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Why can that not simply be captured as a cost to the user at time of purchase? Why does it need to be a subscription? Why do they need a fucking green man (ci

Why can that not simply be captured as a cost to the user at time of purchase? Why does it need to be a subscription? Why do they need a fucking green man (circuit chip) in a car I own that obeys only their remote services to unlock this feature? Basically - Either I own the fucking thing, in which case I have all the keys, or I'm just licensing access. Let's not fuck around with this awful gray area where companies try to weasel out of consumer protections.

philjohn 4y ago
Because most people don't sit there doing 0-60 in 2.2s, but would like a car they don't have to drop off prematurely at the garage for a drivetrain overhaul?
lelag 4y ago
For sure if you own the car, you can modify it. Tesla has been doing something similar for a while on the extended range model 3 where you can pay a one time fee to get a boost in performance. Interestingly, there is a Canadian company that has reversed engineered what happen when it is unlocked and is selling a device that you plug on the car CAN bus and you get the same performance boost. They obviously sell this for less that what Tesla charges and as far as I understand, the only risk is that you might void your warranty if Tesla "catches" you doing it. So I kind of agree that it seems similar to getting a factory approved chip tuned. When you chiptune your ICE car, you will often pay several hundred euros for a shop with the right hardware to modify your car (and loose your warranty). In this case, if the setting change is increasing failure rate but your warranty is not affected maybe it's not such a bad deal.
m463 4y ago
> Why does it need to be a subscription? this is an attack on the used car market
- horsawlarway 4y ago
  Correct - In my opinion it's pure rent-seeking behavior. There is no benefit to the buyer, and it dramatically erodes the concept of the first-sale doctrine. It's quite intentional - it's bad behavior - I'd like it see it made fucking illegal as soon as possible. --- We're in this weird period where manufacturers have realized that software controls on embedded circuits allow them to retain far more control over devices than they should ever be given the right to have. The last stop on this train is clearly digital slavery - you own nothing, everything around you is a subscription or licensed access. The moment you stop paying - the device degrades, not because it has to, but because it's the stick they use to beat more money out of you. I want legislation passed fucking yesterday that states that I must be provided ALL of the damn keys to a device when I buy it. I don't give a fuck whether that key is physical or digital. I get them all, or the manufacturer gets fucked out of existence.

philjohn 4y ago

Because most people don't sit there doing 0-60 in 2.2s, but would like a car they don't have to drop off prematurely at the garage for a drivetrain overhaul?

lelag 4y ago

For sure if you own the car, you can modify it. Tesla has been doing something similar for a while on the extended range model 3 where you can pay a one time fee to get a boost in performance. Interestingly, there is a Canadian company that has reversed engineered what happen when it is unlocked and is selling a device that you plug on the car CAN bus and you get the same performance boost. They obviously sell this for less that what Tesla charges and as far as I understand, the only risk is that you might void your warranty if Tesla "catches" you doing it. So I kind of agree that it seems similar to getting a factory approved chip tuned. When you chiptune your ICE car, you will often pay several hundred euros for a shop with the right hardware to modify your car (and loose your warranty). In this case, if the setting change is increasing failure rate but your warranty is not affected maybe it's not such a bad deal.

m463 4y ago

> Why does it need to be a subscription? this is an attack on the used car market

horsawlarway 4y ago
Correct - In my opinion it's pure rent-seeking behavior. There is no benefit to the buyer, and it dramatically erodes the concept of the first-sale doctrine. It's quite intentional - it's bad behavior - I'd like it see it made fucking illegal as soon as possible. --- We're in this weird period where manufacturers have realized that software controls on embedded circuits allow them to retain far more control over devices than they should ever be given the right to have. The last stop on this train is clearly digital slavery - you own nothing, everything around you is a subscription or licensed access. The moment you stop paying - the device degrades, not because it has to, but because it's the stick they use to beat more money out of you. I want legislation passed fucking yesterday that states that I must be provided ALL of the damn keys to a device when I buy it. I don't give a fuck whether that key is physical or digital. I get them all, or the manufacturer gets fucked out of existence.