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It seems lax of CPSC to issue such a damning statement without an accompanying comparative analysis to other board or motor sports. What’s the injury rate vs ot

It seems lax of CPSC to issue such a damning statement without an accompanying comparative analysis to other board or motor sports. What’s the injury rate vs other similar sports and how much of that is to blame from undereducated or reckless riders? Also, what’s the rationale for the recall if the issue is people ignoring the obvious warnings the thing is giving that the battery is about to die? This doesn’t seem to be a matter of system failures or inherent design flaws. Paramotoring is risky, but no one is chasing all paramotor manufacturers to recall their products. Similar for dirt bikes. It seems somehow these are getting singled out due to their uniqueness and being a product from a single company, not because there’s a flaw in the design that makes them inordinately risky.

sometimeshuman 4y ago
It's the single point of failure with no preventative maintenance plan that makes it more dangerous. When the power suddenly cut-out on my "one wheel" (it was a different brand) I was instantly airborne. I can inspect my skateboard periodically to ensure the wheels don't fall off. If my dirtbike engine suddenly cut-out I still have momentum and brakes. But with a onewheel the wheel slips behind you and you are smashing the pavement when the electronics fail. For the record, I love my recently purchased Onewheel Pint and installed fangs in case the power cuts out unexpectedly.
mikestew 4y ago
The device tips its nose forward and dumps its rider on their head. There is no need to compare to anything if a device has this behavior. If the battery runs out, I expect the device to come to a stop, not throw me on my ass. I'm pretty sure even a paramotoring rig that runs out of fuel isn't going to immediately hurt me, and those things fly.
- aksss 4y ago
  It does come to a stop. You get thrown on your ass because of the laws of motion. Your last statement - are you talking about using a fan with a parasail, which is a stable glider without power? If you want to use that analogy, this is more akin to taking too sharp a turn in a parasail, where the sail can't sustain and collapses in, causing you to fall like a rock because of the law of gravity. In a nosedive on a Onewheel, it also happens when the rider is asking too much, goes outside the performance envelope, and reaches a failure point. After the rider has been warned by the board that it's approaching that edge, physically and audibly.
  - evan_ 4y ago
    Only the newest, most expensive Onewheel (the GT) has an audible alert
  - strix_varius 4y ago
    > After the rider has been warned by the board that it's approaching that edge, physically and audibly. After a thousand miles and some injuries, I've learned to detect the onewheel XR's subtle pushback. However, none of the new riders who have tried my board have ever been able to feel it. And it certainly has no audible alarm either, I'm not sure where you got that.
    - MivLives 4y ago
      This is a good call out. I didn't know what push back was at first. It's not as intuitive as you'd think, especially if you're towards the upper edge of the boards weight capacity. Keeping most of the weight on the back leg and pushing with the front is just a weird feeling. I've had similar issues but it's why I always set it to that 12mph mode before handing it off unless the person had ridden at least a few times.
    - easygenes 4y ago
      The 2020+ GT model has an audio alarm, others do not (or perhaps only newer revisions of them do).
    - aksss 4y ago
      GT has it, that’s what I ride.
- easygenes 4y ago
  Ever tried to brake too hard on a motorcycle? You can get them to slip out in all sorts of bad ways or just plain flip pretty easily without finesse and skill. Certain sports just come with more risks. In some cases they’re niche enough with the right communities that they self police or fly under the radar and escape regulation. Others wind up with restrictions and licensing requirements. In one wheel’s case it’s a very fast thing which requires an impeccable sense of balance and intense respect for it being something that can only keep you moving if it has power. Fangs (little wheels on the board edges) are an option for people that want more flexibility with it bottoming out, but they also lower your clearance so it’s a trade off and you’re still best off never letting the battery die.
  - mikestew 4y ago
    Ever tried to brake too hard on a motorcycle? Yes. If I turn off the ABS and traction control, I'm skilled enough to lift the back wheel. But you know what has never happened? Having the front brake lock all on its own because I dared run the bike to empty. ...and you’re still best off never letting the battery die. ...lest the board cast you to the ground in a dangerous manner. Which, from my reading, is why the CPSC would like OneWheel to issue a recall. I'm hard-pressed to think of any other device that doesn't just coast to a halt when it runs out of fuel. Even an airplane doesn't just immediately plow nose-first into the ground when it runs out of juice.
    - rhinoceraptor 4y ago
      The only thing I can think of is quadcopters. Helicopters can also land safely in the event of engine failure.
    - strix_varius 4y ago
      Exactly, this is the core issue. It also doesn't only happen when the onewheel runs out of juice. There are endless reports of it just having some sort of control fault and blipping for an instant (I've experienced this myself, thankfully at low speed). A tenth of a second blip at 20mph = instant launch. Ironically, the other end of the energy spectrum also gives onewheels trouble. If you charge your board too much (leave it plugged in without discharging it), the battery cells become unbalanced, leading to similar blips. This is a known issue - when I reported it (still under warranty), the support rep had a script for how I could fix the issue.
- mint2 4y ago
  Try an Evolve skateboard control. Also google problems with those boards. It’s frequently reported to do all sorts of things. I’m not sure why onewheel is singled out. Any electric skateboard is equally dangerous. Even if the control doesn’t make it easy to over apply brakes, cutting power when going at anything over 12mph is very likely to cause “eating it” if in bad stance. Definitely going to be a problem over 15 if speed wobbles don’t already cause the “eating it” Braking without proper body posture is a recipe for disaster on an electric board. At least one wheels kindof force proper body posture.
  - strix_varius 4y ago
    As a onewheel owner, this response is missing something very important: because it has one wheel, it doesn't matter, even a little, what kind of "posture" you're in when the board blips. You go flying, end of story. Electric boards with > 1 wheel all have some degree of natural kinetic stability.

