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Qatar Bans Beer Sales at World Cup Stadiums

58 points by samwillis 4y ago

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UncleEntity 4y ago
Even Utah changed its tune on alcohol sales when they hosted the Winter Olympics because they knew the international fans wanted what they wanted.
- vinay427 4y ago
  "Even Utah" seems to imply that Utah would be expected to have a stronger stance against the sale or consumption of alcohol. A cursory glance at the laws of both places, at least based on Wikipedia summaries, strongly suggests otherwise. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_laws_of_Utah https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_laws_of_Utah https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar#Law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar#Law Qatar: > In 2010, at least 18 people (mostly foreign nationals) were sentenced to receive between 40 and 100 lashes for offences involving "illicit sexual relations" or alcohol consumption.[125] In 2011, at least 21 people (mostly foreign nationals) were sentenced to between 30 and 100 lashes for the same reasons,[126] and in 2012, six expatriates were sentenced to either 40 or 100 lashes. > Alcohol consumption is partially legal in Qatar; some five-star luxury hotels are allowed to sell alcohol to their non-Muslim customers.[135][136] Muslims are not allowed to consume alcohol, and those caught consuming it are liable to flogging or deportation. Non-Muslim expatriates can obtain a permit to purchase alcohol for personal consumption. Utah: > A person must be 21 years old or older to buy or consume alcohol.[2] The Utah Department of Alcoholic Beverage Services (UDABS) has regulated the sale of alcoholic beverages since 1935, two years after the end of Prohibition.[3] Utah is one of seventeen control states, meaning the state has a monopoly over the wholesaling and/or retailing of some or all categories of alcoholic beverages.[4] Current Utah law sets a limit of 4.0 percent alcohol by weight (5% ABV) in beer sold at grocery and convenience stores and at establishments operating under a "beer only" type license, such as taverns, beer bars and some restaurants.[5] Beer over 4.0 percent by weight (5% ABV) is available in State Liquor Stores and Package Agencies and at clubs and restaurants licensed to sell liquor.
  - deleted 4y ago
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  - rjsw 4y ago
    The Utah laws you quote are from after the 2002 Olympic Winter Games. I was there a few years before that, you could buy 3.2% beer in a supermarket but for anything stronger needed to go to a State Liquor Store. The only State Liquor Stores that I saw were built like WWII Normandy bunkers, just to make it clear that you were doing something really bad by going there. From memory, you needed to get "membership" of any bar to drink there.
    - fullstop 4y ago
      In Pennsylvania you can only purchase beer and wine from a grocery store due to legal loopholes -- you're purchasing it from a restaurant physically located inside of the grocery store. We also, in recent years, permitted alcohol sales on Sunday. Also, anything stronger than beer or wine is purchased from a "State Store". We never, to me knowledge, had the "zion curtains" in restaurants. https://www.amusingplanet.com/2017/01/the-zion-curtains-of-utah.html https://www.amusingplanet.com/2017/01/the-zion-curtains-of-u... The joke in Utah is that you always invite two Mormons to go fishing with you, because if there is only one they will drink all of your beer.
      - rascul 4y ago
        > In Pennsylvania you can only purchase beer and wine from a grocery store due to legal loopholes -- you're purchasing it from a restaurant physically located inside of the grocery store. Not exactly. When I lived in Chambersburg (2014-2016), I purchased beer from the few beer stores around. In & Out Beverage is still there [0]. If I recall correctly, they were classified as a distributor that was able to sell cases to the public. If you wanted less than a case then you had to find a bar to buy it from. [0] https://g.page/inandoutbeverage https://g.page/inandoutbeverage
        fullstop 4y ago
        Sorry, I wasn't super clear, as my comment was in regard to the ability to purchase in grocery stores. There are licensed beer distributors as well. That is, the only reason why you can purchase beer in grocery stores here is due to a legal loophole. As of today beer distributors sell quantities smaller than a case. Shangy's is great if you are ever out this way again!
Am4TIfIsER0ppos 4y ago
tinus_hn 4y ago
Except for the FIFA officials’ booths, of course! There’s tiers to piety!
- duxup 4y ago
  Exceptions appears to be for all suites. Not that it makes it any better. When we built a new college football stadium in Minnesota a special liquor license was requested to allow selling alcohol in the suits. A legislator objected and gathered enough support to add on to the license that if they sold alcohol anywhere in the stadium... they had to sell it everywhere. The school stalled for a season, then sorta complied (hilariously tried hiding the beer sales in the back corners of the stadium), and finally relented and were one of the first upper division / larger schools to sell alcohol to everyone on game day. Visiting fans were shocked for for a couple years when they entered the stadium and folks were walking around with beer. Worked out fine, no noticeable issues associated with it.
rayiner 4y ago
- ekianjo 4y ago
- IfOnlyYouKnew 4y ago
