5 ms·

The crypto I buy is not leveraged, it's sitting in my wallet - unlike IOUs, stocks and derivatives. In crypto, leverage exists solely because of people who ar

by _qqm5 4y ago

The crypto I buy is not leveraged, it's sitting in my wallet - unlike IOUs, stocks and derivatives. In crypto, leverage exists solely because of people who aren't doing self-custody and DeFi. They brought this upon themselves.

Forgeties79 4y ago
Genuine question: what are you doing with that crypto anyway if not planning on cashing out back into fiat currency again? My understanding is that the vast majority of cryptos are useless for actually paying for anything and the vast majority of businesses still don’t accept them anyway. So unless you are basically only using and holding BTC (which has a relatively small market of goods that can actually be purchased with it on a daily basis), I’m not really sure what good that crypto is doing for you other than sitting around as a speculative asset which will need to be converted via an exchange.
- _qqm5 4y ago
  Genuine answer: I'm holding my crypto assets until I can exchange them for the goods and services I need. I never exchange any crypto back to fiat. I don't "invest" to make money. It's a currency. I buy it to use it. I might have to hold it for 5 years, maybe 10, maybe 30, or maybe I'll die and crypto will never be successful (a sad thought but possible). But in the meantime I'll do what I can to improve adoption. That includes working on core protocols, improving UX for non-technical users, or writing software that helps vendors with payment integration. I also make an effort to approach business and show that there is demand for crypto payments. This is literally the only way to make crypto successful. All this price action non-sense, and people wanting to get fiat-rich is just unproductive noise to me.
  - MrMan 4y ago
    you should invest your spare cash (no matter what the currency) into actual investments. cash is dead money, and taking a buy and hold approach to foreign exchange trading is probably a bad idea compared to something like (just off the top of my head) the All Weather Portfolio.
    - landemva 4y ago
      King dollar has been disagreeing with you.
  - machina_ex_deus 4y ago
    And the people in the housing bubble mostly lived in those houses, yet they got burned by the crisis nonetheless. You don't properly evaluate the present value of money if you are willing to trade your present money for future money at completely unknown conversion rate and adoption date. Relative to the strategy of buying it when you could use it (which also satisfies your intents) you are practically speculating. You can also look at it like opportunity cost.
    - _qqm5 4y ago
      > You don't properly evaluate the present value of money if you are willing to trade your present money for future money at completely unknown conversion rate and adoption date. Unknown can mean many things. I'm convinced that the fair value of crypto is much, much higher. Adoption is still sluggish and small. I believe in crypto's success, which you might call speculation.
  - yunohn 4y ago
    > This is literally the only way to make crypto successful. All this price action non-sense, and people wanting to get fiat-rich is just unproductive noise to me. Why are you buying crypto regularly? If you don’t care about the price, and you have no idea what the fair value is - what’s the right coin and right amount to hold?
    - _qqm5 4y ago
      Your response is the first that's really interesting. I know that the fair value is much, much higher than it is now, because there is virtually no real adoption. > what’s the right coin and right amount to hold? That's an amazing question. I have truly no idea. I'm investing based on my personal conviction. But this opens up a really interesting discussion about game theory and prediction markets. In a zero-sum prediction market, refusing to play is pareto-optimal and an equilibrium strategy. So you could call me an irrational actor. I'm making a first move based on personal belief, thereby giving you an opportunity to arbitrage me. I believe that the fair value is higher than it is now. If you believe differently, short me. (I'm just joking of course, but I do find your question intriguing, and is something I've been thinking about a lot)
      - gizmo385 4y ago
        > I *know* that the fair value is much, much higher than it is now, because there is virtually no real adoption (emphasis mine) This seems like an incredibly bold claim to make. I would argue that there is little adoption because many have judged crypto to be of little value.
      - yunohn 4y ago
        I often find that crypto enthusiasts who go all-in on game theory are from making rational decisions despite sounding partially logical.
  - systemicdanna 4y ago
    This is such a meaningless stance in the context of this discussion. If only everyone was buying various crypto and holding it in a cold wallet for the next 300 years!.. that’s the only true usage for crypto. No insidious banks, no fiat, no regulations, just pure bits in my virtual wallet until I die.

