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This may have been more true during the times of nobility. With modern democracies and market economies, we at least try to have some form of meritocracy. Obvio
by doorman2 4y ago
This may have been more true during the times of nobility. With modern democracies and market economies, we at least try to have some form of meritocracy. Obviously, we fall short in a lot of ways, but the goal is to bring to best to the fore.
- klelatti 4y agoTwo words: Liz Truss
- SergeAx 4y agoLiz Truss fall the victim of higher level party struggle and intrigue, not because she was dumb.
- klelatti 4y agoI'm interested why you say this. The perception in the UK is absolutely that she was not up the job and was removed for that reason.
- SergeAx 4y agoWell, you never get that high in politics if you don't have some traits for that, or you are pushed there by others on purpose. Either way it means she fell victim to intrigue - by getting ousted from PM position or by being installed there on the first place.
- flarg 4y agoAll it proves is that she was good at climbing the greasy pole. She was and remains as thick as two short planks.
- nly 4y agoHer ideas weren't necessarily bad, or her logic flawed, but her execution was bloody terrible. Growth is exactly what the UK economy needs and she recognised that. Now all we're going to get is austerity, higher taxes and misery under Rishi
- cm2012 4y agoIn Obama's memoirs he talks about this. How when he was a community level, then city, then state, then federal level politician how he kept expecting the quality of people/decisions to improve in the big leagues, but that instead it was the same (poor quality) at each level.
- bigthymer 4y agoIs "A Promised Land" a good read? I've had bad experiences in the past reading books by politicians.
- indymike 4y agoThe Peter Principle applies to government, too.
- Gibbon1 4y agoI think what's often behind the Peter Principal is the temperament and skills to gain/hold a job are often/usually not the same skills needed to do the job. And often there is conflict and tension between the two.
- strgcmc 4y agoIt's interesting to compare/contrast that, with thoughts like these: https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/CKpByWmsZ8WmpHtYa/competent-elites https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/CKpByWmsZ8WmpHtYa/competent-... I think both authors can be correct, and both sets of experiences are valid. But I think it's a sign that politics selects for political-competency, which has nearly nothing to do with general intelligence or other forms of competency/expertise.
- riezebos 4y agoWhen listening to podcasts where EU politicians are interviewed it seems like this is less of a problem there. EU politics have a high impact but a low "fame" aspect. Maybe the people that care about impact and not about fame are higher quality politicians?
- 4y ago
- cudgy 4y agoThis sounds logical and hopeful, but even a casual survey of the current lot of political leaders on all sides is very disappointing. Donald Trump, Joe Biden, Kamala Harris, Hillary Clinton, George Bush, Barak Obama, Pete Buttigieg, AOC, and even the once heralded Bernie Sanders (just to name a few) have turned out to be massive failures and disappointments.
- hotpotamus 4y agoAre there political leaders you feel were not disappointing?
- cudgy 4y agoVery few come to mind actually. I’ll mention a few and accept the resulting criticism ;) 2016 version of Bernie Sanders; Jimmy Carter; Dennis Kucinich; and almost any politician willing to stand up against needless wars, as avoiding war is a top priority for me.
- hotpotamus 4y agoWell, I don't know that it's much of a criticism, but I do note which way all those people lean politically. Mostly I just think that the modern world is ungovernable, but then again, I'm not really the optimistic type.
- cudgy 4y agoWhat way do you think they lean politically? Many of them would no longer be considered modern Democrats. For example, 2016 Bernie was for strong borders, avoiding unnecessary war, and breaking away from trade agreements that were unfavorable to American workers. Modern Bernie votes to fund a war in Ukraine and no longer cares about securing the border. The Democratic party of today is socially far more left, but their foreign policy, free speech stances, and economic agenda resembles the old (pre-Trump grenade) Republican party. Weird times.
- 6510 4y ago
- solardev 4y ago> we at least try to have some form of meritocracy lolol
- 6510 4y agoI always preach for "lies we can believe in!", this one would have been nice if it worked.
- readthenotes1 4y agoWith modern democracies, we have people gaining power who are the most willing to do whatever it takes to acquire it. In Athens, they selected by random lot. A much better system.
- tablespoon 4y ago> In Athens, they selected by random lot. A much better system. IIRC, an important corollary to that was they designed their official positions so literally anyone could do the job. That would also have certain benefits regarding oversight, because with simple jobs anyone can check if they're being done correctly (without corruption or incompetence being hidden behind jargon).
- 6510 4y agoThe impossible puzzle is that our most competent men have so many ties to so many businesses that a career in politics becomes impossible.