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If you are outside then probably you've missed the numerous companies offering plastic cards with crypto backing which you can use just like a debit card.

pavlov 4y ago
My brokerage sent me a debit card that's backed by the automatic margin loan on the shares I own. That doesn't mean I'm paying for pizza with AAPL shares. The "crypto debit card" is exactly the same thing.
- tiborsaas 4y ago
  I'm not a financial expert, but that does sound like you are paying with shares. If you didn't have shares you wouldn't have the balance or if you refuse to pay it back you'll lose some shares.
  - pavlov 4y ago
    Sure, the shares are collateral. If their value drops, the brokerage will sell them to cover the expenses I racked up on the Visa card. But it's not like the pizza I bought was priced in AAPL shares! It was priced in dollars. The margin loan isn't material to the payment system. It's the same situation with crypto debit cards. Anything you buy with such a card is priced in USD/EUR/whatever. The crypto behind the scenes makes no difference, just like the AAPL shares in my brokerage account. Hence these crypto-backed cards are not crypto payments in any sense — they're a financial product that already existed.
Mo3 4y ago
I have one of those (Binance) and there is literally 0 benefit to them, and OP comments' statement still holds true. The settlement is still in fiat currency, when you use the card it exchanges your crypto for fiat for settlement. It's not real cryptocurrency payment, neither will it probably ever be. I have been on the inside for a while, and completely agree that there is zero fundamental value to anything, it is purely, 100% speculation and most of it (especially DeFi) is borderline illegal and useless.
- postcynical 4y ago
  I had to buy a flight urgently. But my credit/debit cards had to low of a balance. Topping ul via bank transfer would have taken 4 days over the weekend. Used a crypto backed card, transferrred tokens, and 30min later booked my flight.
- tiborsaas 4y ago
  You seeing zero benefit doesn't mean nobody can benefit from having it. > The settlement is still in fiat currency Who cares how it's done on the bookkeeping side? I care about my account being lowered by the amount of crypto something has cost me and getting the service / goods I want. Again, you seeing zero value is your perspective. Many people see zero value in abstract art.
  - Mo3 4y ago
    > Who cares how it's done on the bookkeeping side? I care about my account being lowered by the amount of crypto something has cost me and getting the service / goods I want. Anybody who understands what cryptocurrency is supposed to be should definitely care about it. There is nothing crypto about these cards, they just liquidate some of your crypto collateral to settle in fiat. You could do this yourself, or use any other random credit card. It's a convenience, but is literally the anti-thesis of cryptocurrency, and/or has nothing to do with cryptocurrency in the first place. The cards are ran by a financial institute or bank and the collateral could be anything. Sure, the card and its convenience and functionality has value. Cryptocurrency plays zero part in it. Funnily enough, what you see as value here is provided by the fiat system and not by cryptocurrency.
    - tiborsaas 4y ago
      I know the tech very well, but I really don't care about how it's settled under the hood. > Cryptocurrency plays zero part in it. Except backing your payment, it really doesn't. > It's a convenience And convenience is value. Not inherently by crypto, but the fact it's possible is an extra benefit. Would you also object that if I spend EUR for a product online in GBP then the seller is not getting EUR?

pavlov 4y ago

My brokerage sent me a debit card that's backed by the automatic margin loan on the shares I own. That doesn't mean I'm paying for pizza with AAPL shares. The "crypto debit card" is exactly the same thing.

tiborsaas 4y ago
I'm not a financial expert, but that does sound like you are paying with shares. If you didn't have shares you wouldn't have the balance or if you refuse to pay it back you'll lose some shares.
- pavlov 4y ago
  Sure, the shares are collateral. If their value drops, the brokerage will sell them to cover the expenses I racked up on the Visa card. But it's not like the pizza I bought was priced in AAPL shares! It was priced in dollars. The margin loan isn't material to the payment system. It's the same situation with crypto debit cards. Anything you buy with such a card is priced in USD/EUR/whatever. The crypto behind the scenes makes no difference, just like the AAPL shares in my brokerage account. Hence these crypto-backed cards are not crypto payments in any sense — they're a financial product that already existed.

Mo3 4y ago

I have one of those (Binance) and there is literally 0 benefit to them, and OP comments' statement still holds true. The settlement is still in fiat currency, when you use the card it exchanges your crypto for fiat for settlement. It's not real cryptocurrency payment, neither will it probably ever be. I have been on the inside for a while, and completely agree that there is zero fundamental value to anything, it is purely, 100% speculation and most of it (especially DeFi) is borderline illegal and useless.

postcynical 4y ago
I had to buy a flight urgently. But my credit/debit cards had to low of a balance. Topping ul via bank transfer would have taken 4 days over the weekend. Used a crypto backed card, transferrred tokens, and 30min later booked my flight.
tiborsaas 4y ago
You seeing zero benefit doesn't mean nobody can benefit from having it. > The settlement is still in fiat currency Who cares how it's done on the bookkeeping side? I care about my account being lowered by the amount of crypto something has cost me and getting the service / goods I want. Again, you seeing zero value is your perspective. Many people see zero value in abstract art.
- Mo3 4y ago
  > Who cares how it's done on the bookkeeping side? I care about my account being lowered by the amount of crypto something has cost me and getting the service / goods I want. Anybody who understands what cryptocurrency is supposed to be should definitely care about it. There is nothing crypto about these cards, they just liquidate some of your crypto collateral to settle in fiat. You could do this yourself, or use any other random credit card. It's a convenience, but is literally the anti-thesis of cryptocurrency, and/or has nothing to do with cryptocurrency in the first place. The cards are ran by a financial institute or bank and the collateral could be anything. Sure, the card and its convenience and functionality has value. Cryptocurrency plays zero part in it. Funnily enough, what you see as value here is provided by the fiat system and not by cryptocurrency.
  - tiborsaas 4y ago
    I know the tech very well, but I really don't care about how it's settled under the hood. > Cryptocurrency plays zero part in it. Except backing your payment, it really doesn't. > It's a convenience And convenience is value. Not inherently by crypto, but the fact it's possible is an extra benefit. Would you also object that if I spend EUR for a product online in GBP then the seller is not getting EUR?