3 ms·

I don’t really understand your dilemma. Why are drummers not musicians?

bmacho 4y ago
I guess GP sat down, and thought about it. I do that myself time to time, then I realize that despite to my best efforts I can't defend some common sense ideas, and must accept it as false. Usually hard to even explain. .. just think about it with an open mind, or try to even defend that drummers are musicians. I think most definitions of musicians don't include drummers much more than the costume designers or the publishers. (They work in the music industry, make music better, but can't and don't create music themselves alone.) I lean towards that they are not musicians. Also if GGGP doesn't classify hiphop or rap as music, then the "but the drummers are usually classified as musicians too" argument doesn't work on many levels.
- midoridensha 4y ago
  I'd call drummers "musicians" because the drums (which have rhythm) are a necessary part of the musical composition, and the drummer is performing that integral part of the music. What's harder to decide, IMO, is whether a drum solo really constitutes "music". If rap isn't music, then is a drum solo also not music? Personally, I can't stand most rap, but I also get bored with drum solos and usually skip them, even if I otherwise really love the drum parts of the band's other songs.
  - bazoom42 4y ago
    > What's harder to decide, IMO, is whether a drum solo really constitutes "music". That is not hard to decide. Of course a drum solo is music.
  - wahnfrieden 4y ago
    your enjoyment as an individual has nothing to do with musicality but portraying them as related does display reactionary tendencies
    - midoridensha 4y ago
      How so? Rap is almost all rhythm, almost no harmony or melody. Drums are all rhythm, no harmony or melody. How the hell is that "reactionary"? It's just a basic fact.
      - wahnfrieden 4y ago
        are you talking specifically about a rapper without a backing track? that's not a genre, it's an element like a drummer is regardless it's no fact, even the rapper very frequently uses melodic elements. you seem ignorant of it and have no ear for it.
- kweingar 4y ago
  Either you opened your mind a touch too much or you’re just being contrarian. Hard to tell. I would be very interested to see any published definition of “musician” or “music” in a dictionary that would exclude drums. The comparison of drummers to costume designers and publishers is so weak that I find it hard to believe you actually think this. I am also glad that you brought the conversation back to rap. My original analogy of rap to drumming wasn’t very good, because a huge majority of rap music does have melody, harmony, form, and rhythm, no different than any other genre of music. For reference, this is at the top of the charts today: https://youtu.be/I4DjHHVHWAE https://youtu.be/I4DjHHVHWAE

I guess GP sat down, and thought about it. I do that myself time to time, then I realize that despite to my best efforts I can't defend some common sense ideas, and must accept it as false. Usually hard to even explain. .. just think about it with an open mind, or try to even defend that drummers are musicians. I think most definitions of musicians don't include drummers much more than the costume designers or the publishers. (They work in the music industry, make music better, but can't and don't create music themselves alone.) I lean towards that they are not musicians. Also if GGGP doesn't classify hiphop or rap as music, then the "but the drummers are usually classified as musicians too" argument doesn't work on many levels.

midoridensha 4y ago
I'd call drummers "musicians" because the drums (which have rhythm) are a necessary part of the musical composition, and the drummer is performing that integral part of the music. What's harder to decide, IMO, is whether a drum solo really constitutes "music". If rap isn't music, then is a drum solo also not music? Personally, I can't stand most rap, but I also get bored with drum solos and usually skip them, even if I otherwise really love the drum parts of the band's other songs.
- bazoom42 4y ago
  > What's harder to decide, IMO, is whether a drum solo really constitutes "music". That is not hard to decide. Of course a drum solo is music.
- wahnfrieden 4y ago
  your enjoyment as an individual has nothing to do with musicality but portraying them as related does display reactionary tendencies
  - midoridensha 4y ago
    How so? Rap is almost all rhythm, almost no harmony or melody. Drums are all rhythm, no harmony or melody. How the hell is that "reactionary"? It's just a basic fact.
    - wahnfrieden 4y ago
      are you talking specifically about a rapper without a backing track? that's not a genre, it's an element like a drummer is regardless it's no fact, even the rapper very frequently uses melodic elements. you seem ignorant of it and have no ear for it.
kweingar 4y ago
Either you opened your mind a touch too much or you’re just being contrarian. Hard to tell. I would be very interested to see any published definition of “musician” or “music” in a dictionary that would exclude drums. The comparison of drummers to costume designers and publishers is so weak that I find it hard to believe you actually think this. I am also glad that you brought the conversation back to rap. My original analogy of rap to drumming wasn’t very good, because a huge majority of rap music does have melody, harmony, form, and rhythm, no different than any other genre of music. For reference, this is at the top of the charts today: https://youtu.be/I4DjHHVHWAE https://youtu.be/I4DjHHVHWAE