31 ms·

I plan to leave tech to pursue art

167 points by ifvictr 4y ago

ArtWomb 4y ago
Learning blender myself and this character modeling looks unique ;) I know people always say "we should start splinter group X". But a gallery for hackers to show off serious art is always welcome. Like Postmasters in NYC!
cercatrova 4y ago
Some thoughts: - Reminds me of a GitHub commentor saying they left tech to build furniture out of wood ("I no longer build software" [0]). - AI art might eat your lunch, especially in the concept art world. The main guy on Twitter who put out the thread about Stable Diffusion was a concept artist [1], and I think concept artists, graphic designers and generally non-fine-art artists will be hit the hardest. - The part about a more diverse player roster was interesting given that ATVI use a tool for it, although not for Overwatch apparently [2]. Some people were outraged online (on both sides of the political spectrum) but personally I don't see a problem with it. People may not necessarily remember the various axes on which others operate (race, class, gender, sexuality, etc), so there's nothing wrong with a tool that can help people analyze that and create characters for that. It reminds me of the outrage doctors first had over needing checklists for tasks, but they actually do work when studied. They're just tools, nothing more, nothing less. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24541964 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24541964 [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32461138 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32461138 [2] https://www.pcgamer.com/overwatch-creators-explain-they-didnt-use-kings-creepy-diversity-charts/ https://www.pcgamer.com/overwatch-creators-explain-they-didn...
- rhacker 4y ago
  AI won't eat lunch, but it may crowd the space with more people getting paid less. A marketing person can't sit in front of Stable Diffusion and work it towards the campaign they want. They still need an art department that can iterate and make it match the campaign. The artist may very well be sitting in front of some iteration of stable diffusion/imagen/dalle but they still need to discern between AI generated outputs that work and that don't, and to iterate on it until it's right.
  - aiappreciator 4y ago
    Why do you think an 'art department' is still needed? The only reason why in-house art departments are needed, is because previously its hard to communicate 'exactly what you want' to an artist, hence in-housing to reduce communication friction. In the future, the marketing guy, can just create a draft/visual guide through AI, and send it to some outsourced artist to refine. The outsourced artist can be from any country, because again, language for precise communication is less important. Competition is going to be brutal, especially for more traditional corporate art (The standard corporate memphis style can already be perfectly executed by SD+dreambooth, because its so easy to draw) Much better to be in the comics/animation/movie business, where demand will boom in response to drastically improved quality.
    - user_named 4y ago
      If you make marketing create art and talk to outsourced creators then guess what, you've turned the marketing department into and art department. Clearly the art department is still needed - according to yourself.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - Borrible 4y ago
      I heard a talk last week from a co-founder of a social first agency who no longer hires storyboarders because it's cheaper and faster for his agency to make them themselves with freely available generative AI. They also use AI tools for creative direction and text generation.
      - LegitShady 4y ago
        Before you declare this important find out if the product is any good. Any sweatshop can cut some jobs and replace them with a shit ai artist but how are the storyboards and how do they translate into the final product. There are many companies that do foolish things to replace a cheaply paid artist because they can't see past the savings and into how it affects the product. If their storyboarder could be replaced completely by AI they needed a better one.
- eyelidlessness 4y ago
  > AI art might eat your lunch Show me an artist who will regret their lunch being eaten, and I’ll show you an artist who worked and/or slept through breakfast and dinner.
eludwig 4y ago
The grass is always greener! :-D I smile because I left commercial art back in the 80's to become a software developer! More power to Laim and I hope it works out well for him, but I have my doubts. Working as a full-time (especially on-staff) artist answerable to an Art Director sucks!! Artists are not respected, paid terribly and just generally considered disposable. At least that's how it was in my day. Again, Liam, go for it, but keep your eyes open going into it! Some things are better left as hobbies (which I do not consider a dirty word)!
- JKCalhoun 4y ago
  I stood at a fork in the road, so to speak, when I was kicked out of the house and had to decide whether to pursue art or tech (I enjoyed both). It was clear to me tech would pay the bills — the art I could do in my spare time. Retired (am I?) now, I can do all the art I want.
  - canpan 4y ago
    This is the way I plan to go! I love coding and I have my own dream projects. My plan is to earn enough to be independent and follow my dreams. Not retired yet, but collected some nest egg. Since then, I stress less, only work on what I find interesting and speak up when I want to. Funny part: I only got raises faster this way.
    - kinleyd 4y ago
      It's a risk/reward thing. Some people go all in with their passion first, consequences be damned, and it pays off. Others, I think the larger portion, aren't so lucky. Conventional wisdom is to take the safe job first, and then go from there - the risk here is never getting out of that rut. It's a hard decision, but being really focused on defining and attaining what independence is for you, is the key to taking that safe job first. My 2c.
      - dinosaurdynasty 4y ago
        Being in a rut is better than being homeless.
forgotmypw17 4y ago
I did this, and I'm happy. Caveat is that my medium is code.
- eyelidlessness 4y ago
  There’s a wealth of expression to be explored in art as code. Don’t be too hasty calling it a caveat! And I’m glad you’re happy!
danielvaughn 4y ago
Funny, I left art for tech. Making art is intrinsically rewarding but doing it for money can be absolute hell. Best of luck to op.
- ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
  I was an artist. A fairly decent one (I don't really have a gallery of my stuff up, anymore, but here's a couple[0-1]). That was a while ago (a long while ago. Over 35 years). I figured out that even a top-shelf artist (and I don't think that was my destiny) wouldn't make as much as mediocre programmer. Nowadays, I have sort of "run off to join the circus." I write software for free. [0] https://littlegreenviper.com/art/Cavalier.png https://littlegreenviper.com/art/Cavalier.png [1] https://littlegreenviper.com/art/Sentinels.png https://littlegreenviper.com/art/Sentinels.png
  - bombcar 4y ago
    Now a programmer that can do art? That may come in useful!
    - ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
      I do most of my own graphic assets. I know there’s many better artists, out there, but I’m good enough for government work.
  - djha-skin 4y ago
    Pretty dope drawings.
    - ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
      Thanks! But that was long ago. There’s a picture of Arteeste Chris, back then, in this story: https://littlegreenviper.com/miscellany/the-road-most-traveled-by/ https://littlegreenviper.com/miscellany/the-road-most-travel...
  - danielvaughn 4y ago
pushedx 4y ago
There are some GDC talks that give insight into the concept art industry, e.g. https://youtu.be/CYbYvImd7Bw https://youtu.be/CYbYvImd7Bw The general sense that I get from that talk about what it’s like to work in concept art is not sunshine and rainbows.
user_named 4y ago
I like the author's website. It's an interesting idea to be able to list bullet points of what you did in a month (not too granular), add recipes etc. Really becomes your own space.
deleted 4y ago
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blondin 4y ago
to echo other replies here, OP might be idealizing the artistic field. why not do both, until you can only do one? that's my own plan. by the way, concept art is one of the hardest, if not the hardest field in art. these people crank out designs upon designs. and if Feng Zhu didn't make an entire YouTube channel showing what they do, i would have never known they existed. edit: well, other pages on his website suggest that OP already did what he said. good luck, pal!
djha-skin 4y ago
> In the near future I want to become a concept artist in the games industry Worst industry ever by all the accounts I've heard. Part of the compensation package is that you are working in the gaming industry. Long hours, lousy pay, ill treatment. Go for the art mate but pursue a different industry.
- aiappreciator 4y ago
  Its also literally the worst type of artist to be. Concept art is the most vulnerable type of art to AI. AI already does concept art way better than humans, 1 concept artist can now do the job of 10. Because AI is good at variation and creativity, bad at detail/coherence, concept art favors the former, needs less of the latter. Why doesn't OP MAKE games instead of being a mere artist? If you can program, and have a passion for art, you can just make indie games, think of the undertale legend.
  - JKCalhoun 4y ago
    I'm not worried about competition from "AI art" — am I just stupid and ill-informed? Pursuing game concept-art though appears to me to be a drag simply because of the sameness of it. I know the author of the article thinks it's become a wide open field for creativity but my eye stills see the same fantasy-super-hero-manga genre that probably keeps computer games from being seen as deserving of being called "art" to society at large.
    - dumpsterdiver 4y ago
      The thing I find frightening about AI image generation is the speed of iteration. Some of the images generated by Midjourney within seconds would take a human artist quite a long time to create. You can take a complete work from a paid human artist and run it through some prompts to get closer to the result you were looking for while retaining most of the original work. Even if AI don't completely displace concept artists in the immediate future, it will certainly displace at least some portion of a human concept artist's workflow. I think the "detail work" for concept art is a good candidate to be offloaded to AI. Why pay an artist to paint every blade of grass when you can just take their rough draft and apply a series of "incredibly detailed grass texture" (etc) prompts to it? Imo, the writing on the wall is pretty clear. While I'm sure that human concept artists will continue to find work, I'm pretty sure they'll be fighting an uphill battle, and probably won't feel very valued after awhile.
HiroshiSan 4y ago
I did something similar though I never made it into tech, I dropped out of a bachelor's in math to pursue art, this was roughly 5 years ago and it's been a tough journey, I wish you the best of luck. Some resources that will help you a long the way: youtube: proko steve huston steven zapata ahmed aldoori sinix nma.art watts atelier schoolism Try to find a local life drawing class and go every single week. Animation specific check out Toniko Pantoja, ModerndayJames. I'm currently trying to change my relationship to art from something I pursue to make money, to something I enjoy doing to fuel my soul. I haven't drawn in a couple months, but I've come to terms that it's something I'll always be pursuing, in what capacity I'm not sure, but art, is the coolest thing that's ever come into my life.
- pianoben 4y ago
  > I'm currently trying to change my relationship to art from something I pursue to make money, to something I enjoy doing to fuel my soul. This may not be a useful anecdote for those who want to thread the needle between passion and profession, but I'll never forget the day that I decided, really decided, to switch from a piano performance degree to a CS degree. My playing immediately improved - I was relaxed, and things just flowed. The minute I stopped pinning my hopes and worries for the future on my art, the minute I stopped trying to force perfection, it blossomed on its own. I don't know what lesson, if any, to draw from that experience, but there it is. I tend to think that shedding the egotistical attachment to professional success was the key. (it just transferred over to programming, but hey, turns out there are lots of people who will pay for that).
bluquark 4y ago
I'd recommend checking out books on career transitions before pulling the trigger, for example The Squiggly Career and Refuse to Choose. Also try reaching out to working artists and ask them to a coffee to discuss what the life is like: many people actually welcome the opportunity to give a stranger the advice they wish they had known when they were younger.
cpsns 4y ago
Lots of cynicism here, typical whenever art is compared to tech, but I wish him the best. Might as well give it a shot and see how it goes, you can always fall back into tech if needed later on.
- Baeocystin 4y ago
  Hell, I welded in a shipyard for a while after the first .com crash. Fallback skills of all flavors are useful!
  - tartoran 4y ago
    Plus a break from the industry is healthy anyway even if one needs to reskill a bit upon reentry.
LiamHz 4y ago
Hi! I'm the author of this post -- it was an unlisted draft that I shared with a few friends, was planning to rewrite most of this before publishing. Please forgive the rough edges Main changes I'd make to this article - Agreed with others that I might be naive, but I'm 20 y/o and now's the right time to shoot for my dreams rather than settle - I'm applying to animation school soon (Sheridan). I started coding when I was 12, I expect this career change to take a few years, and am in it for the long haul - My worst case is I don't enjoy working in art, and go back to tech. I don't believe you can make a successful career change without going all-in Happy to answer any questions :) Made a little music video with some of my art if you'd like to take a peek https://twitter.com/LiamHinzman/status/1589660449271959552 https://twitter.com/LiamHinzman/status/1589660449271959552
