4 ms·

> What a horrible thing to do. His autism shouldn't give him a pass. As it was kind of explained that, 'trolls' are seen as cool in the online world and so he

> What a horrible thing to do. His autism shouldn't give him a pass. As it was kind of explained that, 'trolls' are seen as cool in the online world and so he emulated that behavior. In fact one could say he went to the extreme. But his understanding of the context and emotional impact is nothing compared to us on the outside. This isn't a case of him falsifying a condition to get off, this guy has his whole life documented with diagnoses. It's not a 'pass' but it's simply not the same situation and so it doesn't seem sincear to charge him as such.

Cthulhu_ 4y ago
It's an explanation, but not an excuse; he still did what he did. Do you believe he should be treated not compos mentis and have his agency taken away?
- q-big 4y ago
  Why do most people what they do? Because their are conditioned/brainwashed by school and society to believe in specific morals for their behavior. Similarly, as bilekas suggests, the fact that "'trolls' are seen as cool in the online world" gave this man an active feedback loop for reinforcing this behavior.
  - prewett 4y ago
    "Society made me do it"? He had no agency in this? Nobody ever told him that these sorts of things hurt people? Well, even from that perspective, "society" is giving him some strong feedback that this is not acceptable.
    - q-big 4y ago
      He is influenced by multiple feedback loops: one that is encouraging this behavior (from the respective website) and one that does discourage it. In this case, the former one was stronger. > Well, even from that perspective, "society" is giving him some strong feedback that this is not acceptable. With the same reasoning, you can argue that people in this kind of internet forums gave him a strong feedback that the "society" is wrong here.
cm2187 4y ago
Being a psychopath doesn't shield you from legal consequences, this is why those rules are codified in law and don't just rely on your own appreciation. Most assassins are psychopaths in one way or another. It might be interesting to study them but it doesn't mean they get a free pass for their actions.
- Scandiravian 4y ago
  Psychopaths are always dangerous and has a desire to do harm. They have no empathy at all. Because of this the currently only way to protect others from their behaviour is to incarcerate them People with autism are not psychopath and it's honestly insane to bring psychopathy into a conversation about autism as some kind of comparison Your lack of empathy and understanding for people on the autism spectrum is honestly scary
  - winReInstall 4y ago
    There certainly is a fascination with strong, reproduceable emotional reactions in some autistic cases though. They also seem to be fascinated by certain emotional reactions, that make no sense to them. They do understand that they hurt people, but the fascination of finding something adhering to rules, is stronger. @Scandinavian: Relatives of mine. One in particular, enjoys trolling me, and i sincerley hope its limited to me. Others might not understand the sense of humor, and it particular, the endless "reproduce" joke and reaction sequence.
    - Scandiravian 4y ago
      Who are they? What combination of symptoms from autism are you referring?
  - laserlight 4y ago
    > People with autism are not psychopath and it's honestly insane to bring psychopathy into a conversation about autism as some kind of comparison I don't think it's insane to bring the comparison into this conversation, because the behavior of this autistic person is clearly a psychopathic one, regardless of the intention.
zozbot234 4y ago
That was not trolling. Trolling is about riling people up in subtle ways that aren't apparent at first glance. This guy wasn't doing that, he wasn't someone playing gadfly in order to expose people's biases and hypocracy. He was saying really horrible, offensive stuff and nobody should get a pass for this.
- DaiPlusPlus 4y ago
  It’s no use trying to reclaim the term “troll” for the legends of Usenet: the word is now a synonym for a griefer, the contemptibles, FBI swatters, and so on. Defending the word can be misconstrued as defending the act. It’s not a fight worth having.
  - zozbot234 4y ago
    When someone is laboring under the misapprehension that online "trolls" are popular and committing very real crimes as a result, clarifying the history of that word is absolutely appropriate. That's the very opposite of defending cruel griefers.
ivanhoe 4y ago
> But his understanding of the context and emotional impact is nothing compared to us on the outside. Well, similar defense could be used for psychopaths as well, they too have a condition that prevents them from seeing or understanding the context and the emotional impact of their actions - but some lines have to be drawn somewhere. Society has to protect itself and innocent people who get hurt by these antisocial actions. In case of Brandon here no one got physically hurt, and the court should certainly see his condition as a mitigating factor - but you can't just completely dismiss the damage that was done and seriousness of his actions. Emotional traumas are serious deal too, and he, knowingly or not, psychologically tortured those families, causing them a great deal of pain. And he probably got some pleasure from it too, whether from the feeling of power or from the peer support and cheering, as he wouldn't be inclined to repeat it so many times otherwise...
- cassianoleal 4y ago
  My understanding is that psychopaths are well aware of the damage they're doing to their victims, they just don't care. I could be wrong though, but in case I'm not - these are entirely different situations.

