4 ms·

> What I've found is that matters is appetite: some people just get full way faster than others. This is a half truth. If you cut down portion size your stoma

by sigg3 4y ago

> What I've found is that matters is appetite: some people just get full way faster than others. This is a half truth. If you cut down portion size your stomach will shrink over time. I eat a lot less before feeling full now, and I only changed my life a year ago. It's also important that you eat stuff that makes you feel full, fibers and greens. Changing diet also changed my taste, so I crave more healthy things now, while the food I used to eat honestly don't appeal to me any longer or tastes empty. OTOH if you push yourself to eat a little more every meal, your stomach will grown, accommodating room for more before you feel full.

adrian_b 4y ago
For increased satiety, even when eating little, an additional factor is that the food should not be too soft, like most of the industrially made food is, but it should need some time of vigorous chewing. There are many vegetables, fruits and nuts that require a decent amount of chewing. There are also some kinds of home-made bread that require much more chewing than the industrial soft bread, while also being much tastier than the commercial bread (when eaten immediately after baking; the commercial bread is optimized for long shelf life).
- bollu 4y ago
  Got any chewey bread recipes?
  - ljf 4y ago
    My homemade sour dough is always chewy and tough, but I love it! [ ] Thursday [ ] 8am - if starter hasn't been used for 4 weeks or more; feed starter 30g flour and 30g of water [ ] Thursday evening weigh out flour and salt as below into two bowls, and cover. Get water jug, yeast and teaspoon ready. Keep starter in the fridge until needed [ ] Friday: [ ] 1. (8am) Mix 100g of Starter, 200g white flour, 50g wholemeal flour, 200g warm water. Mix and cover. This is the Levain, set aside somewhere room temperature - if you house is very cold you can use extra starter. [ ] 2. (1pm) Five hours later, in a big bowl mix 100 of white flour, 300g of wholemeal flour, 10g of salt and 330g warm water. Stand for 20 minutes, uncovered. [ ] 3. (1.20pm) Add a quarter tea spoon of instant yeast and 300g of the levain made this morning to the big bowl, mix all together (leftover levain add to starter you have in the fridge - save for next time or mix and give half to someone else). [ ] 4.1 (2.30pm) 1st fold. Over the next 2 hours, fold the dough 3 times with wet hands. Roughly mix and blend the dough, no need to kneed. [ ] 4.2 (3.30pm) 2nd fold [ ] 4.3 (4.30pm) 3rd fold [ ] 5. (6pm, approx 5 hours after step 2.) Shape into a ball and place on greaseproof paper in a large bowl. Put in fridge till tomorrow morning. [ ] Saturday: [ ] 6. (8am) Remove from fridge. Preheat oven and a cast-iron pot to 245 deg C [ ] 7. Score top of loaf and place with greaseproof paper in the heated pot and bake for 20 minutes. Remove lid and cook for 25 mins more. Will sound hollow(ish) when tapped once baked. Crust should be a dark brown. [ ] 8. Remove from pot, take off greaseproof paper and place on a rack. Cool for 20 minutes.
  - adrian_b 4y ago
    Another poster has already given a good recipe. Besides such more elaborate recipes, after a little experimentation it is also possible to make bread with simplified recipes and preparation. For example, in most days I make a bread to be eaten at breakfast, which needs less than 20 minutes for making, distributed over a duration of less than an hour. It is baked in a microwave oven, which takes much less time than in a conventional oven and which is perfectly reproducible (the time depends on the microwave oven and on the amount of dough, so it must be found by experiments; in my oven @ 1000 W I use 13 minutes for dough made of 500 g of wheat flour, in a glass vessel covered by a lid). Sometimes I add various spices, but even pure bread made only of wheat flour and water can be very good. I make the dough from wheat floor (with 12% proteins) + water having 75% of the mass of the floor. The dough is kneaded for a few minutes in a glass bowl, until becoming homogeneous and elastic. Then it is left 30 minutes, to become cohesive. Then I wash for a few minutes the dough while kneading it, to remove a part of the starch, because I want to obtain a bread with high protein content, which causes more satiety than conventional bread, both due to the high protein content and by being more chewy. Then I bake it and I eat it after it cools enough. Of course, washing the dough is optional. For softer bread, a leavening agent can be used. Nevertheless, when the dough is baked in a microwave oven, due to the internal heating, even the unleavened dough grows about 30% to 40% of what it would grow when leavened, due to the expansion of the incorporated air and water.
