to do so means that they are, indeed, "systemically undermining good in the world". Unfortunately, asking people to tone it down is a dangerous tactic. It may improve the world, but at a cost of decreasing your own power. That's why the nastiness not only persists, but expands.

polishdude20 4y ago
Sometimes, asking your allies to tone it down a little puts you in their enemy list.
- jfengel 4y ago
  And with good reason, in the sense that the extreme rhetoric can be very successful. It is a way to excite the base. The trick is to avoid alienating the people who imagine themselves to be centrists. So asking your allies to tone it down a little is a genuine risk. You have to be willing to take up the side of the people who are being harmed. Or you can accede to the harm. But you don't get to opt out of that choice -- one thing or another happens.
  - itsdrewmiller 4y ago
    I opt out every day by not logging into twitter. We don't have a moral obligation to intercede in every argument.