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“Driving too fast for conditions or in excess of posted speed limit” is the largest related factor in fatal crashes in the US, according to the NHTSA, it ranks

by dahart 4y ago

“Driving too fast for conditions or in excess of posted speed limit” is the largest related factor in fatal crashes in the US, according to the NHTSA, it ranks above alcohol (by nearly 2x!). https://crashstats.nhtsa.dot.gov/Api/Public/ViewPublication/813375 https://crashstats.nhtsa.dot.gov/Api/Public/ViewPublication/... Do keep in mind that we’re talking about a subscription to go 0-60 MPH in 5.2 seconds vs 0-60 in 6.2 seconds. The non-subscribed acceleration of 0-60 in 6.2 seconds for this specific car is far faster than the majority of cars on the road can accelerate. Do also keep in mind that the non-subscription features of the car must pass all safety standards, therefore safety is clearly not on a subscription model. There are plenty of valid reasons to dislike these auto-maker attempts at rent seeking, so let’s not be hyperbolic about them, lest we undermine the stronger arguments.

Fire-Dragon-DoL 4y ago
People who did not crash don't appear on statistic though (just making a point)
- tfehring 4y ago
  It's definitely harder to count the time spent speeding when that speeding doesn't end in a crash, but the NHTSA still tries to do it [0]. About 19% of vehicle miles are driven at more than 10 mph above the speed limit on highways, somewhat fewer on city streets. [0] https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/documents/812485_national-traffic-speeds-survey-iii-2015.pdf https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/documents/812485...
  - Fire-Dragon-DoL 4y ago
    I'm talking about sudden acceleration to avoid danger, not constant speeding. Fast overtakes might rarely be registered because those are short lived.
- dahart 4y ago
  That might seem like a logical point, but think about it a little more; if speeding is helping some people to not crash, then the point you’re effectively making is that speeding might actually make you even more than twice as likely to cause a fatal accident as a drunk driver, but sometimes helps enough that it evens out to be only twice as likely to cause a fatality. It’s not true that non-crashes aren’t represented here- the NHTSA statistics capture the rate of crashes in terms like crashes per vehicle miles traveled, which represents both the probability of crashing and the probability of not crashing (one minus the probability of crashing). The fact that speeding is a huge factor in many crashes and that it increases the chance of death does in fact demonstrate that it’s overall less safe to speed. Speed might anecdotally help some people in some situations, but the actual stats do prove that the net effect of speeding is greater risk.
Youden 4y ago
Acceleration != speed. Acceleration increases the degree of control you have over your vehicle. That control could be the difference between life and death in an emergency. For example if you see a car driving towards you from the side (e.g. they're running a red light), increased acceleration could allow you to get out of the way in time. More conventionally, increased acceleration allows you to complete an overtaking manoeuvre in a reduced time. Reduced overtaking distance is fairly universally regarded as also reducing the risk of an accident.
- dahart 4y ago
  > Acceleration != speed That’s true, good point. (But we’re talking about a sport feature of a Mercedes car with unnecessary amounts of acceleration.) > Acceleration increases the degree of control you have over your vehicle That’s not true. You’re exercising control by accelerating, but not increasing control. Braking and steering are also exercising control. Accelerating too fast in wet or dusty conditions reduces control. Accelerating too quickly when people around you don’t expect it increases the risk of accident. > Reduced overtaking distance is fairly universally regarded as also reducing the risk of an accident. I’ve never heard this before, can you back this claim up with some evidence? The NHTSA report I posted is quite thorough and does not mention passing time as a risk factor. I’m sure you’re right and it is true when overtaking into oncoming traffic, if you cross the median. I doubt this is true for separated freeways like most of the urban US interstates inside city boundaries. I’m sure your claim here is not true when people exceed the speed limit in order to overtake, which is a very common occurrence where I live. Much of the passing that goes on happens when someone overtakes another person who’s already traveling at or above the speed limit, by further exceeding the speed limit. This is not made safer by doing it faster.

by dahart 4y ago

Fire-Dragon-DoL 4y ago

People who did not crash don't appear on statistic though (just making a point)

tfehring 4y ago
It's definitely harder to count the time spent speeding when that speeding doesn't end in a crash, but the NHTSA still tries to do it [0]. About 19% of vehicle miles are driven at more than 10 mph above the speed limit on highways, somewhat fewer on city streets. [0] https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/documents/812485_national-traffic-speeds-survey-iii-2015.pdf https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/documents/812485...
- Fire-Dragon-DoL 4y ago
  I'm talking about sudden acceleration to avoid danger, not constant speeding. Fast overtakes might rarely be registered because those are short lived.
dahart 4y ago
That might seem like a logical point, but think about it a little more; if speeding is helping some people to not crash, then the point you’re effectively making is that speeding might actually make you even more than twice as likely to cause a fatal accident as a drunk driver, but sometimes helps enough that it evens out to be only twice as likely to cause a fatality. It’s not true that non-crashes aren’t represented here- the NHTSA statistics capture the rate of crashes in terms like crashes per vehicle miles traveled, which represents both the probability of crashing and the probability of not crashing (one minus the probability of crashing). The fact that speeding is a huge factor in many crashes and that it increases the chance of death does in fact demonstrate that it’s overall less safe to speed. Speed might anecdotally help some people in some situations, but the actual stats do prove that the net effect of speeding is greater risk.

Youden 4y ago

Acceleration != speed. Acceleration increases the degree of control you have over your vehicle. That control could be the difference between life and death in an emergency. For example if you see a car driving towards you from the side (e.g. they're running a red light), increased acceleration could allow you to get out of the way in time. More conventionally, increased acceleration allows you to complete an overtaking manoeuvre in a reduced time. Reduced overtaking distance is fairly universally regarded as also reducing the risk of an accident.

dahart 4y ago
> Acceleration != speed That’s true, good point. (But we’re talking about a sport feature of a Mercedes car with unnecessary amounts of acceleration.) > Acceleration increases the degree of control you have over your vehicle That’s not true. You’re exercising control by accelerating, but not increasing control. Braking and steering are also exercising control. Accelerating too fast in wet or dusty conditions reduces control. Accelerating too quickly when people around you don’t expect it increases the risk of accident. > Reduced overtaking distance is fairly universally regarded as also reducing the risk of an accident. I’ve never heard this before, can you back this claim up with some evidence? The NHTSA report I posted is quite thorough and does not mention passing time as a risk factor. I’m sure you’re right and it is true when overtaking into oncoming traffic, if you cross the median. I doubt this is true for separated freeways like most of the urban US interstates inside city boundaries. I’m sure your claim here is not true when people exceed the speed limit in order to overtake, which is a very common occurrence where I live. Much of the passing that goes on happens when someone overtakes another person who’s already traveling at or above the speed limit, by further exceeding the speed limit. This is not made safer by doing it faster.