5 ms·

Hopefully they're properly negative on SBF as opposed to the mainstream media that seems to be still effusing his praise or at least being neutral. Also there'

Hopefully they're properly negative on SBF as opposed to the mainstream media that seems to be still effusing his praise or at least being neutral. Also there's still the criminal charges to come after this. I don't really understand why he's not already in prison.

prepend 4y ago
He’s in the Bahamas so they’ll need to extradite.
- polygamous_bat 4y ago
  Let's hope he physically shows up at the New York Times dealbook summit [0] in person out of sheer stupidity and hubris and makes the job easy for the feds. [0] https://twitter.com/SBF_FTX/status/1595512579417378837?t=Mx-mbMKpkljtuSzmEjN4Eg&s=19 https://twitter.com/SBF_FTX/status/1595512579417378837?t=Mx-...
AlbertCory 4y ago
The wheels of the law grind slowly. Look at Elizabeth Holmes. The WSJ article that started her downfall came out in 2015. And she's still walking around free (for now).
- SilasX 4y ago
  Media isn’t the law and can be expected to grind a little faster. What were you responding to there?
- nazgulsenpai 4y ago
  Unless you wrote tornado.cash then they find you where you hide and jail you. Meanwhile SBF is walking around freely and giving interviews. *edit: phrasing
  - polygamous_bat 4y ago
    Tornado cash was released almost 3 years ago. I would argue it took a lot longer than 3 weeks until its developer was arrested.
    - nazgulsenpai 4y ago
      Yes but it was only sanctioned a few months ago.
  - AlbertCory 4y ago
    They have a saying about bank loans: If you borrow $100,000, the bank owns you. If you borrow $100,000,000, you own the bank. The bigger you are, the longer it takes the establishment to bring you down, if they ever do.
  - HWR_14 4y ago
    > SBF is walking around freely and giving interviews. If I were the prosecutors, I would let him keep hanging himself with on the record interviews for as long as possible. Everything he says seems to make the case easier to win.
- spamizbad 4y ago
  Holmes is an interesting case because she got the opposite treatment as SBF: the press started running negative stories almost immediately while the tech industry was still neutral-to-defensive.
  - kgwgk 4y ago
    “almost immediately” relative to when?
    - MichaelCollins 4y ago
      Once Bad Blood was published. It took a few years for the dam to break, but once it did the rest of the media piled on quick. The FTX dam broke a few weeks ago and so far the media generally seems unenthusiastic about covering the story. Most people I've mentioned it to haven't heard of it yet; that's the media's fault.
      - AlbertCory 4y ago
        The book came out in 2019. The first WSJ story was 2015. I don't think the media turned into a mob until after the book, as you said.
      - kgwgk 4y ago
        I don't think most people would recognize Elizabeth Holmes or Theranos. It's not like it's difficult to find FTX in the news anyway. https://usatoday.com/story/money/2022/11/17/ftx-collapse-ceo-regrets-bankruptcy-filing/10720437002/ https://usatoday.com/story/money/2022/11/17/ftx-collapse-ceo... https://usatoday.com/story/opinion/2022/11/19/ftxs-collapse-warning-investors-excessive-risk/10719414002/ https://usatoday.com/story/opinion/2022/11/19/ftxs-collapse-... https://usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/2022/11/22/miami-dade-asks-for-right-to-remove-ftx-name-from-heat-arena/50965343/ https://usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/2022/11/22/miami-dade-...
        factsarelolz 4y ago