- beckingz 4y ago
  Take names friend, good luck with your future endeavors!
- t0bia_s 4y ago
  I have degree from film animation, one year in indie game development and for now I'm an visual artist freelancer over 7 years. To be honest, I cannot say that make living by what is your hobby is good decision. It could easily became just work that needs to be done. Which is fine if you'll do it with passion. But especially in art it is huge difference between creativity for contract and creativity for expressing yourself. Those in second category are extremely lucky if able to make living. Also you would probably not spend your free time by doing art.
- leetrout 4y ago
  > "I'm just afraid that if I died today, then my life would have amounted to nothing". > When I imagine the ideal version of myself a decade from now, I'm not a grizzled infra engineer or a founder who has raised millions of dollars. You are 20. You have a long life ahead of you. Enjoy the exploration and I hope you continue to realize your self.
- pzone 4y ago
  If you commit to eat sleep and breathe art and you are lucky enough to never get tired of it you will succeed. Draw and paint as much as you physically can. Keep an entrepreneur’s mindset and hustle. Be prepared to use technology to stay competitive. Try out 3d, VR, AI, everything at your disposal.
pmoriarty 4y ago
"The most important thing when creating art is that you know what you want to say with it." When I make art I do so only to please myself and without any preconceived notions or intentions as to what it should be or what messages it's to convey. It completely does not matter to me what, if anything, anyone else gets out of it.
- anta40 4y ago
  Probably because the OP's intention is to "...inspire people to change their life for the better". Put emphasis on "inspiring people". But nevertheless I'm agree what that. Whenever I take a look at my photos, I found most of them are boring, even though I tried to be intentional (not taking random snapshots). Beyond visual beauty or adhesion to composition guidelines, I rarely find them tickling my brain. Guess reading aesthetics can made you too self-critical :p
kyleyeats 4y ago
Take a few hours to mess around with Stable Diffusion before you do this. It is a really bad time to become a concept artist.
- LiamHz 4y ago
  I worked on early versions of Midjourney
  - kyleyeats 4y ago
    Nice. In that case welcome to the machine.
- Keyframe 4y ago
  It's a tool, come on. It'll do no more 'damage' than template sites did for good designers.
  - kyleyeats 4y ago
    It's an illustrator apocalypse.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- Herbstluft 4y ago
  I believe the rise of AI art has shown, more than anything, that many of us here in our tech bubble have no idea what professional artists actually do. I don't doubt that ai art will have a significant impact but come on....the job involves way more. And ai is not as close to this job as the ads suggest. You only have to take a minute to learn about the average workday of a professional artist. Surely the industry will find more ways to make the life of artists more miserable with this.
shon 4y ago
As a technical person, it’s an interesting time to do this given the change that’s coming from “generative art” tech. I’m 30 years (and one exit) into my career in tech. Still thinking about being a rock star… or at least learning to play guitar well enough to share it with people. I still struggle with the question of whether to follow passion or money. I recently had an exit as the CEO of an HR Tech company. I’d love to make a Sci-Fi game. My old co-founder and I have it partially spec’d out. We love it and there’s much joy in building something like that. But games are like movies… the audience is fickle and you can easily make a good game that is a total financial (hobby) failure. Where as another HR Tech startup feels… not like a total layup exactly, but like making a dish that you’ve made several times before, a crowd favorite. You know how to do it. You feel good about pulling it off. It’s not super fun content but at least it’s creating something and you feel like you can make something good that people will like, which means financial success. Good luck to you. YOLO.
- manuisin 4y ago
  Why not do both (or all 3 including music) at the same time while giving yourself 2-3 years to start slowly ramp up your focus on the game dev or music side as you keep on learning while reducing your involvement with the management work? I'm personally someone attempting to find a balance between my full time job, music & game dev/3d graphics. I don't see the latter two paying off any time soon but I see myself doing them for the rest of my life. The one thing I can say that after attempting to give it a go for 2+ years, a certain type of synergy between the different goals start to emerge. Skills & ideas I gain in one area help me do better in the other two in unexpected ways. The experience & skills you've gathered from running a company would not go to waste and can be your source of strength. And just starting by dipping your toes is the best way to find whether you'd really enjoy being involved in these areas.
- 6stringmerc 4y ago
  You should check out my article basically trashing the future of AI/ML music generation. I just submitted it recently.
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carlgreene 4y ago
Good on you, Liam! Tech will always be there and relatively easy for you to come back to. Take your chances now while you're young and don't fret about the money while you don't need to. Best of luck
block_dagger 4y ago
Good for the OP! I’m making a similar switch soon as well.
johndhi 4y ago
Good for you. Thanks for making the world more beautiful. Good luck!
50 4y ago
I'm sure you'll do some thinking on the philosophy of art front. To name a few recommendations: Adorno's Aesthetic Theory (1970) and Dewey's Art as Experience (1934). > Art [as a creation] does not imitate nature, it imitates a creation [or nature, in a Spinozian meaning, which is but an eternal activity of creation], sometimes to propose an alternative world, sometimes simply to amplify, to confirm, to make social the brief hope offered by nature. (John Berger, "The White Bird")
Keyframe 4y ago
All power to you, OP! Art and self within changes a lot when its also your job; Here be dragons.
rperez333 4y ago
I’ve been a visual effects artist for more than a decade (Nuke Compositor), last year I did the inverse move to tech, already predicting that AI would make my life a bit harder. All the articles you see about the state of the industry are no hyperboles, my life as developer is a walk in the park compared to what I had to go through as an artist. But as your intuition already told you, not going all-in is a mistake. Ignore people saying to do this as a hobby. It is not remotely the same thing, especially if you are ambitious and not taking this path because you had no better option.
hi_its_trevor 4y ago
money solves money problems.
laserbeam 4y ago