  The NYT is reporting something that is happening. The main point of the article seems to be that this a change in policy at the last minute, something that tends to be criticized in most cultures.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- that_guy_iain 4y ago
  This one isn't so much a cultural difference but Qatar not doing what they said they would. They agreed to allow the sponsors to what they've paid to do and now a sponsor who paid 85 million(?) is being told they're not allowed to do what they've paid to do. This is Qatar not respecting the cultural differences they asked for come to their country. Drinking beer at the World Cup is a major part of the experience and the fans quite simply are getting screwed over. It's hard to think that this won't go down in history as the worse world cup ever along with being the most corrupt one.
- syzarian 4y ago
  It is possible to overall embrace diversity while at the same time finding disgust or problems with certain aspects of a culture. As an extreme example one can be against discriminating against Muslims and simultaneously find disgust with the cultural practice of female genital mutilation by some Muslim societies.
  - rayiner 4y ago
    I mean FGM is an extreme example. If it was just that, it wouldn’t come across as so disingenuous. But in practice it seems to reduce to dicing up a foreign culture and embracing only the parts that are consistent with your own. This is especially apparent with Islam, where some westerners claim to embrace it, but really only a Disney-fied version where e.g. hijab is a fashion statement rather than a symbol of submission. That attitude really stands out when confronted with Muslims who believe what Muslims believe, whether about intoxicants or gender roles or whatever else. Of course, zooming out, most people are ethnocentric and think their culture is better than other people’s culture. Most Qataris would say that about New York City. The difference is they don’t pretend like it’s otherwise.
mvdwoord 4y ago
Anyone who went there expecting anything else, deserves exactly what they get.
machina_ex_deus 4y ago
I feel like this world cup is going to lead to chaos in an unpredictable way. Taking international fans and putting them under strict no alcohol policy, and other weird authoritarian measures like no kissing in public is going to fail spectacularly. Not a matter of whether I think people should respect other cultures, it's a matter of knowing some people won't. They will probably instruct their local police to turn a blind eye. But if they don't, I bet this is going to lead to diplomatic crisis one way or the other.
- smcl 4y ago
  I think there'll be a few diplomatic incidents for sure - people will get busted sneaking alcohol and drugs in, many will be arrested for breaking various local laws. But I don't imagine it'll be too chaotic, I think it'll just be a damp squib of a World Cup overall.
  - thr0wawayf00 4y ago
    A recent Guardian report accused Qatar of physically abusing gay Qataris and recruiting them as agents to track down gay attendees of the WC[0]. These people had zero problem killing thousands to build the stadiums, do not underestimate their capacity for cruelty. 0: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/nov/15/gay-qataris-physically-abused-then-recruited-as-agents-campaigner-says https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/nov/15/gay-qataris...
    - smcl 4y ago
      Yeah read that, it's pretty horrific. I figured they'd probably manage to hold off now that the eyes of the world are on them - or I hoped at least.
- rayiner 4y ago
  When you go to someone’s home you follow their rules. And being thrown in jail for a spell would probably do some of these European soccer fans some good.
Tade0 4y ago
This is unfortunate because the relatively short duration of the event will make it impossible to concoct proper substitutes in time for the finals. To make matters worse, if nothing changed in this regard since the 90s, fresh produce are sterilized via gamma radiation, so they simply don't ferment. All in all, many hoops to jump through for prospective moonshiners. I suspect a black market forming there soon enough though - there's likely one in place already.
tweetle_beetle 4y ago
Hate to give them extra publicity, but it feels fitting that a certain UK brewerywith an animal in their name were virtue signalling with a billboard campaign about how terrible Qatar hosting the event is while being one of a small number of suppliers of beer to the Qatar government for hospitality.
- smcl 4y ago
  What could be more "punk" than being a hospitality partner for a gulf dictatorship!
- cormullion 4y ago
  A reasonable proportion of their marketing and hype is not based on fact. An BBC documentary ("Disclosure") examines some of their claims and finds them baseless marketing "spin", presenting "anti-corporatism" as a brand rather than a reality. But people want to believe...
- VoodooJuJu 4y ago
  >Hate to give them extra publicity, but it feels fitting that a certain UK brewerywith an animal in their name I appreciate your comment, but I'd appreciate it a lot more if you didn't pussyfoot with this juvenile he who shall not be named crap and just said the name. It shows respect for the reader by saving them time, not having to go detective mode searching for this "certain UK brewery with an animal in their name".
  - ChoGGi 4y ago
    BrewDog, I think?
  - tweetle_beetle 4y ago
    I'm not sure the rationale I gave is juvenile by any measure I'm aware of. It might not be to your liking and you're entitled to that opinion, but there's no need to be uncharitable.