        > I don't think most people would recognize Elizabeth Holmes or Theranos. I tend to agree. I've never spoke of theranos or EH with friends or more specifically my wife. The other day she brings it up... "What do you know about Elizabeth Holmes? She just had a baby and is going to jail for 15 years" The pregnancy / child / jail is what made my wife interested. I told her that I didn't have much information on the subject other than the company said they could do x, pulled in a ton of cash, and couldn't do x. She then proceeded to watch every documentary / book / article she could find on EH and Theranos. It was the pregnancy topic that made my wife interested. Not the amount of money or fraud, pregnancy which is something she can relate to.
erehweb 4y ago
Lot of discussion on why not in prison in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33717992 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33717992
HWR_14 4y ago
In general, we don't put people in jail before they are convicted unless we think they will pose a further danger or flee. We wait until after they have been proven guilty to lock people up to punish them. He's already being prevented from leaving the country (note, the country is the Bahamas where he had been living for years). He doesn't have access to FTX's accounts. It seems like it's harmless to leave him out until proven guilty. The FBI and the Bahamanian government are still trying to figure out how to timeshare who interviews him when. The prosecutors are still working on understanding the full scope of damage done. Heck, there are lawsuits moving forward on where the primary forum for FTX's bankruptcy is, let alone who gets to throw him in jail first. Keep in mind that the CEO brought in to clean up after Enron was also brought in to clean up FTX and try to organize the bankruptcy. The first thing he said to the court was he needed more time because this has the worst books he's ever seen and he doesn't even know what FTX owns. Like, he cannot find the paperwork and is trying to reconstruct some of their ownership from "third-party materials". At least in the US, there are laws against multiple prosecutions. So if the prosecutors came at him with an easy case, they could accidentally give him immunity from the other related cases. So they have to build a big one before they actually prosecute. Imagine the uproar if he was prosecuted and punished for stealing $10MM and that kept him from being prosecuted for the rest of everything. Or if the prosecutors hinged everything on his cryptographic signed orders and it turns out the keys were taped to his monitor and, boom, reasonable doubt, so he walks. It takes time. That's frustrating. But that little bit more time now had better be enjoyed. He's not getting out of jail for decades once he goes in.
- mlindner 4y ago
  > In general, we don't put people in jail before they are convicted unless we think they will pose a further danger or flee. We wait until after they have been proven guilty to lock people up to punish them. We publicly crucify people all the time, even when no crime has been committed. Just look at the treatment of Elon Musk versus SBF. SBF commits likely crime, gets almost no negative press. Elon Musk buys a company and people go onto national news and declare that he needs to be investigated for every crime under the sun. If people were consistent I'd be more okay with how SBF is being treated, but they're clearly not. As SBF donated heavily to media organizations it's obvious that they're treating him with kid gloves because of those donations.

