4 ms·

The "purpose" question is easier when someone is trying to kill you - your purpose is to survive. If you zoom out in time and space, considering the Fermi parad

The "purpose" question is easier when someone is trying to kill you - your purpose is to survive. If you zoom out in time and space, considering the Fermi paradox, humanity is in a "default dead" state. This would be true even if climate change, nuclear war, etc was off the table. This implies that humanities purpose is to survive, against all odds. So, if someone is trying to kill you, survive. If they aren't (and I hope that is the case!), try to find ways to help humanity survive in a universe that, if nothing is done, will kill all of us and our descendants sooner rather than later. Now, assuming that we figure it out, and spread life beyond Earth in a sustainable way (which includes making Earth life sustainable), our descendants can address the question of purpose more fully. But until then, our only reasonable purpose is to give them the chance to ask.

avgcorrection 4y ago
> Zoom out. Imagine this hypothetical paradox. An abstract problem. Therefore… This doesn’t tickle me. Maybe if I imagined myself as an Asimov character.
swalsh 4y ago
There's this Ramen place near me that has incredible soup. The dude who runs the place puts his entire self into making the best soup he can. You don't have to change the world and save the human species, it's okay to spend your time trying to make the best soup around because you love watching people smile when they slurp your soup.
- javajosh 4y ago
  Wonderful! Reminds me of "Jiro Dreams of Sushi". That is the quality of most human endeavor, which is neutral, or slightly positive (or negative) on the scale of protecting Life itself. Those who find true meaning and purpose at a human scale are quite fortunate. The purpose I speak of is the best purpose, in the Aristotelian sense, and so should be the purpose of global human leadership, and every individual's experience shaped by that purpose. There is still room for excellent ramen in such a world. And in fact that total commitment, the attainment of "flow", is exceptional and serves as a good example for everyone else. To save Life in the long term will be the task of millions over many years, and the work will be easier with good raman in the belly.
exoterictruth 4y ago
Why are you concerned with the far future of humanity when millions of people don't have access to food, safe shelter, and clean drinking water? I agree with you that we should allow our descendants to ask the purpose question, but there are much more urgent issues. Our purpose should be to first eliminate basic human suffering in the present, and then expand our time horizons periodically after that. These problems are solvable. We can become a post-scarcity society.
- javajosh 4y ago
  I don't think existential risk is so far in the future. Climate change and nuclear holocaust remain urgent threats, and need to be dealt with first, obviously. Just because my first priority is survival doesn't mean I have no other priorities - in general, I think society functions better with more "catch up" mechanics and fewer "win more" mechanics. I am not entirely convinced a "post scarcity" society can be achieved in real life, wonderful SF stories notwithstanding, and indeed if it could be achieved it might have disasterous consequences. Consider the case of FTL flight. An FTL drive would solve this problem. But, it would also make possible doomsday weapons that would inevitably be used against whole planets. In the same way, post-scarcity implies that nothing will be scarce, including really bad things. My conservative believe is that solving our problems are going to be very difficult, from a political and engineering standpoint, and there will be no magic bullet. So: gird yourself for some messy, hard work!
binaryanomaly 4y ago
Survival & reproduction.

avgcorrection 4y ago

> Zoom out. Imagine this hypothetical paradox. An abstract problem. Therefore… This doesn’t tickle me. Maybe if I imagined myself as an Asimov character.

swalsh 4y ago

There's this Ramen place near me that has incredible soup. The dude who runs the place puts his entire self into making the best soup he can. You don't have to change the world and save the human species, it's okay to spend your time trying to make the best soup around because you love watching people smile when they slurp your soup.

javajosh 4y ago
Wonderful! Reminds me of "Jiro Dreams of Sushi". That is the quality of most human endeavor, which is neutral, or slightly positive (or negative) on the scale of protecting Life itself. Those who find true meaning and purpose at a human scale are quite fortunate. The purpose I speak of is the best purpose, in the Aristotelian sense, and so should be the purpose of global human leadership, and every individual's experience shaped by that purpose. There is still room for excellent ramen in such a world. And in fact that total commitment, the attainment of "flow", is exceptional and serves as a good example for everyone else. To save Life in the long term will be the task of millions over many years, and the work will be easier with good raman in the belly.

exoterictruth 4y ago

Why are you concerned with the far future of humanity when millions of people don't have access to food, safe shelter, and clean drinking water? I agree with you that we should allow our descendants to ask the purpose question, but there are much more urgent issues. Our purpose should be to first eliminate basic human suffering in the present, and then expand our time horizons periodically after that. These problems are solvable. We can become a post-scarcity society.

javajosh 4y ago
I don't think existential risk is so far in the future. Climate change and nuclear holocaust remain urgent threats, and need to be dealt with first, obviously. Just because my first priority is survival doesn't mean I have no other priorities - in general, I think society functions better with more "catch up" mechanics and fewer "win more" mechanics. I am not entirely convinced a "post scarcity" society can be achieved in real life, wonderful SF stories notwithstanding, and indeed if it could be achieved it might have disasterous consequences. Consider the case of FTL flight. An FTL drive would solve this problem. But, it would also make possible doomsday weapons that would inevitably be used against whole planets. In the same way, post-scarcity implies that nothing will be scarce, including really bad things. My conservative believe is that solving our problems are going to be very difficult, from a political and engineering standpoint, and there will be no magic bullet. So: gird yourself for some messy, hard work!

binaryanomaly 4y ago

Survival & reproduction.