More power to you, and you always have software as a backup plan if things don't work out. One of my close friends went through a similar change from software to art. It took 4 years until she found her way and her audience. She's still not making much but she is much happier than when programming. It's still going to be a hustle for you, but it's a different kind of hustle. And that's ok. Enjoy the journey!
samatman 4y ago
Kid, you're not leaving anything. No, let me back up a bit. Go for it! Live your best life. Signed, -About One Career Every Five Years
anm89 4y ago
> Beyond paying for rent and groceries I don’t have many material desires. Something about this mindset never ads up for me. Sure, this sounds cool in your 20s or early 30s. (although does it? you don't want to eat out with your friends? go to the bar? live in something better than crappy apartments. things are expensive these days) But what about when you are 60? When you are on this path you certainly aren't saving for a house. I mean art is better than manual labor or something in the sense that you are physically capable of going until much later in your life. But do you want to be grinding out cartoons to buy food when you are that age? My gut is that: 1) a small number of people make these romantic visions work 2) A large number end up in difficult situations they regret. Some just a bit of regret but some in really bad situations. 3) They have money coming from the family or something like that in a way they aren't being transparent about that means there is really no choice to make at all and they are going to be fine no matter what And nothing against people in group 3 either as long as they are honest about their situation.
LightG 4y ago
"Yeah, there's a good buck in that racket"
langsoul-com 4y ago
Smart, made bank FIRST then going to do something else. Instead of being dirt poor and trying something creative.
eBombzor 4y ago
Only 20 years old? Wow, some people are just born next level I guess.
- keepquestioning 4y ago
  Silver spoon?
atoav 4y ago
OP I read your text. As an teacher of VFX in an (european) art university let me give you a few tips: You are only 20. You should not worry about your age at all. Art school is ¼ about the skills and tricks you learn there, ¼ about being forced to put something in front of others who won't be wooed by fancy eye candy, ¼ about creating and finding a network of people and ¼ being exposed to other styles of art. Some of those things are influenced by the size and location of the art school, some of those are influenced by how much time you can spend with your collegues and at exhibitions or similar. Make sure to go to a school, where people are better than you. Going there just to learn the handywork is a waste of time. You should go there to learn the skills AND to create a network that can help you get jobs after. Feel free to take on work during your studies. Also: The things that matter when doing great art are mostly about the brain. And the ability to see the right way takes time to develope. Make sure to do something daily. Maybe a daily comic strip, a daily drawing or whatever. Put it online so you are forced to never skip a day.
- 6stringmerc 4y ago
  Super great advice and I agree a lot as a guitarist. Very same principles about diversity, challenge, and practice. In my teenage years I averaged probably 2 hours a day reaching for shred like Yngwie Malmsteen - because of that push and reach, 80% of normal playing is a walk in the park. Once you get the technical aptitude it’s great to explore other cultures and methods and then your brain gets to express itself even more. Quite a lovely journey but also delayed gratification is built in and challenges a lot of people. Myself included…
nathants 4y ago
python is used widely in animation and vfx. why not both?
agumonkey 4y ago
I had a tiny dream the other day, to leave for a silent retreat in a monastery and study cosmology.. something about the scale and timelessness of it was appealing to my soul
- Borrible 4y ago
  You could ask here: https://www.pas.va/en/taglist.disciplines.astronomy.html https://www.pas.va/en/taglist.disciplines.astronomy.html Compared to the universe, their monastery is tiny. And as time goes by, it gets tinier and tinier.
motbus 4y ago
deleted 4y ago
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emptyparadise 4y ago
I want to do digital art...
lukeh 4y ago
Good on you! I did something similar (tech to music), the irony is now I am drawn to programming as a hobby as there are some bits of the brain music just doesn’t exercise. On the whole a happier person.
quijoteuniv 4y ago
I like the idea of leaving art uncompromised, independent of earning money. I can count very few people that can involved money and get away with it. The problem with this is that you have to have a job to support your art, and that reduces the amount of time you can spend with art. They key is and i believe what is comming, work for a company that actually makes the world Better place
jayd16 4y ago
If you don't like tech then there's no reason to force it but a lot of this is fairly naive. >churning out code to solve problems I don't care about? Career artists often churn out art they don't care about. Pick a job that solves problems you do care about! The trade is a separate choice. As someone who works in games, I can assure you there are tech people that think about kindness, creativity, history, culture, art, emotions and aesthetics. Ending with a quote from a Pixar movie is especially ironic considering they work on the cutting edge of art and technology. I wish this young man the best of luck.
- anta40 4y ago
  My totally unscientific hypothesis is: "solving problems you do care about" is usually the easiest way to make money, e.g CRUD and web API. Once your skill is more polished and your experience is wider, then try to look for jobs where their goals aligns with your interests.
Kukumber 4y ago
Tech people are delusional, i always said it, this confirms it, specially the ones who earn a lot of money during this bubble
aatd86 4y ago
Before there was a market for Art, it used to be heavily subsidized by rich people. It was basically contract work. (Medicis etc). As long as you find that there is a vibrant market, go for it. But otherwise I would keep it a hobby and try to get wealthy enough to retire and only then, do it full time. The best would be to be able to associate your hobby and your jobs so that your jobs feels like a hobby but also pays the bills. The obvious intersection between visual arts and programming is video game making for instance.
lazerl0rd 4y ago
That's what DALL-E said /s.
AHOHA 4y ago
I am an "artsy" person myself, both digital (3D, photography, vfx, animation, manipulation, digital drawing, infographics, etc.) and traditional (drawing, craft, sculpting, etc.), However, it's just as a hobby as others mentioned here, it will be a struggle when it comes to financial support even if you are top of the line. What I did instead is going into engineering (electrical one, yeah sounds far even with software devs), but you would be surprised how your artsy skills play a big factor in your work, because at the end of the day, your data/info/ideas/etc. needs to be presented and communicated, either internally or with clients, and it actually most of the time put me ahead of my colleagues/competitors.

