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I think this kind of energy crisis article gives a bit of a skewed perspective of SA. South Africa is still an absolutely brilliant place to live. I can say th

• pixelpoet 4y ago
  > Standard of living is very high. Yeah, if you're willing to look the other way and lock your car doors in literally the most unequal country in the world: https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gini-coefficient-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gini-coef... And since you're also a Saffer, I don't need to say anything about the daily threat from crime, and how everyone lives basically in a castle with electric fences. Do you have electric fences and private security? Of course, just like all the other white people in South Africa. Afrikaans was my first language, I know how it is over there. Sorry but I'm going to have to disagree about "brilliant place to live", having lived in so many countries (including Poland, Czechia, Germany, NZ, England, ...).
  • sgt 4y ago
    That's often the case - worse in the bigger places like JHB. No electric fence for us, but private security patrolling the neighborhoods yes (similar to ADT).
  • lelanthran 4y ago
    > Do you have electric fences and private security? Sure, but isn't private security and gated living (AKA security fences) becoming the norm in most of the middle-class suburbs in many other countries? > Sorry but I'm going to have to disagree about "brilliant place to live", Yeah, I wouldn't go so far as to call it brilliant, but my understanding is that, even if I move to another country, I'm still going to live in a secure place anyway, only it will be much smaller and more expensive, both at the same time.
    • ericd 4y ago
      Cape Town was absolutely gorgeous when I visited, but the level of fortification of normal homes was definitely striking, coming from the US. You don’t see a lot of cement walls topped with glass shards here.
      • nmfisher 4y ago
        Not saying you’re wrong, but I also see these in Singapore, which is one of the safest countries in the world (I’m guessing they must be left over from the 60s when things were more chaotic?)
    • TulliusCicero 4y ago
      > Sure, but isn't private security and gated living (AKA security fences) becoming the norm in most of the middle-class suburbs in many other countries? No. Even in the US, I wouldn't say gated communities are the norm, and at least from what I've seen of what SA houses look like, they're vastly more serious about security than gated communities in the states.
    • karp773 4y ago
      It must be more expensive for a reason, right?
      • lelanthran 4y ago
        > It must be more expensive for a reason, right? Sure[1], which is why I periodically check what standard of living I can expect if I emigrate to any of the countries I've visited. I'm frequently shocked that in places like the US it is considered normal to have a 30yr mortgage (I took a 15 year one, and am on track to pay it of in 10 years). [1] High level of crime, low level of service delivery, shortage of opportunities for my kids, etc. I'm not blind, you know.
        • damagednoob 4y ago
          > ...in places like the US it is considered normal to have a 30yr mortgage... Check the historical interest rates of the US/UK vs SA for why that exists.
  • doix 4y ago
    > and how everyone lives basically in a castle with electric fences. I feel like this is a huge exaggeration. I'm extremely far from an expert, but I'm in SA (right now) surfing and it's not that bad everywhere. Cape Town and the bigger cities felt like that, but I went through a bunch of small surfing towns/villages/suburbs and stayed in a bunch of places that didn't have electric fences. They did have a sticker saying they paid for some security company, but that was it. The inequality is absolutely disgusting though, I agree. It's such a shame, because it's such an amazing country. Staying here longer definitely crossed my mind, so I see what people mean by quality of life. The food is amazing, amazing surfing and hiking spots, amazing wild-life, the list goes on and on. I really wish it was possible to fix the inequality, but I can't even begin to imagine what that would involve. I did my best to tip well, but obviously that makes no difference at the macro level.
    • lelanthran 4y ago
      > I really wish it was possible to fix the inequality, but I can't even begin to imagine what that would involve. It's not possible to do that, because the government is fairly and democratically elected[1], and the voters who keep supporting this government are too short-sighted to see that trying to vote themselves more handouts doesn't work in the long run. [1] When a government stays in power for almost 3 decades, all the while being fairly elected by the voters, and the voters suffer because of it, who exactly are you going to blame? What exactly will you "fix"?
      • _carbyau_ 4y ago
        Education?
        • sgt 4y ago
          That is the long game, yes. Over time it's happening but tricky..
  • newsclues 4y ago
    You know there are parts of America with the same crime and wealth divide as well?
• jamiek88 4y ago
  >Standard of living is very high. Ignoring the obvious massive disparity you are glossing over here I have perhaps a less antagonistic question. Do you have to spend a lot on security? Some of these houses look like compounds with wire fences and huge gates etc. I’m remember the coverage of the Pistorious trial showing all that etc.
  • sgt 4y ago
    We just have an alarm system hooked up to a local security company (similar to ADT) which costs about $20/mo
  • lgleason 4y ago
    I'm currently looking a houses in South Africa (Pretoria East and the Cape Town Area) and can provide a couple of data points. In Pretoria I would only consider living in a security estate, Oscar lived in Silver Lakes which is one on the east side of town. All of these estates have walls, electric fences and armed security guards with access controls that require a remote or one time code etc.. Most houses inside of the security estates have very little if any security measures such as alarms etc. because the crime inside is generally petty low. These estates are very similar to US HOA's with architectural standards, many have pools, common ares, golf courses etc.. The levies (monthly fees) are usually between $58 and $174 a month. Taxes seem to run about $100 a month for a $260k house and in Pretoria that can get you a 400 square meter house on a nice sized lot with premium finishes and a pool. The Cape Town area seems to have higher taxes and what appears to be some community security that seems to even out to the same as what you would pay for a similar house (price-wise) in a security estate in Pretoria. The difference is that it appears that you can have enough coverage with cameras and beams in the parts I've been looking at, though many choose to have the electric fences for good measure and there are some security estates as well.
    • sgt 4y ago
      I'm in Cape Town area but I think you get more value for your buck in JHB and Pretoria, and also the weather is much better there.