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Mainly this line: > they were consistent in that the Ottoman Empire as a state was not seen as the seamless continuation of the Roman Empire, but rather its he

Mainly this line: > they were consistent in that the Ottoman Empire as a state was not seen as the seamless continuation of the Roman Empire, but rather its heir and successor, as the former empire had far too deep theological roots to be compatible with a foreign Muslim ruler. Thus, the former Byzantines saw the Ottoman Empire as inheriting the political legitimacy and right to universal rule of the preceding empire, but not its other theological implications. The theological implication tie heavily into the civilizational ideals that a society is based upon even to the modern day. Try and understand modern China without Confucianism for example. The import of Islam into the Ottoman empire was a clear break between any theological/ideological basis that could tie it to Rome and therefore it is not a continuation of Rome. Whereas all the other nations mentioned retained Christianity which for thousands of years was transmitted through the church into these nations and is the oldest institution that remains of Rome. If a nation is not majority Christian (or post-christian) in my view it is unable to claim to be a continuation of Rome in the most meaningful sense (as a transmitter of the major ideas and conventions that held sway in that society).

mcv 4y ago
Yeah, but Rome itself also adopted a new religion towards its end. It was pagan for most of its existence, and turned Christian towards the end. It's true that Russia has claimed the theological inheritance of the Christian eastern Roman Empire with Moscow as the Third Rome, but that still doesn't explain how Spain, Great Britain, the US and the Netherlands could possibly be considered successors.
- TapWaterBandit 4y ago
  Yes, but that religion was heavily influenced by Roman culture in a way Islam was not. All the above mentioned countries still live virtually entirely under the morality and worldview shaped by that religion. Christianty is a religion heavily influenced by the Roman civilization, Islam is not. The nations mentioned all still abide by the beliefs inherited from the Roman past to a much greater extent than the Islamic nations. The Catholic Church specifically (which was the only church until the reformation) was and is a Roman institution. The groups that splintered off in the reformation were still heavily shaped by the 1000+ years of of this dominance. That is why they (and all other Christian nations) can to at least some extent claim to be descendants of Rome in a way Islamic nations cannot. Just because there are competing claims does not make all claims equal. Islam being the dominant belief system precludes a nation from being an heir to Rome in any meaningful sense.

mcv 4y ago

Yeah, but Rome itself also adopted a new religion towards its end. It was pagan for most of its existence, and turned Christian towards the end. It's true that Russia has claimed the theological inheritance of the Christian eastern Roman Empire with Moscow as the Third Rome, but that still doesn't explain how Spain, Great Britain, the US and the Netherlands could possibly be considered successors.

TapWaterBandit 4y ago
Yes, but that religion was heavily influenced by Roman culture in a way Islam was not. All the above mentioned countries still live virtually entirely under the morality and worldview shaped by that religion. Christianty is a religion heavily influenced by the Roman civilization, Islam is not. The nations mentioned all still abide by the beliefs inherited from the Roman past to a much greater extent than the Islamic nations. The Catholic Church specifically (which was the only church until the reformation) was and is a Roman institution. The groups that splintered off in the reformation were still heavily shaped by the 1000+ years of of this dominance. That is why they (and all other Christian nations) can to at least some extent claim to be descendants of Rome in a way Islamic nations cannot. Just because there are competing claims does not make all claims equal. Islam being the dominant belief system precludes a nation from being an heir to Rome in any meaningful sense.