3 ms·

I think you're describing the Midwest. People clear sidewalks and driveways for each other after a snow, unasked and uncompensated. People let each other off pu

I think you're describing the Midwest. People clear sidewalks and driveways for each other after a snow, unasked and uncompensated. People let each other off public transportation before crowding on. And... there are drunks everywhere. So two out of three. But what I'm aiming at is this: in less urbanized areas of the United States, the sort of shared ideas that allow successful coexistence exist. It's largely the major cities where you cannot find it.

mattzito 4y ago
> It's largely the major cities where you cannot find it. I would argue differently, and say that it's entirely a factor of density. The more people that are crammed into a small area, the more you will see the spectrum of human behavior in any given situation. So, in the midwest you might see people clearing sidewalks and driveways for each other - I'm more familiar with the HOA that sends threatening letters to people for not shoveling fast enough. But you don't see both those things at the same time, so you can choose to focus on whichever you prefer. In my experience in a large US city, people are incredibly kind and very much look out for each other, even strangers. I have many times seen strangers helping each other in situations, both minor and serious, and neighbors even more so. And sure, yes, I've seen people acting badly, but in general from living in both part of the country, people in the city are far and away nicer and more concerned about the welfare of those around them.
- barry-cotter 4y ago
  > I would argue differently, and say that it's entirely a factor of density. The more people that are crammed into a small area, the more you will see the spectrum of human behavior in any given situation. Then why are New York and Chicago so much worse in this regard than Tokyo? They’re all big, dense, highly populated cities.
  - decafninja 4y ago
    As someone above said - culture. As to why the culture is different between say, NYC and Tokyo, well there’s many factors involved. But as some people say when describing certain things in NYC, “it’s why we can’t have nice things”.
    - GameOfFrowns 4y ago
      >NYC and Tokyo, well there’s many factors involved. And the most obvious one is demographic composition.
      - decafninja 4y ago
        Probably the most taboo thing to say too. I myself prefer the diversity of NYC over the monoculture of most East Asian cities (and I say this as an East Asian myself), but failing to recognize that both models have pros and cons because of political correctness is stupid.
  - roflyear 4y ago
    Manhattan sucks but NYC has great neighborhoods
gamblor956 4y ago
Doesn't describe any part of the Midwest I'm familiar with...
- JasonFruit 4y ago
  It is possible that we're both right. Do you mind sharing where in the Midwest you have experience?
  - gamblor956 4y ago
    Ohio. People there are vile, especially in Akron and the smaller factory towns. And Oklahoma, outside of Tulsa.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - turrican 4y ago
      My anecdote to counter yours: I moved from the PNW to Rhode Island for four years, and then to Ohio. Moving to the Northeast was absolutely a culture shock for both of us, with “colder” and less helpful people in general. Over time, we discovered that the people in rural areas were still friendly, and the city people would open up after they got to know you, but there was a very noticeable lack of trust or respect in Providence. As an example, I remember one of those electric scooter companies pulled out of Providence because they couldn’t stop our citizens from throwing the scooters into the Bay. We moved to Cincinnati next and it’s a night and day difference. Friendly service at businesses, people helping each other in snowstorms, etc. I’ve helped to care for my elderly neighbors since day one and we always get help when we need it as well.
      - gamblor956 4y ago
        Sounds like you are white Protestant. Cincinnati folk are really friendly to people who look just like them. For the rest of us, not so much. I got tired of them telling me to go back where I came from, so I did.
JohnBooty 4y ago
My experience in America (even up here in the "mean" northeast) is that we do tend to treat our families and neighbors very decently, which suggests that we're not exactly devoid of compassion. However, I believe this is different than what the parent poster is talking about. The parent poster refers not to a generalized lack of compassion from Americans, but a peculiar lack of respect for shared, public spaces. I think it's an interesting distinction. It's like we have a very focused version of communalism. Most of us instinctively want to help those in our "clans" - friends, neighbors, family. But we see much less value in places and institutions that are shared by the wider public: libraries, streets, town squares, etc.
- wesapien 4y ago
  this diffusion of responsibility for shared spaces or public spaces is one of the peculiar things the USA will share with the PRC.

