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I am wondering why this is here on HN. The article speaks of philosophy, religion and human truth. Bob Dylan said "I find the religiosity and philosophy in the

I am wondering why this is here on HN. The article speaks of philosophy, religion and human truth. Bob Dylan said "I find the religiosity and philosophy in the music. I've learned more from the songs than I've learned from rabbis, preachers, evangelists, all of that." Yet the last thread I read was about AI, and how Stable Diffusion is going to make art irrelevant. What struck me about that thread was the cheerful celebration of the death of the human and how it "wouldn't really matter" when "inevitably" nobody would have a reason to express themselves through art, nor audiences the attention to care if anything is human or not. Adapt or die. Accept the final dominance of the machine/Moloch etc. To hackers, is Dylan anything but a curiosity of how music used to mean something? A laughable vestige of "freedom" and "the 60's"? Or is he cited because those Blues songs, the messages within, and the spirituality that Dylan speaks of, are still relevant to the struggle against domination and nihilism?

deleted 4y ago
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Cthulhu_ 4y ago
> I am wondering why this is here on HN. Because people upvoted it; if you think the submission is inappropriate you can flag it for review.
- nonrandomstring 4y ago
  I think it's very appropriate. And I'm wondering if other people think it is for same reasons as I.
MezzoDelCammin 4y ago
Personally, I would define a "hacker" as "curious", "intellectually exploring". Just because most of the HN userbase probably works in / with STEM doesn't mean that's all we do. I'm pretty happy to explore different domains every now and then, so long as I can see some intellectual depth to explore. And I definitely see that in Dylan's music.
georgestrakhov 4y ago
People didn't stop playing chess when computers started to beat them. So even if computers can make better music, why would people stop making music themselves?
sixstringtheory 4y ago
I see things like Stable Diffusion as just another tool in humans’ creativity toolbox. If it leads its enthusiasts into a purely nihilistic state where art loses all meaning to them, that’s their problem. Long after AI, people will still be happy to strum on a guitar, because it feels good. Sure there’s also fame and fortune possible, but I don’t believe those are the sole reasons all people embark on artistic or philosophical pursuits. Some people really are trying to work something out or, again, just feel good.
- nonrandomstring 4y ago
  Dylan quite famously had a "split" with the folk purists for his love of electric guitar, so isn't sentimental about traditions, tools and technologies. The content he seems to admire in folk and blues could hardly be more scathing of the "violence of the man", making him a paragon of protest and anti-corporatism for 7 decades. Most successful artists seem to trade their right to rail against power for fame, but Dylan still managed to speak powerfully through his BBC Radio 6 Music show, mainly by his playlist choices and adding short, knowing commentary. A message I still think he speaks is on art as a tool for social change, which seems increasingly crushed by the nihilism of "comfort and convenience".
  - sixstringtheory 4y ago
    I think I get that, but I wonder if all artists make art with the explicit intention to instigate social change, or if some simply express their dissatisfaction and others pick it up and run with it? That’s a funny thing about the subjectivity of art, people can run in unexpected directions. See Republicans using Bruce Springsteen songs at rallys. I also wonder about the inevitability of people who wouldn’t lift a finger for a social cause anyways. I don’t think it’s inevitable so I agree that there is danger in pulling more people into potential nihilism. I really seek out and admire those artists that seem to just not care what others think about them or their art and engage in a purely self-indulgent expression. I don’t think people will just stop that, it might go more underground though. I wouldn’t be surprised by that as a reaction to this centralized, always-online trend we’re in the midst of (and previously, gameshow fame like American Idol).

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Cthulhu_ 4y ago

> I am wondering why this is here on HN. Because people upvoted it; if you think the submission is inappropriate you can flag it for review.

nonrandomstring 4y ago
I think it's very appropriate. And I'm wondering if other people think it is for same reasons as I.

MezzoDelCammin 4y ago

Personally, I would define a "hacker" as "curious", "intellectually exploring". Just because most of the HN userbase probably works in / with STEM doesn't mean that's all we do. I'm pretty happy to explore different domains every now and then, so long as I can see some intellectual depth to explore. And I definitely see that in Dylan's music.

georgestrakhov 4y ago

People didn't stop playing chess when computers started to beat them. So even if computers can make better music, why would people stop making music themselves?

sixstringtheory 4y ago

I see things like Stable Diffusion as just another tool in humans’ creativity toolbox. If it leads its enthusiasts into a purely nihilistic state where art loses all meaning to them, that’s their problem. Long after AI, people will still be happy to strum on a guitar, because it feels good. Sure there’s also fame and fortune possible, but I don’t believe those are the sole reasons all people embark on artistic or philosophical pursuits. Some people really are trying to work something out or, again, just feel good.

nonrandomstring 4y ago
Dylan quite famously had a "split" with the folk purists for his love of electric guitar, so isn't sentimental about traditions, tools and technologies. The content he seems to admire in folk and blues could hardly be more scathing of the "violence of the man", making him a paragon of protest and anti-corporatism for 7 decades. Most successful artists seem to trade their right to rail against power for fame, but Dylan still managed to speak powerfully through his BBC Radio 6 Music show, mainly by his playlist choices and adding short, knowing commentary. A message I still think he speaks is on art as a tool for social change, which seems increasingly crushed by the nihilism of "comfort and convenience".
- sixstringtheory 4y ago
  I think I get that, but I wonder if all artists make art with the explicit intention to instigate social change, or if some simply express their dissatisfaction and others pick it up and run with it? That’s a funny thing about the subjectivity of art, people can run in unexpected directions. See Republicans using Bruce Springsteen songs at rallys. I also wonder about the inevitability of people who wouldn’t lift a finger for a social cause anyways. I don’t think it’s inevitable so I agree that there is danger in pulling more people into potential nihilism. I really seek out and admire those artists that seem to just not care what others think about them or their art and engage in a purely self-indulgent expression. I don’t think people will just stop that, it might go more underground though. I wouldn’t be surprised by that as a reaction to this centralized, always-online trend we’re in the midst of (and previously, gameshow fame like American Idol).