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Author: "so the ethics stuff - mostly a front?" SBF: "yeah" Absolutely gobsmacked. I saw these screenshots on Twitter and I thought they were fake until I re

Author: "so the ethics stuff - mostly a front?" SBF: "yeah" Absolutely gobsmacked. I saw these screenshots on Twitter and I thought they were fake until I read the article. The rest of the messages from him are pretty terrible as well. I thought he just fucked up, but no. He was wilfully unethical and maintains he did nothing wrong: "Sometimes life creeps up on you". And the thing he regrets most is filing for Chapter 11 bankruptcy... What a cruel fucking joke for all the people who invested with/in FTX.

c7DJTLrn 4y ago
I'm wondering if there is some kind of mass insanity occurring in the world right now with this and the behaviour of numerous influential figures.
- kingofheroes 4y ago
  Wealth reveals. Just like alcohol.
- eternalban 4y ago
  No, it is wrong to think it is a "mass" phenomena. A very small group of people around the planet are involved here. What is happening is what happens in all long running systems where the generational selection process becomes ineffective due to (typically) nepotism, hedonism, and corruption. What was once, if arguably ethically challenged, but competent elite gives way to an openly corrupt and incompetent set. Healthy systems check this phenomena -- it happens in all power entities historically -- and correct it. When they fail to correct it, they suddenly collapse.
- bmitc 4y ago
  You might be interested in Adam Curtis' documentaries. Check them out.
- w1nst0nsm1th 4y ago
  Something to do with neo-nicotinoid. It would explain a lot.
- zach_garwood 4y ago
  Money is a helluva drug!
  - cuteboy19 4y ago
    cheap money and low interest rates, to be precise
    - origin_path 4y ago
      Yep. It's a spectrum. At one end you have normal companies, in the middle you have pseudo-companies like Uber or Lyft or perhaps even Twitter where they're just indirectly guzzling printed money for decades after it's laundered through several different intermediaries, and then at the end you have FTX which is a fully fraudulent non-business. Where does all the crazy money come from? Ultimately from the central banks.
lovehashbrowns 4y ago
The ethics discussion along with the FTX/Alameda discussion is such a fascinating juxtaposition for me. It makes the article so much more interesting in my view. On the one hand, you’ve got this ethics discussion, which in context happened previously, about the ethics of running an immoral business to do good things. Then an ethical discussion about how that answer was BS and all that really matters is perception, and how perception doesn’t mirror reality. And here I’m trying to reflect on these topics. How do I feel about these things, how would I answer? Then the next part begins soon after with “messy accounting.” I view it the way I’d view Michelangelo’s David if it were displayed at a local county fair.
smsm42 4y ago
The guy is likely a psychopath. I mean just compare: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder#/media/File:Signs_of_AsPD_1.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorde... and see how many boxes he checks. When a high-skilled evil psychopath gets going, he (or she) usually leaves a trail of people asking themselves "how could we not see it for so long?!".
molsongolden 4y ago
He doesn't say he thinks it is okay to act unethically, he says that in general acting unethically doesn't matter the way he previously said it did because public perception is shaped more by winning than it is by whether the winner was ethical or unethical. Elsewhere in the DMs he says "I didn't want to do sketchy stuff [...] and I didn't mean to" and "it as never the intention". None of this reads like bombshell level "Wow this guy is terrible". He comes across as maybe terrible or maybe someone who played a little too fast and loose with an explosively growing business of which he lost control.
- encryptluks2 4y ago
  Wow... > He comes across as maybe terrible or maybe someone who played a little too fast and loose with an explosively growing business of which he lost control. Same type of statement would be like... They came across as maybe terrible or maybe someone who just had a few too many drinks and then lost control of a new sports car that they were not familiar with and accidentally drove into a crowd of people.
  - molsongolden 4y ago
    Yes and that's a great analogy because it's possible that your person driving the new sports car did not intentionally get drunk and drive into a crowd of people. Most people wouldn't call that driver a sociopath who intentionally murdered a crowd of people, they'd say "wow, that person made a couple of really poor decisions and they really messed up and ended up ruining a lot of lives".
    - encryptluks2 4y ago
      You do realize that states recognize ignoring the risk means that person was intentional and they are convicted of murder? Anything can be seen as a poor choice. By your logic Hitler made really poor decisions and ended up ruining a lot of lives.
      - molsongolden 4y ago
mongol 4y ago
I think there is a word for it. Sociopath.
FireBeyond 4y ago
And "more careful accounting". Not accurate/right accounting. Just "be more careful".
europeanguy 4y ago
How can you think he "just fucked up", and not unethical? He was selling magic beans. He was going "this thing I just made up, I declare it with billions".
- ZephyrBlu 4y ago
  I understand what you're getting at (Though this is not really about printing FTT in particular). What I'm trying to verbalize is that before, I gave him the benefit of the doubt in regards to intention. He mentions that he didn't mean to do sketchy things, but he was definitely more than willing to engage in unethical behaviour. Previously, I did not think he was being brazenly unethical. Now, I have the impression he will do anything it takes to "win".
  - europeanguy 4y ago
    > he was definitely more than willing to engage in unethical behaviour > Now, I have the impression he will do anything it takes to "win". Not sure what's the distinction you're making here.
2-718-281-828 4y ago
the yeah could also be the answer to the second question in the bubble!

