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Noone taking the other side of that short. Is entirely fallacy/fantasy when people talks about shorting on crypto market. You can't win shorting actual crashe

Noone taking the other side of that short. Is entirely fallacy/fantasy when people talks about shorting on crypto market. You can't win shorting actual crashes in unregulated markets, the only way u win shorting in crypto is that you were lucky to guess what a whale/org was doing at the same time so pretty much a russian roulette Marketmakers are not legit and all the movements are pretty much fabricated, its just not regulated and its obvious

mamonster 4y ago
Is it any better if he is able to liquidate longs based on the balance sheet that he would not have liquidated had he not seen the balance sheet?
- firekvz 4y ago
  we are all ignorants about the reality here, so we are all guessing but when you have to guess stuff about the crypto market, you literally have to think the worst things or the best things and you will be right my guess here is simple, CZ has liquidated everything that can be liquidated that doesnt make him look bad, hes deep in the very same business than FTX/Sam was, he doesnt need to look the balance sheet, chances are his balance sheets are similar or worse haha So he probally liquidated longs if any, he probally did OTCs with other tokens/assets and just kept the FTT as a PR move to pretend he was a nice guy, anyways having an amount of $ "lost" by a token that was never worth anything is still 0 lost, he most likely got those tokens in exchange for other tokens worth nothing, or during ICOs stage so pretty much hes not losing any cash even tho you will read people saying how much he lost, remember all of that is nominal value, not real cash value at the end, the very same reason things are falling now.
adrr 4y ago
If you have enough capital couldn’t you weather the artificial movements to be able to capture the natural downward movement. VTT is going to zero if VTX liquidated in bankruptcy.
matheusmoreira 4y ago
> Noone taking the other side of that short. > Is entirely fallacy/fantasy when people talks about shorting on crypto market. What do you mean by this? I shorted FTT the second I saw the tweet, and then I shorted the entire cryptocurrency market. I successfully made money, so how could it be a fantasy?
- firekvz 4y ago
  You are right, but we are talking about binance shorting big amounts of tokens, not you shorting some amount in their own game Tell me who at the same level of insider info, gonna OTC borrow you millions of FTT for you to short, when most likely that person/entity owning millions of FTT is already trying to protect their value? You have to remember that when you short and you bet for price going down, the other side is betting for price going up or at least for the price to stay at the same levels, the person borrowing you has to be constantly doing DD to be sure that its the right moment to borrow the asset, and its pretty obvious that someone holding big amounts of FTT was/is very aware of whats comming if I was an OTC shorter and had millions of FTT and you see Binance CEO comming to you to short, I inmediatly said no and cashed out those FTT instead of shorting, cause clearly at those levels there is certainty of what they are doing.
  - zeven7 4y ago
    They don't need to short FTT. They can short BTC. This is having a big impact on the whole market, and is going to continue to.
  - matheusmoreira 4y ago
    I only shorted FTT at first. Then I shorted BTC and BNB instead when I realized this was going to crash the market. For some reason BNB was massively overbought yesterday. Binance hype or something. Almost reached 400 USD. I shorted it at the top and watched it melt down to < 300 USD. God I wish I could be this lucky every single time.
- renewiltord 4y ago
  It works, until it doesn't. When volume drops, it's possible to harm lots of people who were short like this by pumping to force liquidation and then handling the liquidation and dumping (taking money from every side). It happened during the Luna/Terra crisis. Shorting LUNA was high risk because there were at least some players who burned others frequently on the path down. Work at a trading firm and we saw the entire thing play out, but we're algorithmic so we weren't set up to take advantage. Though if you're a small player, there's a lot of opportunity here. Some times, the difference between the price for liquidation and the price you can get somewhere else is high. We saw one dude make a quick $300k through a flash loan. The market isn't fully efficient yet, so this opportunity was available for 10 min before someone took it.
treis 4y ago
It's not just FTT/FTX, though. They're probably taking down others with them. Looking at the books gives you an idea of who the "others" are and how screwed they are.

mamonster 4y ago

Is it any better if he is able to liquidate longs based on the balance sheet that he would not have liquidated had he not seen the balance sheet?

firekvz 4y ago
we are all ignorants about the reality here, so we are all guessing but when you have to guess stuff about the crypto market, you literally have to think the worst things or the best things and you will be right my guess here is simple, CZ has liquidated everything that can be liquidated that doesnt make him look bad, hes deep in the very same business than FTX/Sam was, he doesnt need to look the balance sheet, chances are his balance sheets are similar or worse haha So he probally liquidated longs if any, he probally did OTCs with other tokens/assets and just kept the FTT as a PR move to pretend he was a nice guy, anyways having an amount of $ "lost" by a token that was never worth anything is still 0 lost, he most likely got those tokens in exchange for other tokens worth nothing, or during ICOs stage so pretty much hes not losing any cash even tho you will read people saying how much he lost, remember all of that is nominal value, not real cash value at the end, the very same reason things are falling now.

adrr 4y ago

If you have enough capital couldn’t you weather the artificial movements to be able to capture the natural downward movement. VTT is going to zero if VTX liquidated in bankruptcy.

matheusmoreira 4y ago

> Noone taking the other side of that short. > Is entirely fallacy/fantasy when people talks about shorting on crypto market. What do you mean by this? I shorted FTT the second I saw the tweet, and then I shorted the entire cryptocurrency market. I successfully made money, so how could it be a fantasy?

firekvz 4y ago
You are right, but we are talking about binance shorting big amounts of tokens, not you shorting some amount in their own game Tell me who at the same level of insider info, gonna OTC borrow you millions of FTT for you to short, when most likely that person/entity owning millions of FTT is already trying to protect their value? You have to remember that when you short and you bet for price going down, the other side is betting for price going up or at least for the price to stay at the same levels, the person borrowing you has to be constantly doing DD to be sure that its the right moment to borrow the asset, and its pretty obvious that someone holding big amounts of FTT was/is very aware of whats comming if I was an OTC shorter and had millions of FTT and you see Binance CEO comming to you to short, I inmediatly said no and cashed out those FTT instead of shorting, cause clearly at those levels there is certainty of what they are doing.
- zeven7 4y ago
  They don't need to short FTT. They can short BTC. This is having a big impact on the whole market, and is going to continue to.
- matheusmoreira 4y ago
  I only shorted FTT at first. Then I shorted BTC and BNB instead when I realized this was going to crash the market. For some reason BNB was massively overbought yesterday. Binance hype or something. Almost reached 400 USD. I shorted it at the top and watched it melt down to < 300 USD. God I wish I could be this lucky every single time.
renewiltord 4y ago
It works, until it doesn't. When volume drops, it's possible to harm lots of people who were short like this by pumping to force liquidation and then handling the liquidation and dumping (taking money from every side). It happened during the Luna/Terra crisis. Shorting LUNA was high risk because there were at least some players who burned others frequently on the path down. Work at a trading firm and we saw the entire thing play out, but we're algorithmic so we weren't set up to take advantage. Though if you're a small player, there's a lot of opportunity here. Some times, the difference between the price for liquidation and the price you can get somewhere else is high. We saw one dude make a quick $300k through a flash loan. The market isn't fully efficient yet, so this opportunity was available for 10 min before someone took it.

treis 4y ago

It's not just FTT/FTX, though. They're probably taking down others with them. Looking at the books gives you an idea of who the "others" are and how screwed they are.