Cthulhu_ 4y ago

It's an explanation, but not an excuse; he still did what he did. Do you believe he should be treated not compos mentis and have his agency taken away?

q-big 4y ago
Why do most people what they do? Because their are conditioned/brainwashed by school and society to believe in specific morals for their behavior. Similarly, as bilekas suggests, the fact that "'trolls' are seen as cool in the online world" gave this man an active feedback loop for reinforcing this behavior.
- prewett 4y ago
  "Society made me do it"? He had no agency in this? Nobody ever told him that these sorts of things hurt people? Well, even from that perspective, "society" is giving him some strong feedback that this is not acceptable.
  - q-big 4y ago
    He is influenced by multiple feedback loops: one that is encouraging this behavior (from the respective website) and one that does discourage it. In this case, the former one was stronger. > Well, even from that perspective, "society" is giving him some strong feedback that this is not acceptable. With the same reasoning, you can argue that people in this kind of internet forums gave him a strong feedback that the "society" is wrong here.

cm2187 4y ago

Being a psychopath doesn't shield you from legal consequences, this is why those rules are codified in law and don't just rely on your own appreciation. Most assassins are psychopaths in one way or another. It might be interesting to study them but it doesn't mean they get a free pass for their actions.

Scandiravian 4y ago
Psychopaths are always dangerous and has a desire to do harm. They have no empathy at all. Because of this the currently only way to protect others from their behaviour is to incarcerate them People with autism are not psychopath and it's honestly insane to bring psychopathy into a conversation about autism as some kind of comparison Your lack of empathy and understanding for people on the autism spectrum is honestly scary
- winReInstall 4y ago
  There certainly is a fascination with strong, reproduceable emotional reactions in some autistic cases though. They also seem to be fascinated by certain emotional reactions, that make no sense to them. They do understand that they hurt people, but the fascination of finding something adhering to rules, is stronger. @Scandinavian: Relatives of mine. One in particular, enjoys trolling me, and i sincerley hope its limited to me. Others might not understand the sense of humor, and it particular, the endless "reproduce" joke and reaction sequence.
  - Scandiravian 4y ago
    Who are they? What combination of symptoms from autism are you referring?
- laserlight 4y ago
  > People with autism are not psychopath and it's honestly insane to bring psychopathy into a conversation about autism as some kind of comparison I don't think it's insane to bring the comparison into this conversation, because the behavior of this autistic person is clearly a psychopathic one, regardless of the intention.

zozbot234 4y ago

That was not trolling. Trolling is about riling people up in subtle ways that aren't apparent at first glance. This guy wasn't doing that, he wasn't someone playing gadfly in order to expose people's biases and hypocracy. He was saying really horrible, offensive stuff and nobody should get a pass for this.

DaiPlusPlus 4y ago
It’s no use trying to reclaim the term “troll” for the legends of Usenet: the word is now a synonym for a griefer, the contemptibles, FBI swatters, and so on. Defending the word can be misconstrued as defending the act. It’s not a fight worth having.
- zozbot234 4y ago
  When someone is laboring under the misapprehension that online "trolls" are popular and committing very real crimes as a result, clarifying the history of that word is absolutely appropriate. That's the very opposite of defending cruel griefers.

ivanhoe 4y ago

> But his understanding of the context and emotional impact is nothing compared to us on the outside. Well, similar defense could be used for psychopaths as well, they too have a condition that prevents them from seeing or understanding the context and the emotional impact of their actions - but some lines have to be drawn somewhere. Society has to protect itself and innocent people who get hurt by these antisocial actions. In case of Brandon here no one got physically hurt, and the court should certainly see his condition as a mitigating factor - but you can't just completely dismiss the damage that was done and seriousness of his actions. Emotional traumas are serious deal too, and he, knowingly or not, psychologically tortured those families, causing them a great deal of pain. And he probably got some pleasure from it too, whether from the feeling of power or from the peer support and cheering, as he wouldn't be inclined to repeat it so many times otherwise...

cassianoleal 4y ago
My understanding is that psychopaths are well aware of the damage they're doing to their victims, they just don't care. I could be wrong though, but in case I'm not - these are entirely different situations.