167 points by ifvictr 4y ago

Learning blender myself and this character modeling looks unique ;) I know people always say "we should start splinter group X". But a gallery for hackers to show off serious art is always welcome. Like Postmasters in NYC!

cercatrova 4y ago

Some thoughts: - Reminds me of a GitHub commentor saying they left tech to build furniture out of wood ("I no longer build software" [0]). - AI art might eat your lunch, especially in the concept art world. The main guy on Twitter who put out the thread about Stable Diffusion was a concept artist [1], and I think concept artists, graphic designers and generally non-fine-art artists will be hit the hardest. - The part about a more diverse player roster was interesting given that ATVI use a tool for it, although not for Overwatch apparently [2]. Some people were outraged online (on both sides of the political spectrum) but personally I don't see a problem with it. People may not necessarily remember the various axes on which others operate (race, class, gender, sexuality, etc), so there's nothing wrong with a tool that can help people analyze that and create characters for that. It reminds me of the outrage doctors first had over needing checklists for tasks, but they actually do work when studied. They're just tools, nothing more, nothing less. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24541964 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24541964 [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32461138 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32461138 [2] https://www.pcgamer.com/overwatch-creators-explain-they-didnt-use-kings-creepy-diversity-charts/ https://www.pcgamer.com/overwatch-creators-explain-they-didn...

rhacker 4y ago
AI won't eat lunch, but it may crowd the space with more people getting paid less. A marketing person can't sit in front of Stable Diffusion and work it towards the campaign they want. They still need an art department that can iterate and make it match the campaign. The artist may very well be sitting in front of some iteration of stable diffusion/imagen/dalle but they still need to discern between AI generated outputs that work and that don't, and to iterate on it until it's right.
- aiappreciator 4y ago
  Why do you think an 'art department' is still needed? The only reason why in-house art departments are needed, is because previously its hard to communicate 'exactly what you want' to an artist, hence in-housing to reduce communication friction. In the future, the marketing guy, can just create a draft/visual guide through AI, and send it to some outsourced artist to refine. The outsourced artist can be from any country, because again, language for precise communication is less important. Competition is going to be brutal, especially for more traditional corporate art (The standard corporate memphis style can already be perfectly executed by SD+dreambooth, because its so easy to draw) Much better to be in the comics/animation/movie business, where demand will boom in response to drastically improved quality.
  - user_named 4y ago
    If you make marketing create art and talk to outsourced creators then guess what, you've turned the marketing department into and art department. Clearly the art department is still needed - according to yourself.
  - deleted 4y ago
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  - Borrible 4y ago
    I heard a talk last week from a co-founder of a social first agency who no longer hires storyboarders because it's cheaper and faster for his agency to make them themselves with freely available generative AI. They also use AI tools for creative direction and text generation.
    - LegitShady 4y ago
      Before you declare this important find out if the product is any good. Any sweatshop can cut some jobs and replace them with a shit ai artist but how are the storyboards and how do they translate into the final product. There are many companies that do foolish things to replace a cheaply paid artist because they can't see past the savings and into how it affects the product. If their storyboarder could be replaced completely by AI they needed a better one.
eyelidlessness 4y ago
> AI art might eat your lunch Show me an artist who will regret their lunch being eaten, and I’ll show you an artist who worked and/or slept through breakfast and dinner.

eludwig 4y ago

The grass is always greener! :-D I smile because I left commercial art back in the 80's to become a software developer! More power to Laim and I hope it works out well for him, but I have my doubts. Working as a full-time (especially on-staff) artist answerable to an Art Director sucks!! Artists are not respected, paid terribly and just generally considered disposable. At least that's how it was in my day. Again, Liam, go for it, but keep your eyes open going into it! Some things are better left as hobbies (which I do not consider a dirty word)!

JKCalhoun 4y ago
I stood at a fork in the road, so to speak, when I was kicked out of the house and had to decide whether to pursue art or tech (I enjoyed both). It was clear to me tech would pay the bills — the art I could do in my spare time. Retired (am I?) now, I can do all the art I want.
- canpan 4y ago
  This is the way I plan to go! I love coding and I have my own dream projects. My plan is to earn enough to be independent and follow my dreams. Not retired yet, but collected some nest egg. Since then, I stress less, only work on what I find interesting and speak up when I want to. Funny part: I only got raises faster this way.
  - kinleyd 4y ago
    It's a risk/reward thing. Some people go all in with their passion first, consequences be damned, and it pays off. Others, I think the larger portion, aren't so lucky. Conventional wisdom is to take the safe job first, and then go from there - the risk here is never getting out of that rut. It's a hard decision, but being really focused on defining and attaining what independence is for you, is the key to taking that safe job first. My 2c.
    - dinosaurdynasty 4y ago
      Being in a rut is better than being homeless.

forgotmypw17 4y ago

I did this, and I'm happy. Caveat is that my medium is code.

eyelidlessness 4y ago
There’s a wealth of expression to be explored in art as code. Don’t be too hasty calling it a caveat! And I’m glad you’re happy!

danielvaughn 4y ago

Funny, I left art for tech. Making art is intrinsically rewarding but doing it for money can be absolute hell. Best of luck to op.

ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
I was an artist. A fairly decent one (I don't really have a gallery of my stuff up, anymore, but here's a couple[0-1]). That was a while ago (a long while ago. Over 35 years). I figured out that even a top-shelf artist (and I don't think that was my destiny) wouldn't make as much as mediocre programmer. Nowadays, I have sort of "run off to join the circus." I write software for free. [0] https://littlegreenviper.com/art/Cavalier.png https://littlegreenviper.com/art/Cavalier.png [1] https://littlegreenviper.com/art/Sentinels.png https://littlegreenviper.com/art/Sentinels.png
- bombcar 4y ago
  Now a programmer that can do art? That may come in useful!
  - ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
    I do most of my own graphic assets. I know there’s many better artists, out there, but I’m good enough for government work.
- djha-skin 4y ago
  Pretty dope drawings.
  - ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
    Thanks! But that was long ago. There’s a picture of Arteeste Chris, back then, in this story: https://littlegreenviper.com/miscellany/the-road-most-traveled-by/ https://littlegreenviper.com/miscellany/the-road-most-travel...
- danielvaughn 4y ago

pushedx 4y ago

There are some GDC talks that give insight into the concept art industry, e.g. https://youtu.be/CYbYvImd7Bw https://youtu.be/CYbYvImd7Bw The general sense that I get from that talk about what it’s like to work in concept art is not sunshine and rainbows.

user_named 4y ago

I like the author's website. It's an interesting idea to be able to list bullet points of what you did in a month (not too granular), add recipes etc. Really becomes your own space.

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blondin 4y ago

to echo other replies here, OP might be idealizing the artistic field. why not do both, until you can only do one? that's my own plan. by the way, concept art is one of the hardest, if not the hardest field in art. these people crank out designs upon designs. and if Feng Zhu didn't make an entire YouTube channel showing what they do, i would have never known they existed. edit: well, other pages on his website suggest that OP already did what he said. good luck, pal!

djha-skin 4y ago

> In the near future I want to become a concept artist in the games industry Worst industry ever by all the accounts I've heard. Part of the compensation package is that you are working in the gaming industry. Long hours, lousy pay, ill treatment. Go for the art mate but pursue a different industry.

aiappreciator 4y ago
Its also literally the worst type of artist to be. Concept art is the most vulnerable type of art to AI. AI already does concept art way better than humans, 1 concept artist can now do the job of 10. Because AI is good at variation and creativity, bad at detail/coherence, concept art favors the former, needs less of the latter. Why doesn't OP MAKE games instead of being a mere artist? If you can program, and have a passion for art, you can just make indie games, think of the undertale legend.
- JKCalhoun 4y ago
  I'm not worried about competition from "AI art" — am I just stupid and ill-informed? Pursuing game concept-art though appears to me to be a drag simply because of the sameness of it. I know the author of the article thinks it's become a wide open field for creativity but my eye stills see the same fantasy-super-hero-manga genre that probably keeps computer games from being seen as deserving of being called "art" to society at large.
  - dumpsterdiver 4y ago
    The thing I find frightening about AI image generation is the speed of iteration. Some of the images generated by Midjourney within seconds would take a human artist quite a long time to create. You can take a complete work from a paid human artist and run it through some prompts to get closer to the result you were looking for while retaining most of the original work. Even if AI don't completely displace concept artists in the immediate future, it will certainly displace at least some portion of a human concept artist's workflow. I think the "detail work" for concept art is a good candidate to be offloaded to AI. Why pay an artist to paint every blade of grass when you can just take their rough draft and apply a series of "incredibly detailed grass texture" (etc) prompts to it? Imo, the writing on the wall is pretty clear. While I'm sure that human concept artists will continue to find work, I'm pretty sure they'll be fighting an uphill battle, and probably won't feel very valued after awhile.

HiroshiSan 4y ago

I did something similar though I never made it into tech, I dropped out of a bachelor's in math to pursue art, this was roughly 5 years ago and it's been a tough journey, I wish you the best of luck. Some resources that will help you a long the way: youtube: proko steve huston steven zapata ahmed aldoori sinix nma.art watts atelier schoolism Try to find a local life drawing class and go every single week. Animation specific check out Toniko Pantoja, ModerndayJames. I'm currently trying to change my relationship to art from something I pursue to make money, to something I enjoy doing to fuel my soul. I haven't drawn in a couple months, but I've come to terms that it's something I'll always be pursuing, in what capacity I'm not sure, but art, is the coolest thing that's ever come into my life.

pianoben 4y ago
> I'm currently trying to change my relationship to art from something I pursue to make money, to something I enjoy doing to fuel my soul. This may not be a useful anecdote for those who want to thread the needle between passion and profession, but I'll never forget the day that I decided, really decided, to switch from a piano performance degree to a CS degree. My playing immediately improved - I was relaxed, and things just flowed. The minute I stopped pinning my hopes and worries for the future on my art, the minute I stopped trying to force perfection, it blossomed on its own. I don't know what lesson, if any, to draw from that experience, but there it is. I tend to think that shedding the egotistical attachment to professional success was the key. (it just transferred over to programming, but hey, turns out there are lots of people who will pay for that).

bluquark 4y ago

I'd recommend checking out books on career transitions before pulling the trigger, for example The Squiggly Career and Refuse to Choose. Also try reaching out to working artists and ask them to a coffee to discuss what the life is like: many people actually welcome the opportunity to give a stranger the advice they wish they had known when they were younger.

cpsns 4y ago

Lots of cynicism here, typical whenever art is compared to tech, but I wish him the best. Might as well give it a shot and see how it goes, you can always fall back into tech if needed later on.

Baeocystin 4y ago
Hell, I welded in a shipyard for a while after the first .com crash. Fallback skills of all flavors are useful!
- tartoran 4y ago
  Plus a break from the industry is healthy anyway even if one needs to reskill a bit upon reentry.