erenyeager 4y ago
Amazing move for social, health, and safety reasons if true. A country does not need to yield these aspects of their culture for an international event. Actually it would help a lot for sports culture to encourage healthier forms of having fun.
- cjrp 4y ago
  Nobody forced them to host the World Cup
  - pjc50 4y ago
    They bought it by extensive bribery.
- dcdc123 4y ago
  It’s only for the poors. The suites and club level will still have alcohol.
- deleted 4y ago
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zarzavat 4y ago
If we are going to entertain the idea of a World Cup then we need to recognize that in this world there are many cultures with different norms. In some of those, there are strong norms against drinking alcohol, and in those countries football and alcohol is not an obvious combination like it is in Europe. When the US hosts the World Cup does anyone expect that they are going to be willing to suspend laws that other countries find objectionable, for the duration of the World Cup? Of course not, the US doesn’t give a damn what other countries think about it’s (sometimes peculiar) morality. Neither should Qatar.
- pjc50 4y ago
  This decision reversal should have been announced before Budweiser paid FIFA £63m for sponsorship. And ideally more than a couple of days before the event actually starts.
- christoph 4y ago
  The issue is they have done this at the very last minute, when alcohol sponsorship deals were already in place and many people have already bought tickets, hotels, etc. with clear messaging from the Qatari government and FIFA that alcohol would be sold at games. It's absolutely fine to ban alcohol, but they should have done it from the very start. They didn't because they knew they would struggle to fill seats. They have very clearly been dishonest. They are further angering people as the ban doesn't extend to VIP's, who will be able to consume as much alcohol as they want from their VIP boxes and seats.
- smcl 4y ago
  Nah not really. If you're going to host the World Cup you know that you have to cater for the visiting fans, the majority of whom are from countries where alcohol is no big deal. Qatar knew this, agreed to make some concessions to allow the sale of beer ... and then reversed. To be honest it's a clever move to do this at last minute because it's not like FIFA are going to halt it. I don't personally care what they do, I'll be watching in a Czech pub, drinking beer that's orders of magnitude better than Budweiser (likely Polička or Pilsner Urquell) and cheaper too ($12 @ World Cup vs ~$2.10-2.50) :)
zwaps 4y ago
I think hosting the world cup in Qatar is questionable. Next to the known issues that arose in the past years, even ex-ante Qatar is not a country with a meaningful cultural connection to Football as a sport. Of course hosting the world cup there is a farce from that standpoint. Football world cups should be hosted in countries where it's a cultural fixture and popular sport. HOWEVER, if you - as FIFA - decide to host the world cup in Qatar regardless, then you should absolutely conform to Qatar's local customs and laws. Qatar is a country where public displays of alcohol consumption, especially as practiced in European stadiums, are morally and legally not okay. It is up to FIFA, the sponsors and the guests to conform to that - as guests in said country. FIFA is free to hold the world cup in a different country.
- psychphysic 4y ago
  I'm ambivalent about the world cup in Qatar. I think it will be positive in encouraging loosening of the oppressive regime there. It's also unfortunately one of the more viable options in the middle east where football is THE sport of the people.* If no booze is served all that means is Muslims may be more comfortable attending. Who cares about alcohol anyways. * where else? Saudi? That'd be even worse. Turkey is ideal, but really cant afford it as inflation hits 85+%. Israel would be good but unfortunately most Arabs would struggle to travel there nor is it safe. Dubai/UAE might work, but ultimately have same issues.
  - smcl 4y ago
    You're right that Turkey would've been ideal were it not for the recent financial troubles, though I wonder if a big event like the World Cup could have eliminated or at least delayed this crisis. If you look a bit further afield than just the Middle East, Egypt or Morocco (or some dual bid) may have been good options too. I think you're right to discount Israel, to be honest not just because of safety and access issues but because it's a relatively small country that can't reasonably support stadia of the size and quality required to host the World Cup. They've three ~30k seaters which is ok but the rest are absolutely tiny - to be honest even the Greater Glasgow area likely has a better selection and there's not a hope in hell of even a Scotland bid (outside there's one >60k, three around 20-22k and a dozen more 10-19k). These smaller nations would do much better to submit joint bid - most countries can afford at least a couple of white elephant stadia if they don't already have a few bigger teams that could occupy them - but with Israel, I can't think who they'd host with.
psychphysic 4y ago
I've always wanted to go to a world cup and this might be my chance. Cause I'm not seeing this will be a popular event. For what it's worth I have absolutely no problem with Qatar saying no stadium alcohol. There'll be booze at the festival, on hotels. Alcohol is possibly the worst aspect of football. Worse than the silly diving. Qatar is the most viable (money meets opportunity, meets safety) option and will give the middle east access to the world cup which would not really be possible.
