4 ms·

And God knows China is collecting all that important juicy information on teenagers' love for the latest fad ... Man the FBI acts like tik tok is used in jet p

by xwolfi 4y ago

And God knows China is collecting all that important juicy information on teenagers' love for the latest fad ... Man the FBI acts like tik tok is used in jet planes and nuclear power plants...

joxel 4y ago
Those teenagers will grow up to be the leaders of tomorrow, and shit they liked or interacted with on tik tok is blackmail material.
SkyMarshal 4y ago
There are at least three worrisome things that data can be used for: 1. Shaping and manipulating minds. Eg, show healthy, educational, intellectual content to Chinese users, and unhealthy, addictive, emotional, short-attention-span-inducing content in US and foreign markets (already happening [1]). 2. Train AI for analyzing and further manipulating foreign publics, or for providing strategic insight into political and election dynamics, making political and election interference operations more effective. 3. Collate data on individuals gained from TikTok with other sources like credit ratings agency breaches, OPM, etc. for their entire life, to create a continually growing lifetime data profile on every American, European, Asian, South American, African, etc. which may be used for pressure, coercion, or manipulation operations or similar. Think of it as "customer lifetime value" [2] for political purposes. None of which we want an adversarial, totalitarian foreign power to be capable of doing to us. [1]:https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tristan-harris-social-media-political-polarization-60-minutes-2022-11-06/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tristan-harris-social-media-pol... [2]:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Customer_lifetime_value https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Customer_lifetime_value
- rosmax_1337 4y ago
  I am worried that 1, 2 and 3 is already being used by the western governments to do the exact same thing against it's own population. The FBI is just jealous they didn't have the boot on Tiktok like they do with all other kinds of social media and websites.
  - SkyMarshal 4y ago
    I'm aware of that too, it's a problem, but the lesser one imho. At least there's some modicum of accountability with Western companies subject to Western laws, which Western citizens have some say in (if they get agitated enough at least), thus some possibility for reigning them in. There's much less or none with with Chinese companies operating in the West, and sending all the data they collect back to servers in China, under CCP "law".
    - rosmax_1337 4y ago
      I don't live in the US, I have no clear way at all to change how US government agencies deal with data gathered from citizens of my country. I can't even vote there, not that "voting blue/red" would change this mess at all. It can't be more than a week ago that we discussed here on HN a way that MS Powerpoint can leak your entire presentation to microsoft. Lots of people in my country use the entire MS suite, and I don't think the CIA/FBI/ABCDEFG should have our data.
      - SkyMarshal 4y ago
        It's not impossible for other countries to affect US internet companies. The EU GDPR is probably the best example. Once that went into effect, every website began showing popups enabling users to control cookie settings for that website, even within the US to US citizens not subject to GDPR. If there's a country or block of countries with large enough population relative to US, and where US companies operate, it can have some influence on US. That said, yes if you use FB/etc you should assume your data could be used by US intel agencies for similar purposes. Just don't use those apps. Heck, I'm American and refuse to Facebook or any of their other services (Insta, Whatsapp, Meta). None of this stuff is actually necessary to live a happy healthy life, and often even detracts from it.
        unity1001 4y ago
        > The EU GDPR is probably the best example And that's precisely why there is a trade war in between the US and Eu since early 2005. Because the Eu started making up its own rules and standards. TTIP, ACTA, PIPA were all attempts by the US to bring the Eu to heel. All failed. And voila - there is a proxy war that deprives the Eu out of cheap oil and gas, leading to literal deindustrialization of the Eu. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-03-09/european-industry-starts-shutting-down-as-energy-prices-soar https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-03-09/european-... Its not an argument for what you are proposing. Its an argument against it.
- imbnwa 4y ago
  >1. Shaping and manipulating minds. Eg, show healthy, educational, intellectual content to Chinese users, and unhealthy, addictive, emotional, short-attention-span-inducing content in US and foreign markets (already happening [1]). You mean China has regulations on how youths interact with the internet and the US prefers an on-going social experiment lead by sheer engagement numbers that will continue with or without TikTok?
- unity1001 4y ago
  > 1. Shaping and manipulating minds. Eg, show healthy, educational, intellectual content to Chinese users, and unhealthy, addictive, emotional, short-attention-span-inducing content in US and foreign markets (already happening [1]). That is happening, because the US audience is CHOOSING to interract with shtty content online. Actually, the majority of shtty content, from flat earth to Reagan being alive et al, come from the US. > which may be used for pressure, coercion, or manipulation operations or similar So Chinese government will coerce and pressure me to do what, exactly. Will it be any worse from the rendition flights of CIA. ... This sounds like double standards.
cscurmudgeon 4y ago
> Man the FBI acts like tik tok is used in jet planes and nuclear power plants... That is the only information that should be protected?

by xwolfi 4y ago

And God knows China is collecting all that important juicy information on teenagers' love for the latest fad ... Man the FBI acts like tik tok is used in jet planes and nuclear power plants...

joxel 4y ago

Those teenagers will grow up to be the leaders of tomorrow, and shit they liked or interacted with on tik tok is blackmail material.

