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One thing I know for sure is that the leaks concerning the US were real. That's the reason why Assange has been so relentlessly pursued by the US. US authoritie

One thing I know for sure is that the leaks concerning the US were real. That's the reason why Assange has been so relentlessly pursued by the US. US authorities aren't doing this for fun or when someone posts fictitious information that would give them no legal grounds for prosecution.

t0bia_s 4y ago
We know from history that a lot of government actions has no legal grounds whats so ever. I'm not saying that what you write is right or wrong. I just cannot prove any of leaks, you probably either. I'm just trying to explain you why there are people who don' believe in same things as you do. Or simply find out that information are irrelevant for them.
- jonathanstrange 4y ago
  That's not the whole story, though. If government employees with security clearance are reminded by their government that reading leaked documents constitutes a crime, as happened with documents stored by Wikileaks, you have good indication that the leaks are genuine. If leaks are not genuine, then governments simply say so and move on. They're not overly concerned with false stories, these are everywhere. It's not as if they persecute people who make up stories about UFOs in Area 51. They are persecuting Assange, however, and with an unusually malignant ferocity.
  - t0bia_s 4y ago
    Well they arrest Joerg Arnu for photos of Area 51 on his web, should we start believe in UFO?
    - jonathanstrange 4y ago
      No, because his photos present no evidence of UFOs whatsoever.
      - t0bia_s 4y ago
        If someone would manipulate images, would you believe in UFO?
        jonathanstrange 4y ago
        That's a deviation from the topic and completely irrelevant to this thread. Even worse, what falsified photos would tell me or not is also logically independent of my claim that his photos did not show any evidence of UFOs. Moreover, Arnu wasn't arrested for making up stories about UFOs, so the whole subthread is pointless and cries false analogy. We can safely close the discussion at this point.
        t0bia_s 4y ago
        So your analogy is simple. Leaked data are 100% true because government take action against publishing. There is no chance whats so ever that some of data could be falsified/manipulated, ie to deceive foreign intelligence. Correct?
        jonathanstrange 4y ago
        Wrong, of course, and I believe you know that very well and are trolling. I laid out how to use corroborating evidence to come to a reasonable conclusion about the authenticity of the data while you're just setting up a strawman argument. "100% true" What a nonsense and waste of time... And to continue the false analogy: Yes, I do believe Arnu made actual photos and not imaginary ones and that's why he has been arrested. I very much doubt he would have been arrested for publishing falsified photos of Area 51.

t0bia_s 4y ago

We know from history that a lot of government actions has no legal grounds whats so ever. I'm not saying that what you write is right or wrong. I just cannot prove any of leaks, you probably either. I'm just trying to explain you why there are people who don' believe in same things as you do. Or simply find out that information are irrelevant for them.

jonathanstrange 4y ago
That's not the whole story, though. If government employees with security clearance are reminded by their government that reading leaked documents constitutes a crime, as happened with documents stored by Wikileaks, you have good indication that the leaks are genuine. If leaks are not genuine, then governments simply say so and move on. They're not overly concerned with false stories, these are everywhere. It's not as if they persecute people who make up stories about UFOs in Area 51. They are persecuting Assange, however, and with an unusually malignant ferocity.
- t0bia_s 4y ago
  Well they arrest Joerg Arnu for photos of Area 51 on his web, should we start believe in UFO?
  - jonathanstrange 4y ago
    No, because his photos present no evidence of UFOs whatsoever.
    - t0bia_s 4y ago
      If someone would manipulate images, would you believe in UFO?
      - jonathanstrange 4y ago
        That's a deviation from the topic and completely irrelevant to this thread. Even worse, what falsified photos would tell me or not is also logically independent of my claim that his photos did not show any evidence of UFOs. Moreover, Arnu wasn't arrested for making up stories about UFOs, so the whole subthread is pointless and cries false analogy. We can safely close the discussion at this point.
        t0bia_s 4y ago
        So your analogy is simple. Leaked data are 100% true because government take action against publishing. There is no chance whats so ever that some of data could be falsified/manipulated, ie to deceive foreign intelligence. Correct?
        jonathanstrange 4y ago
        Wrong, of course, and I believe you know that very well and are trolling. I laid out how to use corroborating evidence to come to a reasonable conclusion about the authenticity of the data while you're just setting up a strawman argument. "100% true" What a nonsense and waste of time... And to continue the false analogy: Yes, I do believe Arnu made actual photos and not imaginary ones and that's why he has been arrested. I very much doubt he would have been arrested for publishing falsified photos of Area 51.