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> It's literally a cultural joke that no-one reads those I read every single document I sign my name to, every time. I'm not alone either. I assume we're mostl
by aliqot 4y ago
> It's literally a cultural joke that no-one reads those
I read every single document I sign my name to, every time. I'm not alone either. I assume we're mostly engineers here, some of us maybe are involved in contractual things, so tell me: in your job do you sign your business's name or your own name as Officer to contracts you haven't read? Now tell me, if work is less important than your personal affairs why on earth would you review the terms for work agreements, but not for yourself? If I agreed to contracts without reading them in a job context, I'd be in the unemployment line so fast the IRS would send me their condolences.
- itsyaboi 4y agoWhat is your strategy when it comes to updates? Say you hop into your Tesla, see a pending software update and are prompted with a EULA type document. Do spend the next hour reviewing it before accepting? Assuming you are an engineer and not a legal expert, do you consult with a lawyer about ambiguous wording or clauses? How do you repeat this x100 for all of the software embedded in your life? This has to be a joke, right?
- Loughla 4y agoYou're living black and white, is the problem. Do I read all work contracts and terms? Of course. Do I read all contracts in my personal life related to property, finance, or other important things? Of course. Do I read the 10 pages of EULA every time Angry Birds updates new levels? Absolutely not. In the context of Apple: When you activate a phone, the salesperson who sets it up (most people in middle america still do go to the store to get their phones activated) literally flashes the screen at you and says something to the effect of, "do you agree? If not, you can't use this phone."
- realusername 4y agoBecause the reality is those "user contracts" have no real value and if you ask me, it's good they are not printed because they would be a waste of paper. Of course that reality does not suit well companies and they try very hard to create their own bubble world of user contracts. Proper country laws enforce consumer laws instead based on intent
- _Algernon_ 4y agoI've never wanted to make a "touch grass" joke more than in response to this comment.
- wsc981 4y agoObligatory: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zVTsFKJ2nJE https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zVTsFKJ2nJE
- always2slow 4y agotl;dr
- yamtaddle 4y agoMost people definitely do not read click-through EULAs in a business context any more than in their ordinary life. When Jira or AWS or whoever send updated policies to businesses on their public plans, almost nobody pays attention. The likelihood of being fired for this behavior surely approaches zero. "Real" contracts are another matter entirely.
- A4ET8a8uTh0 4y agoAnd this is where the problem lies. It may be high times to see if EULAs are contracts or not. It would certainly clear some things up really fast. It is not impossible that this case may actually force this clarification.
- Loughla 4y ago>It may be high times to see if EULAs are contracts or not. Abso.fucking.lutely. I believe the state of technology has progressed to the point that EULA are just weasel words. People view them as necessary evils that don't really impact their lives (or, rather, shouldn't) but companies treat them like legal documents. A court needs to settle this.
- Lewton 4y agoThe TOS is not a valid contract