4 ms·

>The lab leak theory is pretty mainstream these days. So is denying climate change or the moon landings...

thedorkknight 4y ago
Side note, but is the moon landing hoax popular still? I got nostalgia when you mentioned it, boy howdy do I miss the x files days of conspiracy theories
- LatteLazy 4y ago
  6% of Americans (10% of millennial Americans) supposedly. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon_landing_conspiracy_theories https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon_landing_conspiracy_theori... Despite actual pictures taken recently...
  - postalrat 4y ago
    You are claiming 6% is mainstream?
    - LatteLazy 4y ago
      I will say that the evidence is the same for either. What percentage you think makes an idea mainstream I will leave up to you...
      - serf 4y ago
        let's leave it up to the word definitions instead : mainstream : the ideas, attitudes, or activities that are regarded as normal or conventional; the dominant trend in opinion, fashion, or the arts. So, no, 6% is not mainstream. Moon landing conspiracies are by no means a dominant trend anywhere aside from joke books and parody.
  - thedorkknight 4y ago
    Interesting! I honestly would not have guessed it was that high
johndfsgdgdfg 4y ago
Thank you for saying this. We know xenophobic racist right wingers are saying that COVID came from China. But WHO-China investigation definitely proved that COVID came outside of China. Even western virologists have been supporting Chinese scientists. [1] [1] https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...
Closi 4y ago
> So is denying climate change or the moon landings... Ah yes, so I would assume that the WHO would conclusively say that the lab leak theory is incorrect then? https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/06/09/who-sago-covid-origins/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/06/09/who-sago-cov... Oh... they say they are still investigating it and that the theory should be left on the table... but I guess the British Medical Journal would say it's total nonsense right?! https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n1656 https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n1656 Hmm... Maybe not, they say it's plausible too. Presumably Nature just flat-out tells us that it's a total conspiracy theory though right?! https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01529-3 https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01529-3 Ah, they stay on the fence and say that it's plausible. So it's not exactly like denying the moon landings, as I haven't heard NASA saying "the moon landings might have been faked, but we can't prove either way" anytime recently.
- LatteLazy 4y ago
  And this is the amazing leap so many people seem to make: If it is technically possible, then it must be true. That's what baffles me here: "We cannot conclusively say it's wrong" so it must be right. When did that become a popular mode of reasoning? I can only assume people are so desperate to believe they will swallow this rather than accept reality.
  - Closi 4y ago
    That's not what I'm saying - Where did I say it must be true? I'm saying "We cannot conclusively say it's wrong, thus it's not in the same category as the moon landing". In reality nobody knows the origin for certain, but IMO you seem to fall for the fallacy you are describing but with the opposite premise - i.e. "We cannot conclusively say that the lab leak theory is right or wrong, thus it cannot possibly be a lab leak".

Side note, but is the moon landing hoax popular still? I got nostalgia when you mentioned it, boy howdy do I miss the x files days of conspiracy theories

LatteLazy 4y ago
6% of Americans (10% of millennial Americans) supposedly. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon_landing_conspiracy_theories https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon_landing_conspiracy_theori... Despite actual pictures taken recently...
- postalrat 4y ago
  You are claiming 6% is mainstream?
  - LatteLazy 4y ago
    I will say that the evidence is the same for either. What percentage you think makes an idea mainstream I will leave up to you...
    - serf 4y ago
      let's leave it up to the word definitions instead : mainstream : the ideas, attitudes, or activities that are regarded as normal or conventional; the dominant trend in opinion, fashion, or the arts. So, no, 6% is not mainstream. Moon landing conspiracies are by no means a dominant trend anywhere aside from joke books and parody.
- thedorkknight 4y ago
  Interesting! I honestly would not have guessed it was that high

johndfsgdgdfg 4y ago

Thank you for saying this. We know xenophobic racist right wingers are saying that COVID came from China. But WHO-China investigation definitely proved that COVID came outside of China. Even western virologists have been supporting Chinese scientists. [1] [1] https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...

Closi 4y ago

> So is denying climate change or the moon landings... Ah yes, so I would assume that the WHO would conclusively say that the lab leak theory is incorrect then? https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/06/09/who-sago-covid-origins/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/06/09/who-sago-cov... Oh... they say they are still investigating it and that the theory should be left on the table... but I guess the British Medical Journal would say it's total nonsense right?! https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n1656 https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n1656 Hmm... Maybe not, they say it's plausible too. Presumably Nature just flat-out tells us that it's a total conspiracy theory though right?! https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01529-3 https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01529-3 Ah, they stay on the fence and say that it's plausible. So it's not exactly like denying the moon landings, as I haven't heard NASA saying "the moon landings might have been faked, but we can't prove either way" anytime recently.

LatteLazy 4y ago
And this is the amazing leap so many people seem to make: If it is technically possible, then it must be true. That's what baffles me here: "We cannot conclusively say it's wrong" so it must be right. When did that become a popular mode of reasoning? I can only assume people are so desperate to believe they will swallow this rather than accept reality.
- Closi 4y ago
  That's not what I'm saying - Where did I say it must be true? I'm saying "We cannot conclusively say it's wrong, thus it's not in the same category as the moon landing". In reality nobody knows the origin for certain, but IMO you seem to fall for the fallacy you are describing but with the opposite premise - i.e. "We cannot conclusively say that the lab leak theory is right or wrong, thus it cannot possibly be a lab leak".