prepend 4y ago

He’s in the Bahamas so they’ll need to extradite.

polygamous_bat 4y ago
Let's hope he physically shows up at the New York Times dealbook summit [0] in person out of sheer stupidity and hubris and makes the job easy for the feds. [0] https://twitter.com/SBF_FTX/status/1595512579417378837?t=Mx-mbMKpkljtuSzmEjN4Eg&s=19 https://twitter.com/SBF_FTX/status/1595512579417378837?t=Mx-...

AlbertCory 4y ago

The wheels of the law grind slowly. Look at Elizabeth Holmes. The WSJ article that started her downfall came out in 2015. And she's still walking around free (for now).

SilasX 4y ago
Media isn’t the law and can be expected to grind a little faster. What were you responding to there?
nazgulsenpai 4y ago
Unless you wrote tornado.cash then they find you where you hide and jail you. Meanwhile SBF is walking around freely and giving interviews. *edit: phrasing
- polygamous_bat 4y ago
  Tornado cash was released almost 3 years ago. I would argue it took a lot longer than 3 weeks until its developer was arrested.
  - nazgulsenpai 4y ago
    Yes but it was only sanctioned a few months ago.
- AlbertCory 4y ago
  They have a saying about bank loans: If you borrow $100,000, the bank owns you. If you borrow $100,000,000, you own the bank. The bigger you are, the longer it takes the establishment to bring you down, if they ever do.
- HWR_14 4y ago
  > SBF is walking around freely and giving interviews. If I were the prosecutors, I would let him keep hanging himself with on the record interviews for as long as possible. Everything he says seems to make the case easier to win.
spamizbad 4y ago
Holmes is an interesting case because she got the opposite treatment as SBF: the press started running negative stories almost immediately while the tech industry was still neutral-to-defensive.
- kgwgk 4y ago
  “almost immediately” relative to when?
  - MichaelCollins 4y ago
    Once Bad Blood was published. It took a few years for the dam to break, but once it did the rest of the media piled on quick. The FTX dam broke a few weeks ago and so far the media generally seems unenthusiastic about covering the story. Most people I've mentioned it to haven't heard of it yet; that's the media's fault.
    - AlbertCory 4y ago
      The book came out in 2019. The first WSJ story was 2015. I don't think the media turned into a mob until after the book, as you said.
    - kgwgk 4y ago
      I don't think most people would recognize Elizabeth Holmes or Theranos. It's not like it's difficult to find FTX in the news anyway. https://usatoday.com/story/money/2022/11/17/ftx-collapse-ceo-regrets-bankruptcy-filing/10720437002/ https://usatoday.com/story/money/2022/11/17/ftx-collapse-ceo... https://usatoday.com/story/opinion/2022/11/19/ftxs-collapse-warning-investors-excessive-risk/10719414002/ https://usatoday.com/story/opinion/2022/11/19/ftxs-collapse-... https://usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/2022/11/22/miami-dade-asks-for-right-to-remove-ftx-name-from-heat-arena/50965343/ https://usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/2022/11/22/miami-dade-...
      - factsarelolz 4y ago
        > I don't think most people would recognize Elizabeth Holmes or Theranos. I tend to agree. I've never spoke of theranos or EH with friends or more specifically my wife. The other day she brings it up... "What do you know about Elizabeth Holmes? She just had a baby and is going to jail for 15 years" The pregnancy / child / jail is what made my wife interested. I told her that I didn't have much information on the subject other than the company said they could do x, pulled in a ton of cash, and couldn't do x. She then proceeded to watch every documentary / book / article she could find on EH and Theranos. It was the pregnancy topic that made my wife interested. Not the amount of money or fraud, pregnancy which is something she can relate to.

erehweb 4y ago

Lot of discussion on why not in prison in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33717992 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33717992

HWR_14 4y ago

In general, we don't put people in jail before they are convicted unless we think they will pose a further danger or flee. We wait until after they have been proven guilty to lock people up to punish them. He's already being prevented from leaving the country (note, the country is the Bahamas where he had been living for years). He doesn't have access to FTX's accounts. It seems like it's harmless to leave him out until proven guilty. The FBI and the Bahamanian government are still trying to figure out how to timeshare who interviews him when. The prosecutors are still working on understanding the full scope of damage done. Heck, there are lawsuits moving forward on where the primary forum for FTX's bankruptcy is, let alone who gets to throw him in jail first. Keep in mind that the CEO brought in to clean up after Enron was also brought in to clean up FTX and try to organize the bankruptcy. The first thing he said to the court was he needed more time because this has the worst books he's ever seen and he doesn't even know what FTX owns. Like, he cannot find the paperwork and is trying to reconstruct some of their ownership from "third-party materials". At least in the US, there are laws against multiple prosecutions. So if the prosecutors came at him with an easy case, they could accidentally give him immunity from the other related cases. So they have to build a big one before they actually prosecute. Imagine the uproar if he was prosecuted and punished for stealing $10MM and that kept him from being prosecuted for the rest of everything. Or if the prosecutors hinged everything on his cryptographic signed orders and it turns out the keys were taped to his monitor and, boom, reasonable doubt, so he walks. It takes time. That's frustrating. But that little bit more time now had better be enjoyed. He's not getting out of jail for decades once he goes in.

mlindner 4y ago
> In general, we don't put people in jail before they are convicted unless we think they will pose a further danger or flee. We wait until after they have been proven guilty to lock people up to punish them. We publicly crucify people all the time, even when no crime has been committed. Just look at the treatment of Elon Musk versus SBF. SBF commits likely crime, gets almost no negative press. Elon Musk buys a company and people go onto national news and declare that he needs to be investigated for every crime under the sun. If people were consistent I'd be more okay with how SBF is being treated, but they're clearly not. As SBF donated heavily to media organizations it's obvious that they're treating him with kid gloves because of those donations.