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You are making a logical error. Seydor pointed out that low density harms communities, which is true. High density is a required condition for building communi

You are making a logical error. Seydor pointed out that low density harms communities, which is true. High density is a required condition for building communities, but not sufficient.

vladvasiliu 4y ago
It's a question of degree. The way I understand the last part of seydor's point: > Most european cities are old and very high density, built for horses is that "high density, at the level of European cities, is a required condition. I take issue with this level of density being a requirement. My point is that said level is too much and, actually, goes against the intended outcome because this much proximity creates tension between the people. Instead, in my view, the optimal level of density is "average", somewhere betwen "US suburbia sprawl" and "European city can't breathe density". Now, of course, "average" is not an actual measure, but it allows at least to eliminate European cities as a model to strive for. I've seen many an article in the local (France) papers talking about increasing levels of solitude, and people always chime in with "Yeah, that's [big city] for you. In my [small town], it's much easier to make new friends".
- goodpoint 4y ago
  > European city can't breathe There is no such thing. European cities are not HK. There are density maps available to check.
  - vladvasiliu 4y ago
    > European cities are not HK. Indeed, they are not. Paris: 21,000/km2 (53,000/sq mi) Barcelona: 16,000/km2 (41,000/sq mi) London: 5,598/km2 (14,500/sq mi) Madrid: 5,300/km2 (14,000/sq mi) Amsterdam: 5,214/km2 (13,500/sq mi) Hong Kong: 6,801/km2 (17,614.5/sq mi) Shanghai: 3,900/km2 (10,000/sq mi) Source: the cities' pages on Wikipedia. --- Also, X being worse than Y doesn't make Y good.
    - goodpoint 4y ago
      Thanks for sharing this, turns out that only some areas of HK are crazy dense. Paris and Barcelona are very nice cities to live in.

You are making a logical error. Seydor pointed out that low density harms communities, which is true. High density is a required condition for building communities, but not sufficient.

vladvasiliu 4y ago

It's a question of degree. The way I understand the last part of seydor's point: > Most european cities are old and very high density, built for horses is that "high density, at the level of European cities, is a required condition. I take issue with this level of density being a requirement. My point is that said level is too much and, actually, goes against the intended outcome because this much proximity creates tension between the people. Instead, in my view, the optimal level of density is "average", somewhere betwen "US suburbia sprawl" and "European city can't breathe density". Now, of course, "average" is not an actual measure, but it allows at least to eliminate European cities as a model to strive for. I've seen many an article in the local (France) papers talking about increasing levels of solitude, and people always chime in with "Yeah, that's [big city] for you. In my [small town], it's much easier to make new friends".

goodpoint 4y ago
> European city can't breathe There is no such thing. European cities are not HK. There are density maps available to check.
- vladvasiliu 4y ago
  > European cities are not HK. Indeed, they are not. Paris: 21,000/km2 (53,000/sq mi) Barcelona: 16,000/km2 (41,000/sq mi) London: 5,598/km2 (14,500/sq mi) Madrid: 5,300/km2 (14,000/sq mi) Amsterdam: 5,214/km2 (13,500/sq mi) Hong Kong: 6,801/km2 (17,614.5/sq mi) Shanghai: 3,900/km2 (10,000/sq mi) Source: the cities' pages on Wikipedia. --- Also, X being worse than Y doesn't make Y good.
  - goodpoint 4y ago
    Thanks for sharing this, turns out that only some areas of HK are crazy dense. Paris and Barcelona are very nice cities to live in.