by _qqm5 4y ago

Forgeties79 4y ago

Genuine question: what are you doing with that crypto anyway if not planning on cashing out back into fiat currency again? My understanding is that the vast majority of cryptos are useless for actually paying for anything and the vast majority of businesses still don’t accept them anyway. So unless you are basically only using and holding BTC (which has a relatively small market of goods that can actually be purchased with it on a daily basis), I’m not really sure what good that crypto is doing for you other than sitting around as a speculative asset which will need to be converted via an exchange.

_qqm5 4y ago
Genuine answer: I'm holding my crypto assets until I can exchange them for the goods and services I need. I never exchange any crypto back to fiat. I don't "invest" to make money. It's a currency. I buy it to use it. I might have to hold it for 5 years, maybe 10, maybe 30, or maybe I'll die and crypto will never be successful (a sad thought but possible). But in the meantime I'll do what I can to improve adoption. That includes working on core protocols, improving UX for non-technical users, or writing software that helps vendors with payment integration. I also make an effort to approach business and show that there is demand for crypto payments. This is literally the only way to make crypto successful. All this price action non-sense, and people wanting to get fiat-rich is just unproductive noise to me.
- MrMan 4y ago
  you should invest your spare cash (no matter what the currency) into actual investments. cash is dead money, and taking a buy and hold approach to foreign exchange trading is probably a bad idea compared to something like (just off the top of my head) the All Weather Portfolio.
  - landemva 4y ago
    King dollar has been disagreeing with you.
- machina_ex_deus 4y ago
  And the people in the housing bubble mostly lived in those houses, yet they got burned by the crisis nonetheless. You don't properly evaluate the present value of money if you are willing to trade your present money for future money at completely unknown conversion rate and adoption date. Relative to the strategy of buying it when you could use it (which also satisfies your intents) you are practically speculating. You can also look at it like opportunity cost.
  - _qqm5 4y ago
    > You don't properly evaluate the present value of money if you are willing to trade your present money for future money at completely unknown conversion rate and adoption date. Unknown can mean many things. I'm convinced that the fair value of crypto is much, much higher. Adoption is still sluggish and small. I believe in crypto's success, which you might call speculation.
- yunohn 4y ago
  > This is literally the only way to make crypto successful. All this price action non-sense, and people wanting to get fiat-rich is just unproductive noise to me. Why are you buying crypto regularly? If you don’t care about the price, and you have no idea what the fair value is - what’s the right coin and right amount to hold?
  - _qqm5 4y ago
    Your response is the first that's really interesting. I know that the fair value is much, much higher than it is now, because there is virtually no real adoption. > what’s the right coin and right amount to hold? That's an amazing question. I have truly no idea. I'm investing based on my personal conviction. But this opens up a really interesting discussion about game theory and prediction markets. In a zero-sum prediction market, refusing to play is pareto-optimal and an equilibrium strategy. So you could call me an irrational actor. I'm making a first move based on personal belief, thereby giving you an opportunity to arbitrage me. I believe that the fair value is higher than it is now. If you believe differently, short me. (I'm just joking of course, but I do find your question intriguing, and is something I've been thinking about a lot)
    - gizmo385 4y ago
      > I *know* that the fair value is much, much higher than it is now, because there is virtually no real adoption (emphasis mine) This seems like an incredibly bold claim to make. I would argue that there is little adoption because many have judged crypto to be of little value.
    - yunohn 4y ago
      I often find that crypto enthusiasts who go all-in on game theory are from making rational decisions despite sounding partially logical.
- systemicdanna 4y ago
  This is such a meaningless stance in the context of this discussion. If only everyone was buying various crypto and holding it in a cold wallet for the next 300 years!.. that’s the only true usage for crypto. No insidious banks, no fiat, no regulations, just pure bits in my virtual wallet until I die.