4 ms·

True, but (some) ATtiny are still available in beginner-friendly tth DIP package.

watchdogtimer 4y ago
Unfortunately, judging from the article, this doesn't appear to be true for any of the new series. Some of the new AVR series are, however. A few of these have some of the same features offered in these Tinys (e.g., 12-bit differential ADCs)
- puzzlingcaptcha 4y ago
  8-pin SOIC packages (like 412/212) are still very easy to handle as a hobbyist. I've used them in a variety of projects.
  - BoorishBears 4y ago
    As a kid I remember ordering free MSP430 samples from TI (in DIP format) SOIC would have been completely inaccessible for me as I mostly relied on breadboards and a radio shack soldering iron with a half-corroded tip that would probably be better suited for plumbing than placing SOICs
    - unwind 4y ago
      This bears repeating every once in a while: surface-mount soldering is not very hard. It's perhaps harder than through-hole, since you don't get the benefit of having the component held mechanically, but not by a lot. The actual soldering with surface-mount stuff does not mean you have to be like an industrial robot in your precision and gently apply heat to each tiny tiny leg, while also getting the solder in there just in time, all the while holding your breath so you don't blow things away. Not at all. Surface-mount soldering can be done using way "uglier" techniques than through-hole, where you basically flood the component's legs with solder, heat it enough for it to melt and flow, and then remove the excess. Thanks to the magic of surface tension (and, if you have it, extra flux) the solder will flow to where you want it, all on its own. This kind of technique probably wouldn't cut it for production, where consistency and quality of course are important, but for hobby use it's fine! There are plenty of YouTube videos showing this off, it can be really really easy. Please don't fear surface-mount soldering. Grab (the cool side of) your iron and join the fun!
      - BoorishBears 4y ago
        As an adult with disposable income surface mount is easy, I have great soldering irons and I order PCBs all the time (used to make them too but it's gotten cheap enough that it's not worth the hassle) But for a 15 year old with no budget and limited tooling (even flux would have been a luxury), being able to order off a sample form and get something that just worked was invaluable.
snvzz 4y ago
Several msp430 chips are still available in DIP too, and the new ATtiny's aren't either; it is not an ATtiny advantage. On the bright side, some SMD packages are still reasonably workable with a soldering iron, like SOIC, and cheap devboards that do little else than breakout into a DIP package are commonplace.
- guenthert 4y ago
  Indeed. digikey even has some MSP430 in PDIP in stock for reasonable prices: https://www.digikey.com/en/products/filter/microcontrollers/685?s=N4IgjCBcoGwJxVAYygMwIYBsDOBTANCAPZQDaIALGGABxwDsIAuoQA4AuUIAyuwE4BLAHYBzEAF9xhAExkQAW2ysKAZgAMzcUA https://www.digikey.com/en/products/filter/microcontrollers/...

Unfortunately, judging from the article, this doesn't appear to be true for any of the new series. Some of the new AVR series are, however. A few of these have some of the same features offered in these Tinys (e.g., 12-bit differential ADCs)

puzzlingcaptcha 4y ago
8-pin SOIC packages (like 412/212) are still very easy to handle as a hobbyist. I've used them in a variety of projects.
- BoorishBears 4y ago
  As a kid I remember ordering free MSP430 samples from TI (in DIP format) SOIC would have been completely inaccessible for me as I mostly relied on breadboards and a radio shack soldering iron with a half-corroded tip that would probably be better suited for plumbing than placing SOICs
  - unwind 4y ago
    This bears repeating every once in a while: surface-mount soldering is not very hard. It's perhaps harder than through-hole, since you don't get the benefit of having the component held mechanically, but not by a lot. The actual soldering with surface-mount stuff does not mean you have to be like an industrial robot in your precision and gently apply heat to each tiny tiny leg, while also getting the solder in there just in time, all the while holding your breath so you don't blow things away. Not at all. Surface-mount soldering can be done using way "uglier" techniques than through-hole, where you basically flood the component's legs with solder, heat it enough for it to melt and flow, and then remove the excess. Thanks to the magic of surface tension (and, if you have it, extra flux) the solder will flow to where you want it, all on its own. This kind of technique probably wouldn't cut it for production, where consistency and quality of course are important, but for hobby use it's fine! There are plenty of YouTube videos showing this off, it can be really really easy. Please don't fear surface-mount soldering. Grab (the cool side of) your iron and join the fun!
    - BoorishBears 4y ago
      As an adult with disposable income surface mount is easy, I have great soldering irons and I order PCBs all the time (used to make them too but it's gotten cheap enough that it's not worth the hassle) But for a 15 year old with no budget and limited tooling (even flux would have been a luxury), being able to order off a sample form and get something that just worked was invaluable.

snvzz 4y ago

Several msp430 chips are still available in DIP too, and the new ATtiny's aren't either; it is not an ATtiny advantage. On the bright side, some SMD packages are still reasonably workable with a soldering iron, like SOIC, and cheap devboards that do little else than breakout into a DIP package are commonplace.

guenthert 4y ago
Indeed. digikey even has some MSP430 in PDIP in stock for reasonable prices: https://www.digikey.com/en/products/filter/microcontrollers/685?s=N4IgjCBcoGwJxVAYygMwIYBsDOBTANCAPZQDaIALGGABxwDsIAuoQA4AuUIAyuwE4BLAHYBzEAF9xhAExkQAW2ysKAZgAMzcUA https://www.digikey.com/en/products/filter/microcontrollers/...