4 ms·

I was disappointed that there wasn't a clear successor to drywall coming. I'm not a huge drywall fan, but not for only the listed reasons. I hate that it gives

I was disappointed that there wasn't a clear successor to drywall coming. I'm not a huge drywall fan, but not for only the listed reasons. I hate that it gives you limited-to-no options to easily maintain, repair, upgrade or retrofit new utilities. It means a very messy and time consuming "cut, do work, re-drywall, tape, mud, sand, paint" process that is way too onerous for a lived-in house. I've long wished for a new system that was both cheaper and more convenient for the long-term owner, but there aren't any that I know of that have gained any real wide traction.

briHass 4y ago
As a DIYer that has done far too many drywall patches, as much as I dislike it, it's hard to imagine something easier and/or better. Most of the time, the vast majority of the work comes down to the painting part. The human eye is pretty darn good at noticing slight color differences and breaks in patterns, so any flat, smooth surface will show inconsistencies in paint color from the natural fading/discoloration of old vs new paint. One could imagine a 'panel' system (like old school wood panels) that could be removed and replaced, but that would involve seams and fasteners that would need to be visible at all times. Even with wood panels or, let's say, plywood sheets, hidden fasteners would mean you're likely to damage the finish when removing it. Not to mention that it would require a regular pattern to (somewhat) conceal the seams of pieces. Drywall, on the other hand, is almost a perfect compromise. It's extremely inexpensive, very fire resistant, and with some practice, it can be installed and/or patched with simple tools to make seams almost imperceivable. What it trades in durability and strength vs something like L&P, it more than makes up for in ease of repairs.
- citrin_ru 4y ago
  > that would involve seams and fasteners that would need to be visible at all times Probably I have an unconventional taste but I would not mind visible fasteners at all (if they look neat i. e. not at irregular intervals/angles/depth). Moreover I perceive what would be considered an ideal drywall (flat, smooth surface) to be an imitation of brick/stone wall covered by plaster, like jewellery made from plastic with 'gold' paint - looks similar to gold but at closer look you can see that it is not the one.
- zihotki 4y ago
  To add to that, painting wall in patches will always be visible under certain circumstances. That's because paint is essentially a film you apply to a wall. Any new film will be on top of new one and no matter how you try the border will be visible. So in order to hide the repaired area well you have to paint the whole wall from a corner to a corner. And indeed there is no better general alternative for the drywall. If you replace it with any other solution like MDF, plywood, etc. the repair process will be still the same - paper, mud, paint. But the material will cost you much more. And those materials are harder to cut, you'll definitely need to use a saw instead of a knife.
- amanaplanacanal 4y ago
  Maybe I watch too much science fiction, but I can easily imagine a grid of plastic or aluminum panels which you could snap off when you wanted to work in the wall, and snap back on when finished. I don’t have a feel for if it could be done economically. It would certainly be a way different look from what we are used to.
  - 0_____0 4y ago
    There were briefly prefab houses built exactly this way. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lustron_house https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lustron_house
1MachineElf 4y ago
I very much hate dealing with drywall. Here are the things I use that help: 20" box fan with a decent air filter https://www.lasko.com/products/air-flex-air-purifier-and-room-fan-ff305/ https://www.lasko.com/products/air-flex-air-purifier-and-roo... Rigid shop vac https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/12-gallon-nxt-wet-dry-vac https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/12-gallon-nxt-wet-dry-vac Accompanying air filter kit https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/osha-filtration https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/osha-filtration Rotozip drywall bits https://www.rotozip.com/en_US/web/rotozip/tool-detail/-/rotozip-show-product/xb-dw2-drywall-bit-2-pc https://www.rotozip.com/en_US/web/rotozip/tool-detail/-/roto... I use a Milwaukee rotary tool with the Rotozip bits, but a lot of brands make equivalent power tools that are all essentially the same. The rotary tool embodies a big reason why I dislike drywall - the dust. The rotary tool fills the air with an incredible amount of dust, so I only ever use it with the Rigid vacuum in the other hand as close as possible to the cut. It is also loud and hard to control, but the advantage is unparalleled safety while cutting into the wall. It won't nick wires, and it won't cut into wood studs. When trying to cut along the edge of a stud, the rotary tool is how I start each cut. I'm also working out a pretty good technique for running wire through notched wall studs behind drywall. I haven't tested it fully, but it basically combines both of these techniques: https://youtu.be/Z2xR5YnIfGA https://youtu.be/Z2xR5YnIfGA https://youtu.be/EXhDlDBzXjY https://youtu.be/EXhDlDBzXjY
- bombcar 4y ago
  The rototool is nice but for a lot of drywall cuts I just use a drywall saw - it’s slower and doesn’t dust as much.
  - 1MachineElf 4y ago
    Agreed about regular drywall saws! Just doing it by hand seems to give the best results. Fancy tools help with ancillary things.
  - bityard 4y ago
    Same here, plus I use an oscillating tool for things like square holes for outlets. And a hole saw for round holes. I tried a rotozip once but never again, they are just too loud and messy.
bombcar 4y ago
Shiplap is the only thing I’ve found and even that isn’t cheaper. Maybe wood panels but those look so 70s. The real deal is to learn how to mud and sand well and then never patch a hole - just cut it back to the studs and redrywall.

