5 ms·

As Derek Lowe summarized in the accompanying blogpost[0], the main recommendations of this article are: “better decisions about what data to collect and better

by balsam 4y ago

As Derek Lowe summarized in the accompanying blogpost[0], the main recommendations of this article are: “better decisions about what data to collect and better ways to collect it.” Yeah, sometimes people dont get their point across very well, but it is there. [0]https://www.science.org/content/blog-post/better-trials-someday https://www.science.org/content/blog-post/better-trials-some...

taeric 4y ago
I was hoping to find a bit more than, "do better." What are the decisions? How can they be made better? What data? Why aren't we collecting it already?
- balsam 4y ago
  In TFA they mention a insightful case study: “Most clinical trials try to track every single possible data point about patients, thus inflating costs. But Landry and Horby’s trial could carefully strip down the data needed to the essentials, focusing on information that could easily be collected from medical records. “ A couple sentences later: “The result was a single study, RECOVERY, that determined more than any other what medicines could help Covid patients.” As for why we arent’t doing better, just last week there was a HN post that I personally enjoyed: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33545209 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33545209 EDIT: The RECOVERY trial has its own wikipedia page, more references therein if you are interested in the details https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RECOVERY_Trial https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RECOVERY_Trial
  - taeric 4y ago
    Yeah... This don't really sound prescriptive. The "single study" that looked at COVID is particularly annoying. It wasn't done in isolation with no knowledge of every other study. Such that there is virtually no way to jump straight to that study. Specifically for stripping down the data. That was informed by every other study.
- vxNsr 4y ago
  Yup “do better” is the generic siren of those who like to complain but never have anything to contribute.
ekianjo 4y ago
better means what?
- rocqua 4y ago
  Beter decisions about what to collect would, for example be A higher ratio of 'progress towards definitive answer' per dollar spend. Perhaps with a smidge of, making people more likely to participate. Better ways to collect data has two routes for improvement. The boring one is automation. Just chuck smart watches on the subjects and have those track data on a hourly basis rather than monthly doctor visits. The exciting but scary one is standardized health records keeping that allows tracking outcomes. That also requires a process for analyzing that data on a national scale whilst preserving privacy. The crypto to do that exists, but getting trust will be difficult. There could be other ways of doing analysis without hurting privacy too much. This system could then be used whenever 'real-world-data' is appropriate. Importantly, it could also be used to track data from the randomized medical trials!

by balsam 4y ago

taeric 4y ago

I was hoping to find a bit more than, "do better." What are the decisions? How can they be made better? What data? Why aren't we collecting it already?

balsam 4y ago
In TFA they mention a insightful case study: “Most clinical trials try to track every single possible data point about patients, thus inflating costs. But Landry and Horby’s trial could carefully strip down the data needed to the essentials, focusing on information that could easily be collected from medical records. “ A couple sentences later: “The result was a single study, RECOVERY, that determined more than any other what medicines could help Covid patients.” As for why we arent’t doing better, just last week there was a HN post that I personally enjoyed: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33545209 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33545209 EDIT: The RECOVERY trial has its own wikipedia page, more references therein if you are interested in the details https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RECOVERY_Trial https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RECOVERY_Trial
- taeric 4y ago
  Yeah... This don't really sound prescriptive. The "single study" that looked at COVID is particularly annoying. It wasn't done in isolation with no knowledge of every other study. Such that there is virtually no way to jump straight to that study. Specifically for stripping down the data. That was informed by every other study.
vxNsr 4y ago
Yup “do better” is the generic siren of those who like to complain but never have anything to contribute.

ekianjo 4y ago

better means what?

rocqua 4y ago
Beter decisions about what to collect would, for example be A higher ratio of 'progress towards definitive answer' per dollar spend. Perhaps with a smidge of, making people more likely to participate. Better ways to collect data has two routes for improvement. The boring one is automation. Just chuck smart watches on the subjects and have those track data on a hourly basis rather than monthly doctor visits. The exciting but scary one is standardized health records keeping that allows tracking outcomes. That also requires a process for analyzing that data on a national scale whilst preserving privacy. The crypto to do that exists, but getting trust will be difficult. There could be other ways of doing analysis without hurting privacy too much. This system could then be used whenever 'real-world-data' is appropriate. Importantly, it could also be used to track data from the randomized medical trials!