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> this tech isn't a good idea Bitcoin is politically neutral. Wall Street isnt.

Stention314 4y ago
Bitcoin has anti censor mechanics. It's definitely not political neutral. And independent of if Bitcoin is or not: the 'how it's used' matters because the theory matters less.
- landemva 4y ago
  > Bitcoin has anti censor mechanics. While people like to claim there is some anti-censor magic, it's not really true when block space is full. There is nothing in the code to penalize miners for ignoring a particular transaction for weeks or forever.
  - Stention314 4y ago
    I'm referencing the core idea of it being decentralized and "anonymous"
    - landemva 4y ago
      A public ledger is not really anonymous, whether you put that in quotes or not. It can be censored, and this is a difficult game theory problem to solve. There are a few major mining pools which build the blocks, and some think that is not decentralized. Bitcoin was an amazing advancement and I hope it can grow into solving some of these apparent challenges.
andrewmcwatters 4y ago
I think upon casual reading, one finds that is not true. The Bitcoin Genesis block contained metadata that suggests otherwise:[1] "The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks" I personally don't particularly agree with central banks being a utility of commercial banks, but I also don't believe that creating a digital deflationary asset that cannot allow intermediaries to solve human problems like fraud is the answer. It seems infantile to me to suggest otherwise. [1]: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Genesis_block#Coinbase https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Genesis_block#Coinbase
- tommica 4y ago
  > It seems infantile to me to suggest otherwise. Nice way to preemptively disregard any comment that might suggest otherwise. But it's a good point with the "solving human problems" remark - the whole thing tries to avoid human tendencies, while it is meant to solve purely human-made problems.
- djbebs 4y ago
  Nothing about blockchain prevents the amelioration of fraud, just like nothing about cash prevents it all the same. You can very simply devise an insurance contract that compensates you for any such losses you incur. Of course such an insurance is expensive, so most people wouldn't do it, but it's certainly possible.
whateveracct 4y ago
Okay let's talk to the average American on HN. Your point (if it even has much value) does not affect them. US banks and stocks are strictly better than BTC as a place to park their USD as American citizens. Unless they wanna gamble.
- landemva 4y ago
  > US banks and stocks are strictly better than BTC as a place to park their USD as American citizens. Not when a simple letter from government gets your accounts seized incorrectly. Gigantic problem to get the funds back without high-priced legal help. Yet bitcoin has not been seized from me.
kryptiskt 4y ago
How can it be politically neutral when it has a builtin monetary policy?
abriosi 4y ago
Although I understand and upvoted I think the response is nuanced This is a good read: The Blocksize War: The Battle Over Who Controls Bitcoin's Protocol Rules https://g.co/kgs/4axiTg https://g.co/kgs/4axiTg

Bitcoin has anti censor mechanics. It's definitely not political neutral. And independent of if Bitcoin is or not: the 'how it's used' matters because the theory matters less.

landemva 4y ago
> Bitcoin has anti censor mechanics. While people like to claim there is some anti-censor magic, it's not really true when block space is full. There is nothing in the code to penalize miners for ignoring a particular transaction for weeks or forever.
- Stention314 4y ago
  I'm referencing the core idea of it being decentralized and "anonymous"
  - landemva 4y ago
    A public ledger is not really anonymous, whether you put that in quotes or not. It can be censored, and this is a difficult game theory problem to solve. There are a few major mining pools which build the blocks, and some think that is not decentralized. Bitcoin was an amazing advancement and I hope it can grow into solving some of these apparent challenges.

andrewmcwatters 4y ago

I think upon casual reading, one finds that is not true. The Bitcoin Genesis block contained metadata that suggests otherwise:[1] "The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks" I personally don't particularly agree with central banks being a utility of commercial banks, but I also don't believe that creating a digital deflationary asset that cannot allow intermediaries to solve human problems like fraud is the answer. It seems infantile to me to suggest otherwise. [1]: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Genesis_block#Coinbase https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Genesis_block#Coinbase

tommica 4y ago
> It seems infantile to me to suggest otherwise. Nice way to preemptively disregard any comment that might suggest otherwise. But it's a good point with the "solving human problems" remark - the whole thing tries to avoid human tendencies, while it is meant to solve purely human-made problems.
djbebs 4y ago
Nothing about blockchain prevents the amelioration of fraud, just like nothing about cash prevents it all the same. You can very simply devise an insurance contract that compensates you for any such losses you incur. Of course such an insurance is expensive, so most people wouldn't do it, but it's certainly possible.

whateveracct 4y ago

Okay let's talk to the average American on HN. Your point (if it even has much value) does not affect them. US banks and stocks are strictly better than BTC as a place to park their USD as American citizens. Unless they wanna gamble.

landemva 4y ago
> US banks and stocks are strictly better than BTC as a place to park their USD as American citizens. Not when a simple letter from government gets your accounts seized incorrectly. Gigantic problem to get the funds back without high-priced legal help. Yet bitcoin has not been seized from me.

kryptiskt 4y ago

How can it be politically neutral when it has a builtin monetary policy?

abriosi 4y ago

Although I understand and upvoted I think the response is nuanced This is a good read: The Blocksize War: The Battle Over Who Controls Bitcoin's Protocol Rules https://g.co/kgs/4axiTg https://g.co/kgs/4axiTg