briHass 4y ago

As a DIYer that has done far too many drywall patches, as much as I dislike it, it's hard to imagine something easier and/or better. Most of the time, the vast majority of the work comes down to the painting part. The human eye is pretty darn good at noticing slight color differences and breaks in patterns, so any flat, smooth surface will show inconsistencies in paint color from the natural fading/discoloration of old vs new paint. One could imagine a 'panel' system (like old school wood panels) that could be removed and replaced, but that would involve seams and fasteners that would need to be visible at all times. Even with wood panels or, let's say, plywood sheets, hidden fasteners would mean you're likely to damage the finish when removing it. Not to mention that it would require a regular pattern to (somewhat) conceal the seams of pieces. Drywall, on the other hand, is almost a perfect compromise. It's extremely inexpensive, very fire resistant, and with some practice, it can be installed and/or patched with simple tools to make seams almost imperceivable. What it trades in durability and strength vs something like L&P, it more than makes up for in ease of repairs.

citrin_ru 4y ago
> that would involve seams and fasteners that would need to be visible at all times Probably I have an unconventional taste but I would not mind visible fasteners at all (if they look neat i. e. not at irregular intervals/angles/depth). Moreover I perceive what would be considered an ideal drywall (flat, smooth surface) to be an imitation of brick/stone wall covered by plaster, like jewellery made from plastic with 'gold' paint - looks similar to gold but at closer look you can see that it is not the one.
zihotki 4y ago
To add to that, painting wall in patches will always be visible under certain circumstances. That's because paint is essentially a film you apply to a wall. Any new film will be on top of new one and no matter how you try the border will be visible. So in order to hide the repaired area well you have to paint the whole wall from a corner to a corner. And indeed there is no better general alternative for the drywall. If you replace it with any other solution like MDF, plywood, etc. the repair process will be still the same - paper, mud, paint. But the material will cost you much more. And those materials are harder to cut, you'll definitely need to use a saw instead of a knife.
amanaplanacanal 4y ago
Maybe I watch too much science fiction, but I can easily imagine a grid of plastic or aluminum panels which you could snap off when you wanted to work in the wall, and snap back on when finished. I don’t have a feel for if it could be done economically. It would certainly be a way different look from what we are used to.
- 0_____0 4y ago
  There were briefly prefab houses built exactly this way. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lustron_house https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lustron_house

1MachineElf 4y ago

I very much hate dealing with drywall. Here are the things I use that help: 20" box fan with a decent air filter https://www.lasko.com/products/air-flex-air-purifier-and-room-fan-ff305/ https://www.lasko.com/products/air-flex-air-purifier-and-roo... Rigid shop vac https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/12-gallon-nxt-wet-dry-vac https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/12-gallon-nxt-wet-dry-vac Accompanying air filter kit https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/osha-filtration https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/osha-filtration Rotozip drywall bits https://www.rotozip.com/en_US/web/rotozip/tool-detail/-/rotozip-show-product/xb-dw2-drywall-bit-2-pc https://www.rotozip.com/en_US/web/rotozip/tool-detail/-/roto... I use a Milwaukee rotary tool with the Rotozip bits, but a lot of brands make equivalent power tools that are all essentially the same. The rotary tool embodies a big reason why I dislike drywall - the dust. The rotary tool fills the air with an incredible amount of dust, so I only ever use it with the Rigid vacuum in the other hand as close as possible to the cut. It is also loud and hard to control, but the advantage is unparalleled safety while cutting into the wall. It won't nick wires, and it won't cut into wood studs. When trying to cut along the edge of a stud, the rotary tool is how I start each cut. I'm also working out a pretty good technique for running wire through notched wall studs behind drywall. I haven't tested it fully, but it basically combines both of these techniques: https://youtu.be/Z2xR5YnIfGA https://youtu.be/Z2xR5YnIfGA https://youtu.be/EXhDlDBzXjY https://youtu.be/EXhDlDBzXjY

bombcar 4y ago
The rototool is nice but for a lot of drywall cuts I just use a drywall saw - it’s slower and doesn’t dust as much.
- 1MachineElf 4y ago
  Agreed about regular drywall saws! Just doing it by hand seems to give the best results. Fancy tools help with ancillary things.
- bityard 4y ago
  Same here, plus I use an oscillating tool for things like square holes for outlets. And a hole saw for round holes. I tried a rotozip once but never again, they are just too loud and messy.

bombcar 4y ago

Shiplap is the only thing I’ve found and even that isn’t cheaper. Maybe wood panels but those look so 70s. The real deal is to learn how to mud and sand well and then never patch a hole - just cut it back to the studs and redrywall.