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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_boat_navigation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_boat_navigation Not a new idea: Chevaux électriques, meaning "Electric

by azepoi 4y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_boat_navigation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_boat_navigation Not a new idea: Chevaux électriques, meaning "Electric horses" (electric towpath tractors, halage=tow). https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treideln#/media/Datei:Courchelettes_chevaux-electriques.jpg https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treideln#/media/Datei:Courchel... https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treidellokomotive https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treidellokomotive http://ronfleur.centerblog.net/6408563-halage-des-peniches-par-traction-electrique http://ronfleur.centerblog.net/6408563-halage-des-peniches-p... https://www.ronquieres.org/le-village-de-ronquieres/vieilles-photos-du-village/le-halage-des-bateaux/ https://www.ronquieres.org/le-village-de-ronquieres/vieilles... (last image bottom right) http://www.traitsensavoie.fr/spip.php?article308 http://www.traitsensavoie.fr/spip.php?article308 http://www.traitsensavoie.fr/IMG/jpg/cheval_electrique_bethune-2.jpg http://www.traitsensavoie.fr/IMG/jpg/cheval_electrique_bethu... http://papidema.fr/traction_vn_extra.php#chevaux-elec http://papidema.fr/traction_vn_extra.php#chevaux-elec

dredmorbius 4y ago
Not a new idea... FWIW: I wasn't claiming that.
- azepoi 4y ago
  FWIWI wasn't claiming the contrary juste expanding with something I thought interesting. Replies are also intended for everybody else on HN.
  - dredmorbius 4y ago
    Fair enough, and strongly agreed on the last.
Forgeties79 4y ago
No need to “well actually…” someone just for discussing something interesting
- dredmorbius 4y ago
  "Yes, and ..." is a wonderful notion from the world of improv: <https://www.liveabout.com/yes-and-improv-game-2713213 https://www.liveabout.com/yes-and-improv-game-2713213> It contrasts with "no, but", most often, though also "well, actually", as you note. (This is of course a "yes, and ..." comment. ;-) And thank you.
  - Forgeties79 4y ago
    I love this, never thought to apply it in that way. Thanks!
- azepoi 4y ago
  So I think it's interesting we had these at the end of the 19th century. Battery electric automobiles were also invented really early. It doesn't mean it's a bad idea unless you have a bias for new things
  - dredmorbius 4y ago
    Electrification is fairly easy once you have generators, motors, and even modest transmission infrastructure. Many early generator plants were for quite limited service areas, or even single applications such as a factory or electrified rail system. Some of those later expanded to sell surplus or additional power, Duke Energy (now the Southern Company) being once such instance, I've recently learned. The basics of electrical traction design were optimised to a large extend fairly quickly, especially relative to ICE technologies, which are relatively more complicated, and high-power (as well as high-reliability) ICE propulsion took considerably longer to develop. So, 1860s--1920s or so for electrical vs. 1890s--2000s for ICEs, which saw improvements in basic design, metallurgy, machining, emissions controls, injection, and computer controls, among others. The alternative was steam locomotion, which was still being used in the West into the 1950s, when diesel-electric traction largely replaced it. China didn't retire its last commercially-operating steam locomotives until the 2010s, and possibly later. (There's a set of photographs of a train engineer who'd graduated from steam to high-speed rail over his career, and possibly within only a decade or so.) In the past decade or so we've seen increasing limits on ICEs, most especially of their fundamental characteristic of carbon emissions, whilst EVs are benefiting from incremental advances in battery and other technologies reaching past a critical tipping point.
taneq 4y ago
Almost no newly commercially available thing is a “new idea”, because the theoretical possibilities are typically explored well before a practical implementation is designed, built and brought to market.

by azepoi 4y ago

dredmorbius 4y ago

Not a new idea... FWIW: I wasn't claiming that.

azepoi 4y ago
FWIWI wasn't claiming the contrary juste expanding with something I thought interesting. Replies are also intended for everybody else on HN.
- dredmorbius 4y ago
  Fair enough, and strongly agreed on the last.

Forgeties79 4y ago

No need to “well actually…” someone just for discussing something interesting

dredmorbius 4y ago
"Yes, and ..." is a wonderful notion from the world of improv: <https://www.liveabout.com/yes-and-improv-game-2713213 https://www.liveabout.com/yes-and-improv-game-2713213> It contrasts with "no, but", most often, though also "well, actually", as you note. (This is of course a "yes, and ..." comment. ;-) And thank you.
- Forgeties79 4y ago
  I love this, never thought to apply it in that way. Thanks!
azepoi 4y ago
So I think it's interesting we had these at the end of the 19th century. Battery electric automobiles were also invented really early. It doesn't mean it's a bad idea unless you have a bias for new things
- dredmorbius 4y ago
  Electrification is fairly easy once you have generators, motors, and even modest transmission infrastructure. Many early generator plants were for quite limited service areas, or even single applications such as a factory or electrified rail system. Some of those later expanded to sell surplus or additional power, Duke Energy (now the Southern Company) being once such instance, I've recently learned. The basics of electrical traction design were optimised to a large extend fairly quickly, especially relative to ICE technologies, which are relatively more complicated, and high-power (as well as high-reliability) ICE propulsion took considerably longer to develop. So, 1860s--1920s or so for electrical vs. 1890s--2000s for ICEs, which saw improvements in basic design, metallurgy, machining, emissions controls, injection, and computer controls, among others. The alternative was steam locomotion, which was still being used in the West into the 1950s, when diesel-electric traction largely replaced it. China didn't retire its last commercially-operating steam locomotives until the 2010s, and possibly later. (There's a set of photographs of a train engineer who'd graduated from steam to high-speed rail over his career, and possibly within only a decade or so.) In the past decade or so we've seen increasing limits on ICEs, most especially of their fundamental characteristic of carbon emissions, whilst EVs are benefiting from incremental advances in battery and other technologies reaching past a critical tipping point.

taneq 4y ago

Almost no newly commercially available thing is a “new idea”, because the theoretical possibilities are typically explored well before a practical implementation is designed, built and brought to market.