- Lapsa 4y ago
  wdym? rolling Neymar is the best!
- dagw 4y ago
  I've always wanted to go to a world cup and this might be my chance. You realise it's starting in 48 hours? Better hurry up and decide.
  - psychphysic 4y ago
    I'll be localish/regional first week of December. Depending on fallout I might be able to pop in with cheap tickets. :)
mavhc 4y ago
Wow, imagine watching soccer sober
FerociousTimes 4y ago
Awarding the World Cup hosting to an ultra-conservative and self-righteous country like Qatar that truly believes in their own sense of moral superiority and cultural supremacy was a big big mistake in the first place. I knew it early on that they would bait and switch but wait till the last minute before they go with the plan of imposing their religious dogmatic policies on victims, i.e. fans and visitors from all over the world. If FIFA was so intent on making history by awarding the WC hosting for the first time ever to an Arab or Muslim-majority country, they could have awarded it to the UAE instead, and they would have delivered a fantastic job honoring the traditions of past tournaments, and ensuring smooth and secure operations as well as a festive atmosphere for all involved, but they instead went with that fundamentalist and fanatical country of Qatar, and then they have the audacity to act all surprised when this crap happens.
- deleted 4y ago
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- Ekaros 4y ago
  Funny when you think about it. It is exactly that sort of countries that have gotten it. And next one is even more horrific than the previous ones.
  - akmarinov 4y ago
    Canada?
- psychphysic 4y ago
  > they could have awarded it to the UAE But UAE didn't bid? They did host this club world cup.
- thr0wawayf00 4y ago
  > If FIFA was so intent on making history by awarding the WC hosting for the first time ever to an Arab or Muslim-majority country, they could have awarded it to the UAE instead, and they would have delivered a fantastic job honoring the traditions of past tournaments, and ensuring smooth and secure operations as well as a festive atmosphere for all involved, but they instead went with that fundamental and fanatical country of Qatar, and then they have the audacity to act surprised when this crap happens. This is a great example of what corruption looks like and why it's so devastating to markets. FIFA officials took millions in bribes to sway this and the Russian WC without any regard for the outcome because they all got paid upfront. There was nothing altruistic about the decision to give it to Qatar. A major beer sponsor is now going to have to lawyer up and fans who have planned for this trip for years will not be able to experience it the way they want to.
whiskey14 4y ago
Those in corporate areas of stadiums at the tournament will still be able to purchase alcohol. That's all I need to hear, corruption to the end. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/63674631 https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/63674631
- deleted 4y ago
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ChoGGi 4y ago
Only thing worse then a drunk football fan is a sober football fan.
HelloNurse 4y ago
It's a swindle. I might drink some American Anheuser-Busch Budweiser (not to be confused with actual Budweiser) instead of good beer for solidarity.
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haunter 4y ago
>Those in corporate areas of stadiums at the tournament will still be able to purchase alcohol
miamibre 4y ago
Can someone explain to me how a independent third party like FIFA can be put on trial for corruption? I know that bribing officials and requesting bribes is illegal but if a government employee comes to you and offers you a trip to their country and takes you dining and wining that is perfectly fine. I ask because I am not sure what the solution is to "Cleaning up FIFA" they are a massive entity that is not really beholden to anyone because they are private and are just in the business of taking money from people to have players play more football. I'm very curious because most of the issues that sports face in the US is more about labor disputes / discrimination / cleaning up player's messes / hiding medical results that may showcase the sport in bad light which are awful in their own right but fall short of the massive amounts of money FIFA executives receive from countries trying to sportswash. Like many people the Russia / Qatar WC have been nothing short of eye-opening in terms of just how little FIFA cares about anything except raking in massive piles of cash that they use for some vanity projects here and there but mostly just to pay their executives.
Andrew_nenakhov 4y ago
Time for a Desert Storm 3.0. NATO should swiftly move in their fleets and troops to end this medieval tyranny.
- me_me_me 4y ago
  Not sure if you are serious or not
  - Andrew_nenakhov 4y ago
    All best jokes are only part jokes.
jemmyw 4y ago
Doesn't seem like a big deal as there's still alcohol available in other places. I think it's dispiriting that this is the issue that appears more important to fans over the circumstances of the bid win (bribery) or the human rights issues with the host country. Should the fans care? Well even at a shallow surface level yeah: I'm not a football fan but even I recognise that America or Australia, also in the bidding, being hosts would have been awesome by comparison.