LiamHz 4y ago

Hi! I'm the author of this post -- it was an unlisted draft that I shared with a few friends, was planning to rewrite most of this before publishing. Please forgive the rough edges Main changes I'd make to this article - Agreed with others that I might be naive, but I'm 20 y/o and now's the right time to shoot for my dreams rather than settle - I'm applying to animation school soon (Sheridan). I started coding when I was 12, I expect this career change to take a few years, and am in it for the long haul - My worst case is I don't enjoy working in art, and go back to tech. I don't believe you can make a successful career change without going all-in Happy to answer any questions :) Made a little music video with some of my art if you'd like to take a peek https://twitter.com/LiamHinzman/status/1589660449271959552 https://twitter.com/LiamHinzman/status/1589660449271959552

beckingz 4y ago
Take names friend, good luck with your future endeavors!
t0bia_s 4y ago
I have degree from film animation, one year in indie game development and for now I'm an visual artist freelancer over 7 years. To be honest, I cannot say that make living by what is your hobby is good decision. It could easily became just work that needs to be done. Which is fine if you'll do it with passion. But especially in art it is huge difference between creativity for contract and creativity for expressing yourself. Those in second category are extremely lucky if able to make living. Also you would probably not spend your free time by doing art.
leetrout 4y ago
> "I'm just afraid that if I died today, then my life would have amounted to nothing". > When I imagine the ideal version of myself a decade from now, I'm not a grizzled infra engineer or a founder who has raised millions of dollars. You are 20. You have a long life ahead of you. Enjoy the exploration and I hope you continue to realize your self.
pzone 4y ago
If you commit to eat sleep and breathe art and you are lucky enough to never get tired of it you will succeed. Draw and paint as much as you physically can. Keep an entrepreneur’s mindset and hustle. Be prepared to use technology to stay competitive. Try out 3d, VR, AI, everything at your disposal.

pmoriarty 4y ago

"The most important thing when creating art is that you know what you want to say with it." When I make art I do so only to please myself and without any preconceived notions or intentions as to what it should be or what messages it's to convey. It completely does not matter to me what, if anything, anyone else gets out of it.

anta40 4y ago
Probably because the OP's intention is to "...inspire people to change their life for the better". Put emphasis on "inspiring people". But nevertheless I'm agree what that. Whenever I take a look at my photos, I found most of them are boring, even though I tried to be intentional (not taking random snapshots). Beyond visual beauty or adhesion to composition guidelines, I rarely find them tickling my brain. Guess reading aesthetics can made you too self-critical :p

kyleyeats 4y ago

Take a few hours to mess around with Stable Diffusion before you do this. It is a really bad time to become a concept artist.

LiamHz 4y ago
I worked on early versions of Midjourney
- kyleyeats 4y ago
  Nice. In that case welcome to the machine.
Keyframe 4y ago
It's a tool, come on. It'll do no more 'damage' than template sites did for good designers.
- kyleyeats 4y ago
  It's an illustrator apocalypse.
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Herbstluft 4y ago
I believe the rise of AI art has shown, more than anything, that many of us here in our tech bubble have no idea what professional artists actually do. I don't doubt that ai art will have a significant impact but come on....the job involves way more. And ai is not as close to this job as the ads suggest. You only have to take a minute to learn about the average workday of a professional artist. Surely the industry will find more ways to make the life of artists more miserable with this.

shon 4y ago

As a technical person, it’s an interesting time to do this given the change that’s coming from “generative art” tech. I’m 30 years (and one exit) into my career in tech. Still thinking about being a rock star… or at least learning to play guitar well enough to share it with people. I still struggle with the question of whether to follow passion or money. I recently had an exit as the CEO of an HR Tech company. I’d love to make a Sci-Fi game. My old co-founder and I have it partially spec’d out. We love it and there’s much joy in building something like that. But games are like movies… the audience is fickle and you can easily make a good game that is a total financial (hobby) failure. Where as another HR Tech startup feels… not like a total layup exactly, but like making a dish that you’ve made several times before, a crowd favorite. You know how to do it. You feel good about pulling it off. It’s not super fun content but at least it’s creating something and you feel like you can make something good that people will like, which means financial success. Good luck to you. YOLO.

manuisin 4y ago
Why not do both (or all 3 including music) at the same time while giving yourself 2-3 years to start slowly ramp up your focus on the game dev or music side as you keep on learning while reducing your involvement with the management work? I'm personally someone attempting to find a balance between my full time job, music & game dev/3d graphics. I don't see the latter two paying off any time soon but I see myself doing them for the rest of my life. The one thing I can say that after attempting to give it a go for 2+ years, a certain type of synergy between the different goals start to emerge. Skills & ideas I gain in one area help me do better in the other two in unexpected ways. The experience & skills you've gathered from running a company would not go to waste and can be your source of strength. And just starting by dipping your toes is the best way to find whether you'd really enjoy being involved in these areas.
6stringmerc 4y ago
You should check out my article basically trashing the future of AI/ML music generation. I just submitted it recently.

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carlgreene 4y ago

Good on you, Liam! Tech will always be there and relatively easy for you to come back to. Take your chances now while you're young and don't fret about the money while you don't need to. Best of luck

block_dagger 4y ago

Good for the OP! I’m making a similar switch soon as well.

johndhi 4y ago

Good for you. Thanks for making the world more beautiful. Good luck!

50 4y ago

I'm sure you'll do some thinking on the philosophy of art front. To name a few recommendations: Adorno's Aesthetic Theory (1970) and Dewey's Art as Experience (1934). > Art [as a creation] does not imitate nature, it imitates a creation [or nature, in a Spinozian meaning, which is but an eternal activity of creation], sometimes to propose an alternative world, sometimes simply to amplify, to confirm, to make social the brief hope offered by nature. (John Berger, "The White Bird")

Keyframe 4y ago

All power to you, OP! Art and self within changes a lot when its also your job; Here be dragons.

rperez333 4y ago

I’ve been a visual effects artist for more than a decade (Nuke Compositor), last year I did the inverse move to tech, already predicting that AI would make my life a bit harder. All the articles you see about the state of the industry are no hyperboles, my life as developer is a walk in the park compared to what I had to go through as an artist. But as your intuition already told you, not going all-in is a mistake. Ignore people saying to do this as a hobby. It is not remotely the same thing, especially if you are ambitious and not taking this path because you had no better option.

hi_its_trevor 4y ago

money solves money problems.

