5 ms·

Not a fair take. If you have the pre-requisite knowledge, it is easier than ever. Just order the ingredients online (even the semi-regulated ones can be easily

by melony 4y ago

Not a fair take. If you have the pre-requisite knowledge, it is easier than ever. Just order the ingredients online (even the semi-regulated ones can be easily obtained from overseas) at prices that are impossibly low compared to the RadioShack days where everything is overpriced with value being mostly captured by thermofisher middlemen and retailers. I think the lack of science kits is because CS, iPads and coding have replaced messy kitchen science for children growing up now. Swift Playgrounds only needs a tablet and it is just as educational without needing any cleanup or supervision.

dylan604 4y ago
In today's world, you also do not get a knock on the door from some LEO/TLA member because you purchased a certain combination of iPads, electronic devices, but buy a combo of chemistry ingredients and you'll enjoy a nice little chat.
- walterbell 4y ago
  One justification used to promote cashless digital payments.
  - dylan604 4y ago
    Any legit seller of these ingredients would be expected to keep records of the transactions with some sort of KYC. If you were procuring from someone, I would think cash would be the precise anonymous payment format being sought. Digital payments just aren't quite as anonymous as people make them out to be.
ska 4y ago
> If you have the pre-requisite knowledge Isn't this a pretty big barrier though? In the times the article discussed, plenty of parents bought chemistry kits for science-inclined kids without any real idea of what they were; assured by the packaging and availability that they were appropriate. For the most part they were correct. That's hard to imagine these days.
excite1997 4y ago
Sure, it's easier than ever to break the law, but not sure that's a fair argument. In many parts of Europe - e.g., in Germany and in the UK - the purchase of many common "dangerous" reagents is regulated and illegal without a license that isn't available to hobbyists. The government takes the view that it's simply not a legitimate hobby. In the US, the situation is better, but some essential chemicals are unobtainable due to DEA legislation (iodine, phosphorous). Many others are subject to DHS and DEA monitoring (including KYC mandates) and a patchwork of state laws that prompted most reagent manufacturers to stop shipping to non-commercial customers altogether - and in recent years, also caused them to also crack down on resellers (requiring every reseller to attest that they will not re-ship to civilians). In the past five years or so, eBay also had major crackdowns, banning everything from sulfuric acid to potassium iodide. So did Amazon. And that's before we get into raids on YouTube chemists, etc. Heck, Texas prohibited people from buying or owning laboratory glassware until recently. Wikipedia has a good summary. The internet made chemistry easier for a while by facilitating trade, but that era is coming to a halt.
- melony 4y ago
  You don't understand the industry. You are thinking in the context of nice academic labs with thick budgets. Where do you think the fentanyl people are getting their ingredients from? Asia. You can easily get most industrial/pharmaceutical chemistry pre-cursors and analogues/isomers for the semi-legal/regulated substances. Whether it can clear customs is another story but for kitchen chemistry the internet is more than sufficient. Go to an aggregator like "Alibaba" and do a search. You will be surprised at what you can find.
JKCalhoun 4y ago
Agree. Chemicals at the local hobby shop (not Radio Shack, ha ha) were outrageously priced - for like a few grams of the chemical. With online sites (even Amazon) we do indeed live in interesting times.

by melony 4y ago

dylan604 4y ago

In today's world, you also do not get a knock on the door from some LEO/TLA member because you purchased a certain combination of iPads, electronic devices, but buy a combo of chemistry ingredients and you'll enjoy a nice little chat.

walterbell 4y ago
One justification used to promote cashless digital payments.
- dylan604 4y ago
  Any legit seller of these ingredients would be expected to keep records of the transactions with some sort of KYC. If you were procuring from someone, I would think cash would be the precise anonymous payment format being sought. Digital payments just aren't quite as anonymous as people make them out to be.

ska 4y ago

> If you have the pre-requisite knowledge Isn't this a pretty big barrier though? In the times the article discussed, plenty of parents bought chemistry kits for science-inclined kids without any real idea of what they were; assured by the packaging and availability that they were appropriate. For the most part they were correct. That's hard to imagine these days.

excite1997 4y ago

Sure, it's easier than ever to break the law, but not sure that's a fair argument. In many parts of Europe - e.g., in Germany and in the UK - the purchase of many common "dangerous" reagents is regulated and illegal without a license that isn't available to hobbyists. The government takes the view that it's simply not a legitimate hobby. In the US, the situation is better, but some essential chemicals are unobtainable due to DEA legislation (iodine, phosphorous). Many others are subject to DHS and DEA monitoring (including KYC mandates) and a patchwork of state laws that prompted most reagent manufacturers to stop shipping to non-commercial customers altogether - and in recent years, also caused them to also crack down on resellers (requiring every reseller to attest that they will not re-ship to civilians). In the past five years or so, eBay also had major crackdowns, banning everything from sulfuric acid to potassium iodide. So did Amazon. And that's before we get into raids on YouTube chemists, etc. Heck, Texas prohibited people from buying or owning laboratory glassware until recently. Wikipedia has a good summary. The internet made chemistry easier for a while by facilitating trade, but that era is coming to a halt.

melony 4y ago
You don't understand the industry. You are thinking in the context of nice academic labs with thick budgets. Where do you think the fentanyl people are getting their ingredients from? Asia. You can easily get most industrial/pharmaceutical chemistry pre-cursors and analogues/isomers for the semi-legal/regulated substances. Whether it can clear customs is another story but for kitchen chemistry the internet is more than sufficient. Go to an aggregator like "Alibaba" and do a search. You will be surprised at what you can find.

JKCalhoun 4y ago

Agree. Chemicals at the local hobby shop (not Radio Shack, ha ha) were outrageously priced - for like a few grams of the chemical. With online sites (even Amazon) we do indeed live in interesting times.