58 points by samwillis 4y ago

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

Even Utah changed its tune on alcohol sales when they hosted the Winter Olympics because they knew the international fans wanted what they wanted.

vinay427 4y ago
"Even Utah" seems to imply that Utah would be expected to have a stronger stance against the sale or consumption of alcohol. A cursory glance at the laws of both places, at least based on Wikipedia summaries, strongly suggests otherwise. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_laws_of_Utah https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_laws_of_Utah https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar#Law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar#Law Qatar: > In 2010, at least 18 people (mostly foreign nationals) were sentenced to receive between 40 and 100 lashes for offences involving "illicit sexual relations" or alcohol consumption.[125] In 2011, at least 21 people (mostly foreign nationals) were sentenced to between 30 and 100 lashes for the same reasons,[126] and in 2012, six expatriates were sentenced to either 40 or 100 lashes. > Alcohol consumption is partially legal in Qatar; some five-star luxury hotels are allowed to sell alcohol to their non-Muslim customers.[135][136] Muslims are not allowed to consume alcohol, and those caught consuming it are liable to flogging or deportation. Non-Muslim expatriates can obtain a permit to purchase alcohol for personal consumption. Utah: > A person must be 21 years old or older to buy or consume alcohol.[2] The Utah Department of Alcoholic Beverage Services (UDABS) has regulated the sale of alcoholic beverages since 1935, two years after the end of Prohibition.[3] Utah is one of seventeen control states, meaning the state has a monopoly over the wholesaling and/or retailing of some or all categories of alcoholic beverages.[4] Current Utah law sets a limit of 4.0 percent alcohol by weight (5% ABV) in beer sold at grocery and convenience stores and at establishments operating under a "beer only" type license, such as taverns, beer bars and some restaurants.[5] Beer over 4.0 percent by weight (5% ABV) is available in State Liquor Stores and Package Agencies and at clubs and restaurants licensed to sell liquor.
- deleted 4y ago
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- rjsw 4y ago
  The Utah laws you quote are from after the 2002 Olympic Winter Games. I was there a few years before that, you could buy 3.2% beer in a supermarket but for anything stronger needed to go to a State Liquor Store. The only State Liquor Stores that I saw were built like WWII Normandy bunkers, just to make it clear that you were doing something really bad by going there. From memory, you needed to get "membership" of any bar to drink there.
  - fullstop 4y ago
    In Pennsylvania you can only purchase beer and wine from a grocery store due to legal loopholes -- you're purchasing it from a restaurant physically located inside of the grocery store. We also, in recent years, permitted alcohol sales on Sunday. Also, anything stronger than beer or wine is purchased from a "State Store". We never, to me knowledge, had the "zion curtains" in restaurants. https://www.amusingplanet.com/2017/01/the-zion-curtains-of-utah.html https://www.amusingplanet.com/2017/01/the-zion-curtains-of-u... The joke in Utah is that you always invite two Mormons to go fishing with you, because if there is only one they will drink all of your beer.
    - rascul 4y ago
      > In Pennsylvania you can only purchase beer and wine from a grocery store due to legal loopholes -- you're purchasing it from a restaurant physically located inside of the grocery store. Not exactly. When I lived in Chambersburg (2014-2016), I purchased beer from the few beer stores around. In & Out Beverage is still there [0]. If I recall correctly, they were classified as a distributor that was able to sell cases to the public. If you wanted less than a case then you had to find a bar to buy it from. [0] https://g.page/inandoutbeverage https://g.page/inandoutbeverage
      - fullstop 4y ago
        Sorry, I wasn't super clear, as my comment was in regard to the ability to purchase in grocery stores. There are licensed beer distributors as well. That is, the only reason why you can purchase beer in grocery stores here is due to a legal loophole. As of today beer distributors sell quantities smaller than a case. Shangy's is great if you are ever out this way again!

