3 ms·

I don't have any sources other than anecdotal, but I'm under the impression many are diagnosed with ADHD as a result of behavior shown in school. It's almost l

by mxkopy 4y ago

I don't have any sources other than anecdotal, but I'm under the impression many are diagnosed with ADHD as a result of behavior shown in school. It's almost like, ADHD is the disease you have when you're "unable to do consistent & focused work". Obviously medically it's some dysfunction in dopamine regulation, but how many underpaid overworked teachers/parents have access to equipment that would actually measure that? Maybe some kids are gasp bored in school, or shudder don't mesh with the thought-system of menial productivity the school -> work pipeline tries to instill. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Js4NiTFq9Pw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Js4NiTFq9Pw

eyelidlessness 4y ago
Speaking as an adult diagnosee, whose diagnosis had nothing to do with the behavioral problems in the DSM other than finding a way to fit my actual symptoms to diagnostic criteria, with a caring and mindful intake doctor and then a psychiatrist… I agree the diagnostics are unhelpful. I think takes like this are equally if not more unhelpful. I definitely struggled with boredom and didn’t mesh with the design of my educational programs… but I also struggled intensely with anxiety and depression, both very deeply rooted in my ADHD experience. I struggled with them for decades before I understood what my experience was and found helpful treatment. I may well have suffered a much less severe and much shorter time had I not had a parent who was just as dismissive of the actual disorder I experience. Your take is the same as the diagnostics: attributing it to externally observed childhood behavior that doesn’t suit adults. Meanwhile adults with undiagnosed and untreated ADHD experience higher anxiety and depression, higher suicide rates, higher rates of substance abuse. We’re permanently in a state of trauma. Instead of rescuing kids from symptoms assigned to them by adults, if you want to help kids with ADHD, help them have a voice about what they feel and need.
- mxkopy 4y ago
  The idea that an ADHD diagnosis can be a band-aid over a deeper personal or societal problem isn't a very unhelpful one, considering that it can reveal, you know, deeper issues. I'm not saying all ADHD diagnoses are false. My prescription will always be, do whatever helps you. If a kid says ADHD meds/accomodations help them with no problems, then I'm very supportive of continuing that. But if others have been on and quit the meds even before adulthood, and they still feel unable to focus/depressed/etc., maybe we should consider that the problem isn't in their body.
lghh 4y ago
But also plenty of them could eeeeek actually have ADHD.
- mxkopy 4y ago
  ADHD is relatively known, and the solutions for it are institutionalized. In the U.S. at least, people not meshing with society isn't a problem that's super well documented and no institutional solutions exist.
  - giraffe_lady 4y ago
    You think... "people not meshing with society" is a new thing you've just discovered? That needs more awareness? Rather than like, that's approximately half of what mental healthcare is, and "people not meshing with society" is known by dozens of different specific technical names depending on the details of what "not" or "mesh" or "society" looks like in any given case? This is embarrassing. One of the worst cases of HN "I just noticed something outside my field so it must be a novel insight!" I've ever seen.
    - mxkopy 4y ago
      > "people not meshing with society" is a new thing you've just discovered? > Rather than like, that's approximately half of what mental healthcare is > That needs more awareness? So you're saying mental healthcare (in the U.S., mind!) doesn't need more awareness, got it
      - giraffe_lady 4y ago
        If that's what you got from what I wrote I don't know what to tell you. Good luck out there.
      - anonymoushn 4y ago
        Can you sleep in awareness? Can you eat awareness?
giraffe_lady 4y ago
That's the second D. If it's not a powerful enough effect to disorder your life, or you've developed adequate coping mechanisms, the diagnosis isn't appropriate. You can have people with the same subjective experience, same "symptoms" and one can be considered to have adhd and the other not. If you change your life in such a way that the effects you have are no long disruptive to it, don't negatively affect you, it's not adhd anymore. What is a disorder or not is determined by the environment, not the individual. The social model of disability applies just as much to mental as physical.
- mxkopy 4y ago
  I agree, but ADHD has a purported biological mechanism that justifies its treatment. And ADHD meds aren't without effects

by mxkopy 4y ago

eyelidlessness 4y ago

Speaking as an adult diagnosee, whose diagnosis had nothing to do with the behavioral problems in the DSM other than finding a way to fit my actual symptoms to diagnostic criteria, with a caring and mindful intake doctor and then a psychiatrist… I agree the diagnostics are unhelpful. I think takes like this are equally if not more unhelpful. I definitely struggled with boredom and didn’t mesh with the design of my educational programs… but I also struggled intensely with anxiety and depression, both very deeply rooted in my ADHD experience. I struggled with them for decades before I understood what my experience was and found helpful treatment. I may well have suffered a much less severe and much shorter time had I not had a parent who was just as dismissive of the actual disorder I experience. Your take is the same as the diagnostics: attributing it to externally observed childhood behavior that doesn’t suit adults. Meanwhile adults with undiagnosed and untreated ADHD experience higher anxiety and depression, higher suicide rates, higher rates of substance abuse. We’re permanently in a state of trauma. Instead of rescuing kids from symptoms assigned to them by adults, if you want to help kids with ADHD, help them have a voice about what they feel and need.

mxkopy 4y ago
The idea that an ADHD diagnosis can be a band-aid over a deeper personal or societal problem isn't a very unhelpful one, considering that it can reveal, you know, deeper issues. I'm not saying all ADHD diagnoses are false. My prescription will always be, do whatever helps you. If a kid says ADHD meds/accomodations help them with no problems, then I'm very supportive of continuing that. But if others have been on and quit the meds even before adulthood, and they still feel unable to focus/depressed/etc., maybe we should consider that the problem isn't in their body.

lghh 4y ago

But also plenty of them could eeeeek actually have ADHD.

mxkopy 4y ago
ADHD is relatively known, and the solutions for it are institutionalized. In the U.S. at least, people not meshing with society isn't a problem that's super well documented and no institutional solutions exist.
- giraffe_lady 4y ago
  You think... "people not meshing with society" is a new thing you've just discovered? That needs more awareness? Rather than like, that's approximately half of what mental healthcare is, and "people not meshing with society" is known by dozens of different specific technical names depending on the details of what "not" or "mesh" or "society" looks like in any given case? This is embarrassing. One of the worst cases of HN "I just noticed something outside my field so it must be a novel insight!" I've ever seen.
  - mxkopy 4y ago
    > "people not meshing with society" is a new thing you've just discovered? > Rather than like, that's approximately half of what mental healthcare is > That needs more awareness? So you're saying mental healthcare (in the U.S., mind!) doesn't need more awareness, got it
    - giraffe_lady 4y ago
      If that's what you got from what I wrote I don't know what to tell you. Good luck out there.
    - anonymoushn 4y ago
      Can you sleep in awareness? Can you eat awareness?

giraffe_lady 4y ago

That's the second D. If it's not a powerful enough effect to disorder your life, or you've developed adequate coping mechanisms, the diagnosis isn't appropriate. You can have people with the same subjective experience, same "symptoms" and one can be considered to have adhd and the other not. If you change your life in such a way that the effects you have are no long disruptive to it, don't negatively affect you, it's not adhd anymore. What is a disorder or not is determined by the environment, not the individual. The social model of disability applies just as much to mental as physical.

mxkopy 4y ago
I agree, but ADHD has a purported biological mechanism that justifies its treatment. And ADHD meds aren't without effects