- bin_bash 4y ago
  "Nature will castigate those who don't masticate." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horace_Fletcher https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horace_Fletcher
kaibee 4y ago
> It's also important that you eat stuff that makes you feel full, fibers and greens. Changing diet also changed my taste, so I crave more healthy things now, while the food I used to eat honestly don't appeal to me any longer or tastes empty. Having tried this, by basically eating a lot of carrots, its uh, not the same as being full/satiated. Feeling like your stomach is full is just a completely different feeling from feeling like you ate a satiating meal.
- rojobuffalo 4y ago
  not to get down in the weeds but carrots aren't that fibrous, but their *available fiber content goes up 2.5x when you cook them, from about 2g per stick to 5g. leafy greens, especially kale, are better for filling up. and you still need protein and fat on top of that.
  - Tagbert 4y ago
    How does boiling increase the fiber content of carrots? Where does the extra fiber come from?
    - rojobuffalo 4y ago
      boiling breaks down cell walls which makes nutrients more available. i'm not an expert but i read about it somewhere.
  - kaibee 4y ago
    I will try this.
- jjtheblunt 4y ago
  I wonder if the satiated feeling isn't from volume but from some nutrient showing up in blood or in intestinal detectors for something signaled as in short supply.
  - newsclues 4y ago
guerrilla 4y ago
That's only half the adaptation though. You can decrease the volume, but also decrease the frequency by sticking to a strict schedule. Don't _ever_ eat outside of the normal times that you should eat and your appetite at all other times will decrease. Your body learns. The next part is just my own made-up opinion but: I think this is also why you shouldn't under-eat because then maybe your body won't learn because it actually thinks its starving and so it won't adapt to the smaller volume and lower frequency.
thelittleone 4y ago
I believe it goes beyond merely stomach size. How much someone eats is also influenced by their threshold of appetite / hunger before triggering the response to eat. I go through phases where I make a decision to eat less (and feel a bit hungry) and after some days it becomes normal to the point it no longer triggers me to eat. My appetite is recalibrated and I doubt my stomach has shrunk that fast. So I feel there is a substantial mental aspect to it beyond the shrinking and enlarging of the gut. And or course then there's the cultural habit / ritual of eating 3 times a day.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
kif 4y ago
AFAIK the stomach remains the same size, but what changes is how your body processes hunger. I've noticed while fasting that after a while, my body gets used to reduced food intake. Then I can get full by eating considerably less than what I'd call a normal sized meal.
notjoemama 4y ago
> If you cut down portion size your stomach will shrink over time. That too is a half truth. It's not just that the stomach's available volume decreases that a feeling of appetite is satiated. Smaller portions of rich foods can do this, sometimes. Eating slower can but only if the right foods are consumed to help trigger the biochemical response (not vanishing calories). There is actually a feedback mechanism and it's not as cut and dry as fill the space = I'm done. I recognize I've only given a high level talking point and I apologize that I can't recant the physiology and chemical pathways that perform this function. Maybe someone in the medical field can chime and and fill the gaps we're both creating? I happen to be the skinny one in a very obese family and have probably spent too much time time to figure this out.

