5 ms·

Maybe it has improved in the last 3 years, but that certainly was not the case when I tried it for my company. Fist, it was self-hosted, which adds monitoring,

Maybe it has improved in the last 3 years, but that certainly was not the case when I tried it for my company. Fist, it was self-hosted, which adds monitoring, security, and tech support. Second, its concurrent document editing was absolute shite.

Brian_K_White 4y ago
It's more than enough to build on. If a government simply decided that it was important to have ownership of their code and interoperability & future-proofing of their data & documents, then relatively over night any rough edges and weaknesses could be cleaned up. It's like saying a house is unusable shite because the sink has dirty dishes in it.
- Hnrobert42 4y ago
  But this is a government. Their operations, and the impairment thereof, affects millions of people. Further, they should be in the business of governing, not cobbling together solutions based on stackoverflow posts. Collaborative, concurrent document editing is a must-have feature, especially now with so much remote work. So it’s not just dirty dishes. A more apt metaphor would be a house where 10% of the time when two people enter a room together, they both lose their phones in the room, can never find them, and have to get new phones. I mean, I guess you could decide that outcome is better than a house in which 0.0001% of the time, the US government looks at the contents of the phone, but I don’t see why you would.
  - Brian_K_White 4y ago
    They can be exactly as in the business of governing while paying one set of programmers as while paying another. Try again. bonus try agains: And they have an obligation not to waste taxes on rent. And they have an obligation to transparency even if currently all fail to meet.
lrvick 4y ago
It has dramatically improved in the past 3 years to the point that I finally switched to it for my family and company. I balked at it for several years but honestly today it is good enough for music streaming, file sharing, collaborative document editing, photo management, contact management, calendar sharing, issue management, appointment management, etc. Also passwordless fido2 login.
- magicalhippo 4y ago
  How's the upgrade story these days? Some years ago there were a lot of scary stories about upgrades going horribly wrong due to DB changes or otherwise being non-trivial.
  - aborsy 4y ago
    Better, but just last week a test upgrade failed even using their own docker image and docker compose file. Why? Because you can’t upgrade between major versions. If you do, part of the software is upgraded and the rest is not. Now you can’t go back either, because the persistent config directory has been modified in the process. There are countless posts in forums about failed upgrades (including this). I have tried bare metal and docker, and the upgrades have failed once in a while. I am not sure if the snap version is any better.
    - magicalhippo 4y ago
      Thanks, that's just the kind of stuff that keeps me away. Life is too short for such shenanigans.
      - lrvick 4y ago
        Life is too short to put my data in the hands of third parties who will use it to target and manipulate me. Democracies require more decisions from citizens than dictatorships but freedom is worth a bit of thinking once in a while.
  - lrvick 4y ago

Brian_K_White 4y ago

It's more than enough to build on. If a government simply decided that it was important to have ownership of their code and interoperability & future-proofing of their data & documents, then relatively over night any rough edges and weaknesses could be cleaned up. It's like saying a house is unusable shite because the sink has dirty dishes in it.

Hnrobert42 4y ago
But this is a government. Their operations, and the impairment thereof, affects millions of people. Further, they should be in the business of governing, not cobbling together solutions based on stackoverflow posts. Collaborative, concurrent document editing is a must-have feature, especially now with so much remote work. So it’s not just dirty dishes. A more apt metaphor would be a house where 10% of the time when two people enter a room together, they both lose their phones in the room, can never find them, and have to get new phones. I mean, I guess you could decide that outcome is better than a house in which 0.0001% of the time, the US government looks at the contents of the phone, but I don’t see why you would.
- Brian_K_White 4y ago
  They can be exactly as in the business of governing while paying one set of programmers as while paying another. Try again. bonus try agains: And they have an obligation not to waste taxes on rent. And they have an obligation to transparency even if currently all fail to meet.

lrvick 4y ago

It has dramatically improved in the past 3 years to the point that I finally switched to it for my family and company. I balked at it for several years but honestly today it is good enough for music streaming, file sharing, collaborative document editing, photo management, contact management, calendar sharing, issue management, appointment management, etc. Also passwordless fido2 login.

magicalhippo 4y ago
How's the upgrade story these days? Some years ago there were a lot of scary stories about upgrades going horribly wrong due to DB changes or otherwise being non-trivial.
- aborsy 4y ago
  Better, but just last week a test upgrade failed even using their own docker image and docker compose file. Why? Because you can’t upgrade between major versions. If you do, part of the software is upgraded and the rest is not. Now you can’t go back either, because the persistent config directory has been modified in the process. There are countless posts in forums about failed upgrades (including this). I have tried bare metal and docker, and the upgrades have failed once in a while. I am not sure if the snap version is any better.
  - magicalhippo 4y ago
    Thanks, that's just the kind of stuff that keeps me away. Life is too short for such shenanigans.
    - lrvick 4y ago
      Life is too short to put my data in the hands of third parties who will use it to target and manipulate me. Democracies require more decisions from citizens than dictatorships but freedom is worth a bit of thinking once in a while.
- lrvick 4y ago