sometimeshuman 4y ago

It's the single point of failure with no preventative maintenance plan that makes it more dangerous. When the power suddenly cut-out on my "one wheel" (it was a different brand) I was instantly airborne. I can inspect my skateboard periodically to ensure the wheels don't fall off. If my dirtbike engine suddenly cut-out I still have momentum and brakes. But with a onewheel the wheel slips behind you and you are smashing the pavement when the electronics fail. For the record, I love my recently purchased Onewheel Pint and installed fangs in case the power cuts out unexpectedly.

mikestew 4y ago

The device tips its nose forward and dumps its rider on their head. There is no need to compare to anything if a device has this behavior. If the battery runs out, I expect the device to come to a stop, not throw me on my ass. I'm pretty sure even a paramotoring rig that runs out of fuel isn't going to immediately hurt me, and those things fly.

aksss 4y ago
It does come to a stop. You get thrown on your ass because of the laws of motion. Your last statement - are you talking about using a fan with a parasail, which is a stable glider without power? If you want to use that analogy, this is more akin to taking too sharp a turn in a parasail, where the sail can't sustain and collapses in, causing you to fall like a rock because of the law of gravity. In a nosedive on a Onewheel, it also happens when the rider is asking too much, goes outside the performance envelope, and reaches a failure point. After the rider has been warned by the board that it's approaching that edge, physically and audibly.
- evan_ 4y ago
  Only the newest, most expensive Onewheel (the GT) has an audible alert
- strix_varius 4y ago
  > After the rider has been warned by the board that it's approaching that edge, physically and audibly. After a thousand miles and some injuries, I've learned to detect the onewheel XR's subtle pushback. However, none of the new riders who have tried my board have ever been able to feel it. And it certainly has no audible alarm either, I'm not sure where you got that.
  - MivLives 4y ago
    This is a good call out. I didn't know what push back was at first. It's not as intuitive as you'd think, especially if you're towards the upper edge of the boards weight capacity. Keeping most of the weight on the back leg and pushing with the front is just a weird feeling. I've had similar issues but it's why I always set it to that 12mph mode before handing it off unless the person had ridden at least a few times.
  - easygenes 4y ago
    The 2020+ GT model has an audio alarm, others do not (or perhaps only newer revisions of them do).
  - aksss 4y ago
    GT has it, that’s what I ride.
easygenes 4y ago
Ever tried to brake too hard on a motorcycle? You can get them to slip out in all sorts of bad ways or just plain flip pretty easily without finesse and skill. Certain sports just come with more risks. In some cases they’re niche enough with the right communities that they self police or fly under the radar and escape regulation. Others wind up with restrictions and licensing requirements. In one wheel’s case it’s a very fast thing which requires an impeccable sense of balance and intense respect for it being something that can only keep you moving if it has power. Fangs (little wheels on the board edges) are an option for people that want more flexibility with it bottoming out, but they also lower your clearance so it’s a trade off and you’re still best off never letting the battery die.
- mikestew 4y ago
  Ever tried to brake too hard on a motorcycle? Yes. If I turn off the ABS and traction control, I'm skilled enough to lift the back wheel. But you know what has never happened? Having the front brake lock all on its own because I dared run the bike to empty. ...and you’re still best off never letting the battery die. ...lest the board cast you to the ground in a dangerous manner. Which, from my reading, is why the CPSC would like OneWheel to issue a recall. I'm hard-pressed to think of any other device that doesn't just coast to a halt when it runs out of fuel. Even an airplane doesn't just immediately plow nose-first into the ground when it runs out of juice.
  - rhinoceraptor 4y ago
    The only thing I can think of is quadcopters. Helicopters can also land safely in the event of engine failure.
  - strix_varius 4y ago
    Exactly, this is the core issue. It also doesn't only happen when the onewheel runs out of juice. There are endless reports of it just having some sort of control fault and blipping for an instant (I've experienced this myself, thankfully at low speed). A tenth of a second blip at 20mph = instant launch. Ironically, the other end of the energy spectrum also gives onewheels trouble. If you charge your board too much (leave it plugged in without discharging it), the battery cells become unbalanced, leading to similar blips. This is a known issue - when I reported it (still under warranty), the support rep had a script for how I could fix the issue.
mint2 4y ago
Try an Evolve skateboard control. Also google problems with those boards. It’s frequently reported to do all sorts of things. I’m not sure why onewheel is singled out. Any electric skateboard is equally dangerous. Even if the control doesn’t make it easy to over apply brakes, cutting power when going at anything over 12mph is very likely to cause “eating it” if in bad stance. Definitely going to be a problem over 15 if speed wobbles don’t already cause the “eating it” Braking without proper body posture is a recipe for disaster on an electric board. At least one wheels kindof force proper body posture.
- strix_varius 4y ago
  As a onewheel owner, this response is missing something very important: because it has one wheel, it doesn't matter, even a little, what kind of "posture" you're in when the board blips. You go flying, end of story. Electric boards with > 1 wheel all have some degree of natural kinetic stability.