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> For me crypto was always Ponzi scheme and nothing more, but it is because I don't laundry money or sell drugs, so I am not the target for crypto. I find Bitc

> For me crypto was always Ponzi scheme and nothing more, but it is because I don't laundry money or sell drugs, so I am not the target for crypto. I find Bitcoin very intriguing because unlike TradFi it is not built in debt. Every dollar you have in your account is someone else's debt to you. Which is also the reason Bitcoin gets compared so much to gold! There is a fixed amount of nuggets and no debt is involved. (Yes, I know that about 8% of the gold demand is actually driven by the technology sector, but the majority of gold's price is driven through pure speculation on... nothing productive! Gold's price is mostly driven by greed / price action.) I think if you call gold or Bitcoin a Ponzi, you're using the wrong term. Greater Fool Theory is more fitting.

BobbyJo 4y ago
I think the debt model is more true to what a currency is supposed to represent though. You can ignore the entire regulatory structure and just imagine there was some magic substance that was created out of thin air whenever you gave someone something, and consumed when you received something. Debt is exactly what it would represent. You to others and others to you.
lottin 4y ago
Every dollar that you have is not somebody else's debt. You're completely misinterpreting what a dollar is.
- super256 4y ago
  No, you're wrong. The whole money supply is controlled by the Federal Reserve through purchasing and selling securities. When the FED purchases a security, the money gets deposited in the reserves of commercial banks, which then increases the money in circulation through making loans to consumers and businesses. And the mentioned securities are, uhhh, treasuries! To break it down: If I have 1 dollar in my account, the bank owes me 1 dollar. And this goes all the way up.
  - lottin 4y ago
    You have 1 dollar in your account, and the bank owes you 1 dollar. So you have 2 dollars?
    - super256 4y ago
      I am certain that you're trolling, but I'm giving you the answer anyway: No. When you have 1 dollar in your account, the bank still has the dollar! It's a liability owed to you. Every financial asset is somebody else's liability. Every financial asset is similar to a promissory note. If you sign one, it is your liability, but it would be an asset for the note's holder. This is also true for your bank account. Your account statement is a promissory note that the bank owes you 1 dollar.
coatmatter 4y ago
Gold at least is shiny, dense and virtually indestructible, and we humans naturally value things that draw our attention like that. Gold has also stood the test of time as something that most people appreciate when they see/touch it. It'll always be possible in any country to trade an ounce of gold (in any physical form) for /something/ well above $0. Can this guarantee be as easy to make with Bitcoin or any cryptocurrency of one's choosing? For most normal (non-techy) people, what's the allure of Bitcoin once you remove all the marketing? Perhaps gold indeed still relies on the greater fool, but that fool on average is still less of a fool than the greater fool who has too much "invested" in cryptocurrency.

BobbyJo 4y ago

I think the debt model is more true to what a currency is supposed to represent though. You can ignore the entire regulatory structure and just imagine there was some magic substance that was created out of thin air whenever you gave someone something, and consumed when you received something. Debt is exactly what it would represent. You to others and others to you.

lottin 4y ago

Every dollar that you have is not somebody else's debt. You're completely misinterpreting what a dollar is.

super256 4y ago
No, you're wrong. The whole money supply is controlled by the Federal Reserve through purchasing and selling securities. When the FED purchases a security, the money gets deposited in the reserves of commercial banks, which then increases the money in circulation through making loans to consumers and businesses. And the mentioned securities are, uhhh, treasuries! To break it down: If I have 1 dollar in my account, the bank owes me 1 dollar. And this goes all the way up.
- lottin 4y ago
  You have 1 dollar in your account, and the bank owes you 1 dollar. So you have 2 dollars?
  - super256 4y ago
    I am certain that you're trolling, but I'm giving you the answer anyway: No. When you have 1 dollar in your account, the bank still has the dollar! It's a liability owed to you. Every financial asset is somebody else's liability. Every financial asset is similar to a promissory note. If you sign one, it is your liability, but it would be an asset for the note's holder. This is also true for your bank account. Your account statement is a promissory note that the bank owes you 1 dollar.

coatmatter 4y ago

Gold at least is shiny, dense and virtually indestructible, and we humans naturally value things that draw our attention like that. Gold has also stood the test of time as something that most people appreciate when they see/touch it. It'll always be possible in any country to trade an ounce of gold (in any physical form) for /something/ well above $0. Can this guarantee be as easy to make with Bitcoin or any cryptocurrency of one's choosing? For most normal (non-techy) people, what's the allure of Bitcoin once you remove all the marketing? Perhaps gold indeed still relies on the greater fool, but that fool on average is still less of a fool than the greater fool who has too much "invested" in cryptocurrency.