laserbeam 4y ago

More power to you, and you always have software as a backup plan if things don't work out. One of my close friends went through a similar change from software to art. It took 4 years until she found her way and her audience. She's still not making much but she is much happier than when programming. It's still going to be a hustle for you, but it's a different kind of hustle. And that's ok. Enjoy the journey!

samatman 4y ago

Kid, you're not leaving anything. No, let me back up a bit. Go for it! Live your best life. Signed, -About One Career Every Five Years

anm89 4y ago

> Beyond paying for rent and groceries I don’t have many material desires. Something about this mindset never ads up for me. Sure, this sounds cool in your 20s or early 30s. (although does it? you don't want to eat out with your friends? go to the bar? live in something better than crappy apartments. things are expensive these days) But what about when you are 60? When you are on this path you certainly aren't saving for a house. I mean art is better than manual labor or something in the sense that you are physically capable of going until much later in your life. But do you want to be grinding out cartoons to buy food when you are that age? My gut is that: 1) a small number of people make these romantic visions work 2) A large number end up in difficult situations they regret. Some just a bit of regret but some in really bad situations. 3) They have money coming from the family or something like that in a way they aren't being transparent about that means there is really no choice to make at all and they are going to be fine no matter what And nothing against people in group 3 either as long as they are honest about their situation.

LightG 4y ago

"Yeah, there's a good buck in that racket"

langsoul-com 4y ago

Smart, made bank FIRST then going to do something else. Instead of being dirt poor and trying something creative.

eBombzor 4y ago

Only 20 years old? Wow, some people are just born next level I guess.

keepquestioning 4y ago
Silver spoon?

atoav 4y ago

OP I read your text. As an teacher of VFX in an (european) art university let me give you a few tips: You are only 20. You should not worry about your age at all. Art school is ¼ about the skills and tricks you learn there, ¼ about being forced to put something in front of others who won't be wooed by fancy eye candy, ¼ about creating and finding a network of people and ¼ being exposed to other styles of art. Some of those things are influenced by the size and location of the art school, some of those are influenced by how much time you can spend with your collegues and at exhibitions or similar. Make sure to go to a school, where people are better than you. Going there just to learn the handywork is a waste of time. You should go there to learn the skills AND to create a network that can help you get jobs after. Feel free to take on work during your studies. Also: The things that matter when doing great art are mostly about the brain. And the ability to see the right way takes time to develope. Make sure to do something daily. Maybe a daily comic strip, a daily drawing or whatever. Put it online so you are forced to never skip a day.

6stringmerc 4y ago
Super great advice and I agree a lot as a guitarist. Very same principles about diversity, challenge, and practice. In my teenage years I averaged probably 2 hours a day reaching for shred like Yngwie Malmsteen - because of that push and reach, 80% of normal playing is a walk in the park. Once you get the technical aptitude it’s great to explore other cultures and methods and then your brain gets to express itself even more. Quite a lovely journey but also delayed gratification is built in and challenges a lot of people. Myself included…

nathants 4y ago

python is used widely in animation and vfx. why not both?

agumonkey 4y ago

I had a tiny dream the other day, to leave for a silent retreat in a monastery and study cosmology.. something about the scale and timelessness of it was appealing to my soul

Borrible 4y ago
You could ask here: https://www.pas.va/en/taglist.disciplines.astronomy.html https://www.pas.va/en/taglist.disciplines.astronomy.html Compared to the universe, their monastery is tiny. And as time goes by, it gets tinier and tinier.

motbus 4y ago

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emptyparadise 4y ago

I want to do digital art...

lukeh 4y ago

Good on you! I did something similar (tech to music), the irony is now I am drawn to programming as a hobby as there are some bits of the brain music just doesn’t exercise. On the whole a happier person.

quijoteuniv 4y ago

I like the idea of leaving art uncompromised, independent of earning money. I can count very few people that can involved money and get away with it. The problem with this is that you have to have a job to support your art, and that reduces the amount of time you can spend with art. They key is and i believe what is comming, work for a company that actually makes the world Better place

jayd16 4y ago

If you don't like tech then there's no reason to force it but a lot of this is fairly naive. >churning out code to solve problems I don't care about? Career artists often churn out art they don't care about. Pick a job that solves problems you do care about! The trade is a separate choice. As someone who works in games, I can assure you there are tech people that think about kindness, creativity, history, culture, art, emotions and aesthetics. Ending with a quote from a Pixar movie is especially ironic considering they work on the cutting edge of art and technology. I wish this young man the best of luck.

anta40 4y ago
My totally unscientific hypothesis is: "solving problems you do care about" is usually the easiest way to make money, e.g CRUD and web API. Once your skill is more polished and your experience is wider, then try to look for jobs where their goals aligns with your interests.

Kukumber 4y ago

Tech people are delusional, i always said it, this confirms it, specially the ones who earn a lot of money during this bubble

aatd86 4y ago

Before there was a market for Art, it used to be heavily subsidized by rich people. It was basically contract work. (Medicis etc). As long as you find that there is a vibrant market, go for it. But otherwise I would keep it a hobby and try to get wealthy enough to retire and only then, do it full time. The best would be to be able to associate your hobby and your jobs so that your jobs feels like a hobby but also pays the bills. The obvious intersection between visual arts and programming is video game making for instance.

lazerl0rd 4y ago

That's what DALL-E said /s.

AHOHA 4y ago

I am an "artsy" person myself, both digital (3D, photography, vfx, animation, manipulation, digital drawing, infographics, etc.) and traditional (drawing, craft, sculpting, etc.), However, it's just as a hobby as others mentioned here, it will be a struggle when it comes to financial support even if you are top of the line. What I did instead is going into engineering (electrical one, yeah sounds far even with software devs), but you would be surprised how your artsy skills play a big factor in your work, because at the end of the day, your data/info/ideas/etc. needs to be presented and communicated, either internally or with clients, and it actually most of the time put me ahead of my colleagues/competitors.