Am4TIfIsER0ppos 4y ago

tinus_hn 4y ago

Except for the FIFA officials’ booths, of course! There’s tiers to piety!

duxup 4y ago
Exceptions appears to be for all suites. Not that it makes it any better. When we built a new college football stadium in Minnesota a special liquor license was requested to allow selling alcohol in the suits. A legislator objected and gathered enough support to add on to the license that if they sold alcohol anywhere in the stadium... they had to sell it everywhere. The school stalled for a season, then sorta complied (hilariously tried hiding the beer sales in the back corners of the stadium), and finally relented and were one of the first upper division / larger schools to sell alcohol to everyone on game day. Visiting fans were shocked for for a couple years when they entered the stadium and folks were walking around with beer. Worked out fine, no noticeable issues associated with it.

rayiner 4y ago

ekianjo 4y ago
IfOnlyYouKnew 4y ago
The NYT is reporting something that is happening. The main point of the article seems to be that this a change in policy at the last minute, something that tends to be criticized in most cultures.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
that_guy_iain 4y ago
This one isn't so much a cultural difference but Qatar not doing what they said they would. They agreed to allow the sponsors to what they've paid to do and now a sponsor who paid 85 million(?) is being told they're not allowed to do what they've paid to do. This is Qatar not respecting the cultural differences they asked for come to their country. Drinking beer at the World Cup is a major part of the experience and the fans quite simply are getting screwed over. It's hard to think that this won't go down in history as the worse world cup ever along with being the most corrupt one.
syzarian 4y ago
It is possible to overall embrace diversity while at the same time finding disgust or problems with certain aspects of a culture. As an extreme example one can be against discriminating against Muslims and simultaneously find disgust with the cultural practice of female genital mutilation by some Muslim societies.
- rayiner 4y ago
  I mean FGM is an extreme example. If it was just that, it wouldn’t come across as so disingenuous. But in practice it seems to reduce to dicing up a foreign culture and embracing only the parts that are consistent with your own. This is especially apparent with Islam, where some westerners claim to embrace it, but really only a Disney-fied version where e.g. hijab is a fashion statement rather than a symbol of submission. That attitude really stands out when confronted with Muslims who believe what Muslims believe, whether about intoxicants or gender roles or whatever else. Of course, zooming out, most people are ethnocentric and think their culture is better than other people’s culture. Most Qataris would say that about New York City. The difference is they don’t pretend like it’s otherwise.

mvdwoord 4y ago

Anyone who went there expecting anything else, deserves exactly what they get.

machina_ex_deus 4y ago

I feel like this world cup is going to lead to chaos in an unpredictable way. Taking international fans and putting them under strict no alcohol policy, and other weird authoritarian measures like no kissing in public is going to fail spectacularly. Not a matter of whether I think people should respect other cultures, it's a matter of knowing some people won't. They will probably instruct their local police to turn a blind eye. But if they don't, I bet this is going to lead to diplomatic crisis one way or the other.

smcl 4y ago
I think there'll be a few diplomatic incidents for sure - people will get busted sneaking alcohol and drugs in, many will be arrested for breaking various local laws. But I don't imagine it'll be too chaotic, I think it'll just be a damp squib of a World Cup overall.
- thr0wawayf00 4y ago
  A recent Guardian report accused Qatar of physically abusing gay Qataris and recruiting them as agents to track down gay attendees of the WC[0]. These people had zero problem killing thousands to build the stadiums, do not underestimate their capacity for cruelty. 0: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/nov/15/gay-qataris-physically-abused-then-recruited-as-agents-campaigner-says https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/nov/15/gay-qataris...
  - smcl 4y ago
    Yeah read that, it's pretty horrific. I figured they'd probably manage to hold off now that the eyes of the world are on them - or I hoped at least.
rayiner 4y ago
When you go to someone’s home you follow their rules. And being thrown in jail for a spell would probably do some of these European soccer fans some good.

Tade0 4y ago

This is unfortunate because the relatively short duration of the event will make it impossible to concoct proper substitutes in time for the finals. To make matters worse, if nothing changed in this regard since the 90s, fresh produce are sterilized via gamma radiation, so they simply don't ferment. All in all, many hoops to jump through for prospective moonshiners. I suspect a black market forming there soon enough though - there's likely one in place already.

tweetle_beetle 4y ago

Hate to give them extra publicity, but it feels fitting that a certain UK brewerywith an animal in their name were virtue signalling with a billboard campaign about how terrible Qatar hosting the event is while being one of a small number of suppliers of beer to the Qatar government for hospitality.

smcl 4y ago
What could be more "punk" than being a hospitality partner for a gulf dictatorship!
cormullion 4y ago
A reasonable proportion of their marketing and hype is not based on fact. An BBC documentary ("Disclosure") examines some of their claims and finds them baseless marketing "spin", presenting "anti-corporatism" as a brand rather than a reality. But people want to believe...
VoodooJuJu 4y ago
>Hate to give them extra publicity, but it feels fitting that a certain UK brewerywith an animal in their name I appreciate your comment, but I'd appreciate it a lot more if you didn't pussyfoot with this juvenile he who shall not be named crap and just said the name. It shows respect for the reader by saving them time, not having to go detective mode searching for this "certain UK brewery with an animal in their name".
- ChoGGi 4y ago
  BrewDog, I think?
- tweetle_beetle 4y ago
  I'm not sure the rationale I gave is juvenile by any measure I'm aware of. It might not be to your liking and you're entitled to that opinion, but there's no need to be uncharitable.