by sigg3 4y ago

adrian_b 4y ago

For increased satiety, even when eating little, an additional factor is that the food should not be too soft, like most of the industrially made food is, but it should need some time of vigorous chewing. There are many vegetables, fruits and nuts that require a decent amount of chewing. There are also some kinds of home-made bread that require much more chewing than the industrial soft bread, while also being much tastier than the commercial bread (when eaten immediately after baking; the commercial bread is optimized for long shelf life).

bollu 4y ago
Got any chewey bread recipes?
- ljf 4y ago
  My homemade sour dough is always chewy and tough, but I love it! [ ] Thursday [ ] 8am - if starter hasn't been used for 4 weeks or more; feed starter 30g flour and 30g of water [ ] Thursday evening weigh out flour and salt as below into two bowls, and cover. Get water jug, yeast and teaspoon ready. Keep starter in the fridge until needed [ ] Friday: [ ] 1. (8am) Mix 100g of Starter, 200g white flour, 50g wholemeal flour, 200g warm water. Mix and cover. This is the Levain, set aside somewhere room temperature - if you house is very cold you can use extra starter. [ ] 2. (1pm) Five hours later, in a big bowl mix 100 of white flour, 300g of wholemeal flour, 10g of salt and 330g warm water. Stand for 20 minutes, uncovered. [ ] 3. (1.20pm) Add a quarter tea spoon of instant yeast and 300g of the levain made this morning to the big bowl, mix all together (leftover levain add to starter you have in the fridge - save for next time or mix and give half to someone else). [ ] 4.1 (2.30pm) 1st fold. Over the next 2 hours, fold the dough 3 times with wet hands. Roughly mix and blend the dough, no need to kneed. [ ] 4.2 (3.30pm) 2nd fold [ ] 4.3 (4.30pm) 3rd fold [ ] 5. (6pm, approx 5 hours after step 2.) Shape into a ball and place on greaseproof paper in a large bowl. Put in fridge till tomorrow morning. [ ] Saturday: [ ] 6. (8am) Remove from fridge. Preheat oven and a cast-iron pot to 245 deg C [ ] 7. Score top of loaf and place with greaseproof paper in the heated pot and bake for 20 minutes. Remove lid and cook for 25 mins more. Will sound hollow(ish) when tapped once baked. Crust should be a dark brown. [ ] 8. Remove from pot, take off greaseproof paper and place on a rack. Cool for 20 minutes.
- adrian_b 4y ago
  Another poster has already given a good recipe. Besides such more elaborate recipes, after a little experimentation it is also possible to make bread with simplified recipes and preparation. For example, in most days I make a bread to be eaten at breakfast, which needs less than 20 minutes for making, distributed over a duration of less than an hour. It is baked in a microwave oven, which takes much less time than in a conventional oven and which is perfectly reproducible (the time depends on the microwave oven and on the amount of dough, so it must be found by experiments; in my oven @ 1000 W I use 13 minutes for dough made of 500 g of wheat flour, in a glass vessel covered by a lid). Sometimes I add various spices, but even pure bread made only of wheat flour and water can be very good. I make the dough from wheat floor (with 12% proteins) + water having 75% of the mass of the floor. The dough is kneaded for a few minutes in a glass bowl, until becoming homogeneous and elastic. Then it is left 30 minutes, to become cohesive. Then I wash for a few minutes the dough while kneading it, to remove a part of the starch, because I want to obtain a bread with high protein content, which causes more satiety than conventional bread, both due to the high protein content and by being more chewy. Then I bake it and I eat it after it cools enough. Of course, washing the dough is optional. For softer bread, a leavening agent can be used. Nevertheless, when the dough is baked in a microwave oven, due to the internal heating, even the unleavened dough grows about 30% to 40% of what it would grow when leavened, due to the expansion of the incorporated air and water.
bin_bash 4y ago
"Nature will castigate those who don't masticate." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horace_Fletcher https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horace_Fletcher

kaibee 4y ago

> It's also important that you eat stuff that makes you feel full, fibers and greens. Changing diet also changed my taste, so I crave more healthy things now, while the food I used to eat honestly don't appeal to me any longer or tastes empty. Having tried this, by basically eating a lot of carrots, its uh, not the same as being full/satiated. Feeling like your stomach is full is just a completely different feeling from feeling like you ate a satiating meal.

rojobuffalo 4y ago
not to get down in the weeds but carrots aren't that fibrous, but their *available fiber content goes up 2.5x when you cook them, from about 2g per stick to 5g. leafy greens, especially kale, are better for filling up. and you still need protein and fat on top of that.
- Tagbert 4y ago
  How does boiling increase the fiber content of carrots? Where does the extra fiber come from?
  - rojobuffalo 4y ago
    boiling breaks down cell walls which makes nutrients more available. i'm not an expert but i read about it somewhere.
- kaibee 4y ago
  I will try this.
jjtheblunt 4y ago
I wonder if the satiated feeling isn't from volume but from some nutrient showing up in blood or in intestinal detectors for something signaled as in short supply.
- newsclues 4y ago

guerrilla 4y ago

That's only half the adaptation though. You can decrease the volume, but also decrease the frequency by sticking to a strict schedule. Don't _ever_ eat outside of the normal times that you should eat and your appetite at all other times will decrease. Your body learns. The next part is just my own made-up opinion but: I think this is also why you shouldn't under-eat because then maybe your body won't learn because it actually thinks its starving and so it won't adapt to the smaller volume and lower frequency.

thelittleone 4y ago

I believe it goes beyond merely stomach size. How much someone eats is also influenced by their threshold of appetite / hunger before triggering the response to eat. I go through phases where I make a decision to eat less (and feel a bit hungry) and after some days it becomes normal to the point it no longer triggers me to eat. My appetite is recalibrated and I doubt my stomach has shrunk that fast. So I feel there is a substantial mental aspect to it beyond the shrinking and enlarging of the gut. And or course then there's the cultural habit / ritual of eating 3 times a day.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

kif 4y ago

AFAIK the stomach remains the same size, but what changes is how your body processes hunger. I've noticed while fasting that after a while, my body gets used to reduced food intake. Then I can get full by eating considerably less than what I'd call a normal sized meal.

notjoemama 4y ago

> If you cut down portion size your stomach will shrink over time. That too is a half truth. It's not just that the stomach's available volume decreases that a feeling of appetite is satiated. Smaller portions of rich foods can do this, sometimes. Eating slower can but only if the right foods are consumed to help trigger the biochemical response (not vanishing calories). There is actually a feedback mechanism and it's not as cut and dry as fill the space = I'm done. I recognize I've only given a high level talking point and I apologize that I can't recant the physiology and chemical pathways that perform this function. Maybe someone in the medical field can chime and and fill the gaps we're both creating? I happen to be the skinny one in a very obese family and have probably spent too much time time to figure this out.