SkyMarshal 4y ago

There are at least three worrisome things that data can be used for: 1. Shaping and manipulating minds. Eg, show healthy, educational, intellectual content to Chinese users, and unhealthy, addictive, emotional, short-attention-span-inducing content in US and foreign markets (already happening [1]). 2. Train AI for analyzing and further manipulating foreign publics, or for providing strategic insight into political and election dynamics, making political and election interference operations more effective. 3. Collate data on individuals gained from TikTok with other sources like credit ratings agency breaches, OPM, etc. for their entire life, to create a continually growing lifetime data profile on every American, European, Asian, South American, African, etc. which may be used for pressure, coercion, or manipulation operations or similar. Think of it as "customer lifetime value" [2] for political purposes. None of which we want an adversarial, totalitarian foreign power to be capable of doing to us. [1]:https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tristan-harris-social-media-political-polarization-60-minutes-2022-11-06/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/tristan-harris-social-media-pol... [2]:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Customer_lifetime_value https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Customer_lifetime_value

rosmax_1337 4y ago
I am worried that 1, 2 and 3 is already being used by the western governments to do the exact same thing against it's own population. The FBI is just jealous they didn't have the boot on Tiktok like they do with all other kinds of social media and websites.
- SkyMarshal 4y ago
  I'm aware of that too, it's a problem, but the lesser one imho. At least there's some modicum of accountability with Western companies subject to Western laws, which Western citizens have some say in (if they get agitated enough at least), thus some possibility for reigning them in. There's much less or none with with Chinese companies operating in the West, and sending all the data they collect back to servers in China, under CCP "law".
  - rosmax_1337 4y ago
    I don't live in the US, I have no clear way at all to change how US government agencies deal with data gathered from citizens of my country. I can't even vote there, not that "voting blue/red" would change this mess at all. It can't be more than a week ago that we discussed here on HN a way that MS Powerpoint can leak your entire presentation to microsoft. Lots of people in my country use the entire MS suite, and I don't think the CIA/FBI/ABCDEFG should have our data.
    - SkyMarshal 4y ago
      It's not impossible for other countries to affect US internet companies. The EU GDPR is probably the best example. Once that went into effect, every website began showing popups enabling users to control cookie settings for that website, even within the US to US citizens not subject to GDPR. If there's a country or block of countries with large enough population relative to US, and where US companies operate, it can have some influence on US. That said, yes if you use FB/etc you should assume your data could be used by US intel agencies for similar purposes. Just don't use those apps. Heck, I'm American and refuse to Facebook or any of their other services (Insta, Whatsapp, Meta). None of this stuff is actually necessary to live a happy healthy life, and often even detracts from it.
      - unity1001 4y ago
        > The EU GDPR is probably the best example And that's precisely why there is a trade war in between the US and Eu since early 2005. Because the Eu started making up its own rules and standards. TTIP, ACTA, PIPA were all attempts by the US to bring the Eu to heel. All failed. And voila - there is a proxy war that deprives the Eu out of cheap oil and gas, leading to literal deindustrialization of the Eu. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-03-09/european-industry-starts-shutting-down-as-energy-prices-soar https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-03-09/european-... Its not an argument for what you are proposing. Its an argument against it.
imbnwa 4y ago
>1. Shaping and manipulating minds. Eg, show healthy, educational, intellectual content to Chinese users, and unhealthy, addictive, emotional, short-attention-span-inducing content in US and foreign markets (already happening [1]). You mean China has regulations on how youths interact with the internet and the US prefers an on-going social experiment lead by sheer engagement numbers that will continue with or without TikTok?
unity1001 4y ago
> 1. Shaping and manipulating minds. Eg, show healthy, educational, intellectual content to Chinese users, and unhealthy, addictive, emotional, short-attention-span-inducing content in US and foreign markets (already happening [1]). That is happening, because the US audience is CHOOSING to interract with shtty content online. Actually, the majority of shtty content, from flat earth to Reagan being alive et al, come from the US. > which may be used for pressure, coercion, or manipulation operations or similar So Chinese government will coerce and pressure me to do what, exactly. Will it be any worse from the rendition flights of CIA. ... This sounds like double standards.

cscurmudgeon 4y ago

> Man the FBI acts like tik tok is used in jet planes and nuclear power plants... That is the only information that should be protected?