erenyeager 4y ago

Amazing move for social, health, and safety reasons if true. A country does not need to yield these aspects of their culture for an international event. Actually it would help a lot for sports culture to encourage healthier forms of having fun.

cjrp 4y ago
Nobody forced them to host the World Cup
- pjc50 4y ago
  They bought it by extensive bribery.
dcdc123 4y ago
It’s only for the poors. The suites and club level will still have alcohol.
deleted 4y ago
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zarzavat 4y ago

If we are going to entertain the idea of a World Cup then we need to recognize that in this world there are many cultures with different norms. In some of those, there are strong norms against drinking alcohol, and in those countries football and alcohol is not an obvious combination like it is in Europe. When the US hosts the World Cup does anyone expect that they are going to be willing to suspend laws that other countries find objectionable, for the duration of the World Cup? Of course not, the US doesn’t give a damn what other countries think about it’s (sometimes peculiar) morality. Neither should Qatar.

pjc50 4y ago
This decision reversal should have been announced before Budweiser paid FIFA £63m for sponsorship. And ideally more than a couple of days before the event actually starts.
christoph 4y ago
The issue is they have done this at the very last minute, when alcohol sponsorship deals were already in place and many people have already bought tickets, hotels, etc. with clear messaging from the Qatari government and FIFA that alcohol would be sold at games. It's absolutely fine to ban alcohol, but they should have done it from the very start. They didn't because they knew they would struggle to fill seats. They have very clearly been dishonest. They are further angering people as the ban doesn't extend to VIP's, who will be able to consume as much alcohol as they want from their VIP boxes and seats.
smcl 4y ago
Nah not really. If you're going to host the World Cup you know that you have to cater for the visiting fans, the majority of whom are from countries where alcohol is no big deal. Qatar knew this, agreed to make some concessions to allow the sale of beer ... and then reversed. To be honest it's a clever move to do this at last minute because it's not like FIFA are going to halt it. I don't personally care what they do, I'll be watching in a Czech pub, drinking beer that's orders of magnitude better than Budweiser (likely Polička or Pilsner Urquell) and cheaper too ($12 @ World Cup vs ~$2.10-2.50) :)

zwaps 4y ago

I think hosting the world cup in Qatar is questionable. Next to the known issues that arose in the past years, even ex-ante Qatar is not a country with a meaningful cultural connection to Football as a sport. Of course hosting the world cup there is a farce from that standpoint. Football world cups should be hosted in countries where it's a cultural fixture and popular sport. HOWEVER, if you - as FIFA - decide to host the world cup in Qatar regardless, then you should absolutely conform to Qatar's local customs and laws. Qatar is a country where public displays of alcohol consumption, especially as practiced in European stadiums, are morally and legally not okay. It is up to FIFA, the sponsors and the guests to conform to that - as guests in said country. FIFA is free to hold the world cup in a different country.

psychphysic 4y ago
I'm ambivalent about the world cup in Qatar. I think it will be positive in encouraging loosening of the oppressive regime there. It's also unfortunately one of the more viable options in the middle east where football is THE sport of the people.* If no booze is served all that means is Muslims may be more comfortable attending. Who cares about alcohol anyways. * where else? Saudi? That'd be even worse. Turkey is ideal, but really cant afford it as inflation hits 85+%. Israel would be good but unfortunately most Arabs would struggle to travel there nor is it safe. Dubai/UAE might work, but ultimately have same issues.
- smcl 4y ago
  You're right that Turkey would've been ideal were it not for the recent financial troubles, though I wonder if a big event like the World Cup could have eliminated or at least delayed this crisis. If you look a bit further afield than just the Middle East, Egypt or Morocco (or some dual bid) may have been good options too. I think you're right to discount Israel, to be honest not just because of safety and access issues but because it's a relatively small country that can't reasonably support stadia of the size and quality required to host the World Cup. They've three ~30k seaters which is ok but the rest are absolutely tiny - to be honest even the Greater Glasgow area likely has a better selection and there's not a hope in hell of even a Scotland bid (outside there's one >60k, three around 20-22k and a dozen more 10-19k). These smaller nations would do much better to submit joint bid - most countries can afford at least a couple of white elephant stadia if they don't already have a few bigger teams that could occupy them - but with Israel, I can't think who they'd host with.

psychphysic 4y ago

I've always wanted to go to a world cup and this might be my chance. Cause I'm not seeing this will be a popular event. For what it's worth I have absolutely no problem with Qatar saying no stadium alcohol. There'll be booze at the festival, on hotels. Alcohol is possibly the worst aspect of football. Worse than the silly diving. Qatar is the most viable (money meets opportunity, meets safety) option and will give the middle east access to the world cup which would not really be possible.