c7DJTLrn 4y ago

I'm wondering if there is some kind of mass insanity occurring in the world right now with this and the behaviour of numerous influential figures.

kingofheroes 4y ago
Wealth reveals. Just like alcohol.
eternalban 4y ago
No, it is wrong to think it is a "mass" phenomena. A very small group of people around the planet are involved here. What is happening is what happens in all long running systems where the generational selection process becomes ineffective due to (typically) nepotism, hedonism, and corruption. What was once, if arguably ethically challenged, but competent elite gives way to an openly corrupt and incompetent set. Healthy systems check this phenomena -- it happens in all power entities historically -- and correct it. When they fail to correct it, they suddenly collapse.
bmitc 4y ago
You might be interested in Adam Curtis' documentaries. Check them out.
w1nst0nsm1th 4y ago
Something to do with neo-nicotinoid. It would explain a lot.
zach_garwood 4y ago
Money is a helluva drug!
- cuteboy19 4y ago
  cheap money and low interest rates, to be precise
  - origin_path 4y ago
    Yep. It's a spectrum. At one end you have normal companies, in the middle you have pseudo-companies like Uber or Lyft or perhaps even Twitter where they're just indirectly guzzling printed money for decades after it's laundered through several different intermediaries, and then at the end you have FTX which is a fully fraudulent non-business. Where does all the crazy money come from? Ultimately from the central banks.

lovehashbrowns 4y ago

The ethics discussion along with the FTX/Alameda discussion is such a fascinating juxtaposition for me. It makes the article so much more interesting in my view. On the one hand, you’ve got this ethics discussion, which in context happened previously, about the ethics of running an immoral business to do good things. Then an ethical discussion about how that answer was BS and all that really matters is perception, and how perception doesn’t mirror reality. And here I’m trying to reflect on these topics. How do I feel about these things, how would I answer? Then the next part begins soon after with “messy accounting.” I view it the way I’d view Michelangelo’s David if it were displayed at a local county fair.

smsm42 4y ago

The guy is likely a psychopath. I mean just compare: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder#/media/File:Signs_of_AsPD_1.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorde... and see how many boxes he checks. When a high-skilled evil psychopath gets going, he (or she) usually leaves a trail of people asking themselves "how could we not see it for so long?!".

molsongolden 4y ago

He doesn't say he thinks it is okay to act unethically, he says that in general acting unethically doesn't matter the way he previously said it did because public perception is shaped more by winning than it is by whether the winner was ethical or unethical. Elsewhere in the DMs he says "I didn't want to do sketchy stuff [...] and I didn't mean to" and "it as never the intention". None of this reads like bombshell level "Wow this guy is terrible". He comes across as maybe terrible or maybe someone who played a little too fast and loose with an explosively growing business of which he lost control.

encryptluks2 4y ago
Wow... > He comes across as maybe terrible or maybe someone who played a little too fast and loose with an explosively growing business of which he lost control. Same type of statement would be like... They came across as maybe terrible or maybe someone who just had a few too many drinks and then lost control of a new sports car that they were not familiar with and accidentally drove into a crowd of people.
- molsongolden 4y ago
  Yes and that's a great analogy because it's possible that your person driving the new sports car did not intentionally get drunk and drive into a crowd of people. Most people wouldn't call that driver a sociopath who intentionally murdered a crowd of people, they'd say "wow, that person made a couple of really poor decisions and they really messed up and ended up ruining a lot of lives".
  - encryptluks2 4y ago
    You do realize that states recognize ignoring the risk means that person was intentional and they are convicted of murder? Anything can be seen as a poor choice. By your logic Hitler made really poor decisions and ended up ruining a lot of lives.
    - molsongolden 4y ago

mongol 4y ago

I think there is a word for it. Sociopath.

FireBeyond 4y ago

And "more careful accounting". Not accurate/right accounting. Just "be more careful".

europeanguy 4y ago

How can you think he "just fucked up", and not unethical? He was selling magic beans. He was going "this thing I just made up, I declare it with billions".

ZephyrBlu 4y ago
I understand what you're getting at (Though this is not really about printing FTT in particular). What I'm trying to verbalize is that before, I gave him the benefit of the doubt in regards to intention. He mentions that he didn't mean to do sketchy things, but he was definitely more than willing to engage in unethical behaviour. Previously, I did not think he was being brazenly unethical. Now, I have the impression he will do anything it takes to "win".
- europeanguy 4y ago
  > he was definitely more than willing to engage in unethical behaviour > Now, I have the impression he will do anything it takes to "win". Not sure what's the distinction you're making here.

2-718-281-828 4y ago

the yeah could also be the answer to the second question in the bubble!