mattzito 4y ago

> It's largely the major cities where you cannot find it. I would argue differently, and say that it's entirely a factor of density. The more people that are crammed into a small area, the more you will see the spectrum of human behavior in any given situation. So, in the midwest you might see people clearing sidewalks and driveways for each other - I'm more familiar with the HOA that sends threatening letters to people for not shoveling fast enough. But you don't see both those things at the same time, so you can choose to focus on whichever you prefer. In my experience in a large US city, people are incredibly kind and very much look out for each other, even strangers. I have many times seen strangers helping each other in situations, both minor and serious, and neighbors even more so. And sure, yes, I've seen people acting badly, but in general from living in both part of the country, people in the city are far and away nicer and more concerned about the welfare of those around them.

barry-cotter 4y ago
> I would argue differently, and say that it's entirely a factor of density. The more people that are crammed into a small area, the more you will see the spectrum of human behavior in any given situation. Then why are New York and Chicago so much worse in this regard than Tokyo? They’re all big, dense, highly populated cities.
- decafninja 4y ago
  As someone above said - culture. As to why the culture is different between say, NYC and Tokyo, well there’s many factors involved. But as some people say when describing certain things in NYC, “it’s why we can’t have nice things”.
  - GameOfFrowns 4y ago
    >NYC and Tokyo, well there’s many factors involved. And the most obvious one is demographic composition.
    - decafninja 4y ago
      Probably the most taboo thing to say too. I myself prefer the diversity of NYC over the monoculture of most East Asian cities (and I say this as an East Asian myself), but failing to recognize that both models have pros and cons because of political correctness is stupid.
- roflyear 4y ago
  Manhattan sucks but NYC has great neighborhoods

gamblor956 4y ago

Doesn't describe any part of the Midwest I'm familiar with...

JasonFruit 4y ago
It is possible that we're both right. Do you mind sharing where in the Midwest you have experience?
- gamblor956 4y ago
  Ohio. People there are vile, especially in Akron and the smaller factory towns. And Oklahoma, outside of Tulsa.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - turrican 4y ago
    My anecdote to counter yours: I moved from the PNW to Rhode Island for four years, and then to Ohio. Moving to the Northeast was absolutely a culture shock for both of us, with “colder” and less helpful people in general. Over time, we discovered that the people in rural areas were still friendly, and the city people would open up after they got to know you, but there was a very noticeable lack of trust or respect in Providence. As an example, I remember one of those electric scooter companies pulled out of Providence because they couldn’t stop our citizens from throwing the scooters into the Bay. We moved to Cincinnati next and it’s a night and day difference. Friendly service at businesses, people helping each other in snowstorms, etc. I’ve helped to care for my elderly neighbors since day one and we always get help when we need it as well.
    - gamblor956 4y ago
      Sounds like you are white Protestant. Cincinnati folk are really friendly to people who look just like them. For the rest of us, not so much. I got tired of them telling me to go back where I came from, so I did.

JohnBooty 4y ago

My experience in America (even up here in the "mean" northeast) is that we do tend to treat our families and neighbors very decently, which suggests that we're not exactly devoid of compassion. However, I believe this is different than what the parent poster is talking about. The parent poster refers not to a generalized lack of compassion from Americans, but a peculiar lack of respect for shared, public spaces. I think it's an interesting distinction. It's like we have a very focused version of communalism. Most of us instinctively want to help those in our "clans" - friends, neighbors, family. But we see much less value in places and institutions that are shared by the wider public: libraries, streets, town squares, etc.

wesapien 4y ago
this diffusion of responsibility for shared spaces or public spaces is one of the peculiar things the USA will share with the PRC.