3 ms·

It's mostly silicon, how bad could the waste be?

by ThrowawayTestr 4y ago

thrown_22 4y ago
Cyanide is just carbon and nitrogen. How could it be possibly toxic?
- ilyt 4y ago
  Can't just melt it into a blob like you can with glass
- hwillis 4y ago
  Elements and chemicals are very different things. Silicon is the #2 most common element on earth and if you smash a bunch of solar panels, they turn into sand when they get wet. Or if you just wait. Even pure silicon metal is totally benign, even in large amounts. Certainly safer than iron, which can kill you in relatively small amounts if it's in a bioavailable form. Silicon is already literally everywhere, in every form it will reasonably be transformed into. Even the boron and phosphorus that make up a tiny percent of cells are extremely benign. The biggest issues are the tin fingers and solder, and probably the lead that is often present. But lead is also far from necessary. And unfortunately, the human race is going to be dealing with lead dust for a while already, just from how it used to be in gasoline.
  - thrown_22 4y ago
    So the asbestos lobby was right and there's nothing dangerous about snorting it. It's after all just a funny shaped silicate that's totally benign.
- ABCLAW 4y ago
  1) This is the technical answer: Cyanide binds fairly strongly to one of the molecular machines involved in cellular respiration, inactivating it. The result of that inactivation is that your cell begins to have issues producing ATP, even when it has nutrients available. Without going too far into detail, ATP is essentially the cellular unit of energy that your cells run on. Without being able to make more, your cell will eventually run out of ATP and it will die. Enough cells die? You'll die. 2) The more important point here is that not only is your intuition uninformed, but you appear to be incredulous as well. Ask yourself why you react to unintuitive results in areas you're not familiar with in the way that you do.
Archelaos 4y ago
Solar modules contain lead for soldering and some contain cadmium telluride (CdTe).[1] If handled and recycled correctly, the risk of exposure of lead and cadmium into the environment is minimal. However, there is a possibility that such materials are released by accident (fire, cracks) or improper disposal. That is why there are demands that solar modules containing CdTe should be basically abandoned, as there exist alternatives. However, the overall risk appears to be comparable to that of other products containing these materials, such as many consumer electronics. [1] CdTe has a low toxicity. However, it may pose a significant hazard if its cadmium is released by some chemical reaction, which cannot generally be ruled out.
- Schroedingersat 4y ago
  They've been completely abandoned for a while now. If you stack the small portion of CdTe ones neatly somewhere, someone will want the Te soon enough. Lead is already mostly phased out.
  - Archelaos 4y ago
    This does not seem to be the case. I googled "cdte cells market share" and immediately found a couple of Web-sites that say otherwise (although their numbers differ quite considerably): https://www.marketdataforecast.com/market-reports/cadmium-telluride-photovoltaic-market https://www.marketdataforecast.com/market-reports/cadmium-te... https://www.einnews.com/pr_news/587880725/cadmium-telluride-solar-cell-cdte-market-to-reach-usd-18-18-41-mn-by-2029-with-12-10-of-high-cagr https://www.einnews.com/pr_news/587880725/cadmium-telluride-... https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/as-demand-rises-expansion-of-market-for-cadmium-telluride-for-solar-cells-rapidly-increasing-301478230.html https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/as-demand-rises-exp...
    - hwillis 4y ago
      6 billion in 2028 works out to <2.4% of the market. https://www.globenewswire.com/en/news-release/2022/07/14/2479494/0/en/Solar-Energy-System-Market-Size-Worth-USD-255-3-Billion-Globally-by-2028-at-20-1-CAGR-Solar-Energy-System-Industry-Report-by-Vantage-Market-Research.html https://www.globenewswire.com/en/news-release/2022/07/14/247...

It's mostly silicon, how bad could the waste be?

thrown_22 4y ago

Cyanide is just carbon and nitrogen. How could it be possibly toxic?

ilyt 4y ago
Can't just melt it into a blob like you can with glass
hwillis 4y ago
Elements and chemicals are very different things. Silicon is the #2 most common element on earth and if you smash a bunch of solar panels, they turn into sand when they get wet. Or if you just wait. Even pure silicon metal is totally benign, even in large amounts. Certainly safer than iron, which can kill you in relatively small amounts if it's in a bioavailable form. Silicon is already literally everywhere, in every form it will reasonably be transformed into. Even the boron and phosphorus that make up a tiny percent of cells are extremely benign. The biggest issues are the tin fingers and solder, and probably the lead that is often present. But lead is also far from necessary. And unfortunately, the human race is going to be dealing with lead dust for a while already, just from how it used to be in gasoline.
- thrown_22 4y ago
  So the asbestos lobby was right and there's nothing dangerous about snorting it. It's after all just a funny shaped silicate that's totally benign.
ABCLAW 4y ago
1) This is the technical answer: Cyanide binds fairly strongly to one of the molecular machines involved in cellular respiration, inactivating it. The result of that inactivation is that your cell begins to have issues producing ATP, even when it has nutrients available. Without going too far into detail, ATP is essentially the cellular unit of energy that your cells run on. Without being able to make more, your cell will eventually run out of ATP and it will die. Enough cells die? You'll die. 2) The more important point here is that not only is your intuition uninformed, but you appear to be incredulous as well. Ask yourself why you react to unintuitive results in areas you're not familiar with in the way that you do.

Archelaos 4y ago

Solar modules contain lead for soldering and some contain cadmium telluride (CdTe).[1] If handled and recycled correctly, the risk of exposure of lead and cadmium into the environment is minimal. However, there is a possibility that such materials are released by accident (fire, cracks) or improper disposal. That is why there are demands that solar modules containing CdTe should be basically abandoned, as there exist alternatives. However, the overall risk appears to be comparable to that of other products containing these materials, such as many consumer electronics. [1] CdTe has a low toxicity. However, it may pose a significant hazard if its cadmium is released by some chemical reaction, which cannot generally be ruled out.

Schroedingersat 4y ago
They've been completely abandoned for a while now. If you stack the small portion of CdTe ones neatly somewhere, someone will want the Te soon enough. Lead is already mostly phased out.
- Archelaos 4y ago
  This does not seem to be the case. I googled "cdte cells market share" and immediately found a couple of Web-sites that say otherwise (although their numbers differ quite considerably): https://www.marketdataforecast.com/market-reports/cadmium-telluride-photovoltaic-market https://www.marketdataforecast.com/market-reports/cadmium-te... https://www.einnews.com/pr_news/587880725/cadmium-telluride-solar-cell-cdte-market-to-reach-usd-18-18-41-mn-by-2029-with-12-10-of-high-cagr https://www.einnews.com/pr_news/587880725/cadmium-telluride-... https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/as-demand-rises-expansion-of-market-for-cadmium-telluride-for-solar-cells-rapidly-increasing-301478230.html https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/as-demand-rises-exp...
  - hwillis 4y ago
    6 billion in 2028 works out to <2.4% of the market. https://www.globenewswire.com/en/news-release/2022/07/14/2479494/0/en/Solar-Energy-System-Market-Size-Worth-USD-255-3-Billion-Globally-by-2028-at-20-1-CAGR-Solar-Energy-System-Industry-Report-by-Vantage-Market-Research.html https://www.globenewswire.com/en/news-release/2022/07/14/247...