Lapsa 4y ago
wdym? rolling Neymar is the best!
dagw 4y ago
I've always wanted to go to a world cup and this might be my chance. You realise it's starting in 48 hours? Better hurry up and decide.
- psychphysic 4y ago
  I'll be localish/regional first week of December. Depending on fallout I might be able to pop in with cheap tickets. :)

mavhc 4y ago

Wow, imagine watching soccer sober

FerociousTimes 4y ago

Awarding the World Cup hosting to an ultra-conservative and self-righteous country like Qatar that truly believes in their own sense of moral superiority and cultural supremacy was a big big mistake in the first place. I knew it early on that they would bait and switch but wait till the last minute before they go with the plan of imposing their religious dogmatic policies on victims, i.e. fans and visitors from all over the world. If FIFA was so intent on making history by awarding the WC hosting for the first time ever to an Arab or Muslim-majority country, they could have awarded it to the UAE instead, and they would have delivered a fantastic job honoring the traditions of past tournaments, and ensuring smooth and secure operations as well as a festive atmosphere for all involved, but they instead went with that fundamentalist and fanatical country of Qatar, and then they have the audacity to act all surprised when this crap happens.

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Ekaros 4y ago
Funny when you think about it. It is exactly that sort of countries that have gotten it. And next one is even more horrific than the previous ones.
- akmarinov 4y ago
  Canada?
psychphysic 4y ago
> they could have awarded it to the UAE But UAE didn't bid? They did host this club world cup.
thr0wawayf00 4y ago
> If FIFA was so intent on making history by awarding the WC hosting for the first time ever to an Arab or Muslim-majority country, they could have awarded it to the UAE instead, and they would have delivered a fantastic job honoring the traditions of past tournaments, and ensuring smooth and secure operations as well as a festive atmosphere for all involved, but they instead went with that fundamental and fanatical country of Qatar, and then they have the audacity to act surprised when this crap happens. This is a great example of what corruption looks like and why it's so devastating to markets. FIFA officials took millions in bribes to sway this and the Russian WC without any regard for the outcome because they all got paid upfront. There was nothing altruistic about the decision to give it to Qatar. A major beer sponsor is now going to have to lawyer up and fans who have planned for this trip for years will not be able to experience it the way they want to.

whiskey14 4y ago

Those in corporate areas of stadiums at the tournament will still be able to purchase alcohol. That's all I need to hear, corruption to the end. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/63674631 https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/63674631

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ChoGGi 4y ago

Only thing worse then a drunk football fan is a sober football fan.

HelloNurse 4y ago

It's a swindle. I might drink some American Anheuser-Busch Budweiser (not to be confused with actual Budweiser) instead of good beer for solidarity.

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haunter 4y ago

>Those in corporate areas of stadiums at the tournament will still be able to purchase alcohol

miamibre 4y ago

Can someone explain to me how a independent third party like FIFA can be put on trial for corruption? I know that bribing officials and requesting bribes is illegal but if a government employee comes to you and offers you a trip to their country and takes you dining and wining that is perfectly fine. I ask because I am not sure what the solution is to "Cleaning up FIFA" they are a massive entity that is not really beholden to anyone because they are private and are just in the business of taking money from people to have players play more football. I'm very curious because most of the issues that sports face in the US is more about labor disputes / discrimination / cleaning up player's messes / hiding medical results that may showcase the sport in bad light which are awful in their own right but fall short of the massive amounts of money FIFA executives receive from countries trying to sportswash. Like many people the Russia / Qatar WC have been nothing short of eye-opening in terms of just how little FIFA cares about anything except raking in massive piles of cash that they use for some vanity projects here and there but mostly just to pay their executives.

Andrew_nenakhov 4y ago

Time for a Desert Storm 3.0. NATO should swiftly move in their fleets and troops to end this medieval tyranny.

me_me_me 4y ago
Not sure if you are serious or not
- Andrew_nenakhov 4y ago
  All best jokes are only part jokes.

jemmyw 4y ago

Doesn't seem like a big deal as there's still alcohol available in other places. I think it's dispiriting that this is the issue that appears more important to fans over the circumstances of the bid win (bribery) or the human rights issues with the host country. Should the fans care? Well even at a shallow surface level yeah: I'm not a football fan but even I recognise that America or Australia, also in the bidding, being hosts would have been awesome by comparison.