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> After lugging around two fetuses that won’t stop kicking my bladder, I have no patience left for gender activists who pretend that men can give birth. Why do
by civilized 4y ago
> After lugging around two fetuses that won’t stop kicking my bladder, I have no patience left for gender activists who pretend that men can give birth.
Why does this woman's personal experience of pregnancy make her so offended by how other people who can give birth think of their gender?
I do agree with the author that the existence of trans people shouldn't mean we can't use the word breastfeeding anymore. But I don't think that's the fault of people who want to say that men can give birth.
Here's an idea - why not have resources with different language for cis women and trans men? Just like pages come with different language versions and you can switch in the nav bar.
This would also be medically helpful, as I'm sure the birthing experience is not identical for the two populations.
- peterpost2 4y ago
- rejectfinite 4y ago
- eganist 4y ago> Yes, just namecall :) hey rejectfinite, it's a representative acronym, not an insult. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TERF https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TERF
- rejectfinite 4y ago
- eganist 4y ago
- crooked-v 4y agoThe words "many" and "plenty" are sure doing a lot of work here, what with the complete lack of citations.
- rejectfinite 4y ago
- rejectfinite 4y ago
- eganist 4y ago
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- SamPatt 4y ago>doesn't deserve an audience Why do you get to make that determination? I can see the author's perspective. You don't have to agree with everything you read for it to "deserve an audience."
- bryant 4y ago> Why do you get to make that determination? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance I'm not making the determination. It's the only logical one to make if we're to live in a society that values tolerance as a first class citizen. Relatedly, there's a distinction between freedom of speech v. freedom of reach, the latter of which nobody has.
- SamPatt 4y agoYou are making the determination by declaring that this article is intolerant. It's a woman's opinion about how language is changing in ways she disagrees with. It isn't her advocating for hatred or violence.
- snoot 4y ago
- lando2319 4y agoSomeone who was born a woman, but now identifies as something else
- socialismisok 4y agoRight? She's a woman, which awesome... Women are cool. Some people who give birth aren't women. Those people are also cool, whether they are men, non binary, agender, or whatever else. Can we not just let people be who they are and recognize gender minorities do exist? Acknowledging the existence of trans men doesn't reduce the incredible experiences of any woman who gives birth (or doesn't!)
- rejectfinite 4y agoWhy design a society after the minority?
- knaekhoved 4y ago
- detaro 4y agoHow acknowledging a minority also exists "designing society after a minority"?
- rejectfinite 4y agoBecause changing the sites/books/medical language that EVERYONE uses is exactly that. I can "acknowledge" something, but I don't have to change anything.
- detaro 4y ago"designing after" would to me suggest solely focussing on, not also including. The same way that we didn't "design society after women" when they got voting rights.
- lostlogin 4y agoWhat size minority counts? Medicine has done a great job excluding groups as a large as ‘women’ historically. Still does in many areas.
- LawTalkingGuy 4y ago> Why does [...] offended by how other people who can give birth think of their gender? The steep and slippery slope from "not caring about what other women do" to "finding men, calling themselves women, in your space." https://fairplayforwomen.com/pronouns/ https://fairplayforwomen.com/pronouns/ It seems presumptuous for males to pressure or shame females for wanting to recognize biology and single-sex rights. They only recently won them after a hard-fought battle and obviously they need them; violent sex crimes are overwhelmingly committed by males, and overwhelmingly against females (women) and children.
- nicoburns 4y agoI think the best way to understand the sentiment behind this is: - This woman identifies as a woman on the basis of her physical body (giving birth being an example of an experience that she had in part due to the body she was born with) - For this woman, that's what being a woman is: when she describes herself as a woman then she means someone who has breasts, gives birth, etc. - If other people use "woman" to mean something different and more abstract/social, then it makes it difficult for this woman to describe herself as a "woman" and have it understood that by saying this she is talking about her body. - It may even be the case, that if "woman" means what other people want it to mean then this woman would no longer identify as a woman. In other words, she's offended because her own identity is being challenged.
- SV_BubbleTime 4y ago>If other people use "woman" to mean something different and more ephemeral I have not considered it on the context of time/ephemeral. I usually think of it as mutable, but your word choice brings up a point about stages of life I think is worth considering.
- nicoburns 4y ago> I have not considered it on the context of time/ephemeral Hmm... having looked up the definition of ephemeral, I don't think I meant ephemeral. I meant based more on the social aspects or a feeling of gender > I usually think of it as mutable I have increasingly come to think of it multi-dimensional (e.g. one can have physical sex, feelings of gender, norm conformity, political gender, etc, etc) all existing independently of one another. Whether those are mutable (and who has the power to mutate them) depends on the dimension.
- the-printer 4y ago> she's offended because her own identity is being challenged After going through the list that you’ve given, would she be wrong for feeling like that? Or is it just a matter of her feelings [1] being rendered incompatible with the contemporary milieu? [1]: Which per your list, sound legitimate irrespective of the tone of the article or her writing itself, I’m going to use your takeaways as a model for my questions.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- roenxi 4y agoShe explains in the "possibly be a placental abruption—but could also just be a fart" paragraph - her argument is that she is having a risky-and-possibly-fatal biological experience and thinks that the best health outcome will be reached if literature explains the situation in clear, commonly used terms that most people understand. It could just be rationalisation though. I'd expect people to be fired and/or called transphobic for making that sort of argument.
- watwut 4y ago
- roenxi 4y ago> Cause trans men are born with sake exact biology. Same exact pregnancy risks and then some additional ones. Can't trans men have penises though?
- klipt 4y agoNot at birth. They might have one added later on?
- slaw 4y agoAll penis transplantations were made to males. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penis_transplantation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penis_transplantation
- watwut 4y agoKinda. They dont function entirely like bio original ones. There are also detachable ones. More importantly, they were not born with those at all.
- bequanna 4y ago> They do however take issues with trans men existing and being acknowledged as such. sigh The arguments like “they are denying trans people exist!” and “this is causing violence!” are so over the top and tired. No one is denying trans people exist. We simply think that instead of changing the way we use language to fit <1% of the population, maybe when a trans person goes to the Doctor they can simply say: “I was born a (wo)man”