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In my experience (as a regular biker) intersections are dangerous in two main ways: 1. The driver behind me doesn't expect me to stop and almost (or does) hit

In my experience (as a regular biker) intersections are dangerous in two main ways: 1. The driver behind me doesn't expect me to stop and almost (or does) hit me. 2. I'm very vulnerable when first starting up and it's easy for turning drivers to miss me or for my balance to push me slightly left or right. An Idaho stop law means that I'm able to proceed through a red light when there's no moving cars around which largely solves (2). Additionally, in my area I can take a main street or side streets. I generally take the main road for the same reason drivers so: there's stop signs every 600ft on the side roads. If I could cruise down the side street without stopping constantly I'd be much more likely to take it which keeps me out of the traffic on the main road.

II2II 4y ago
> 1. The driver behind me doesn't expect me to stop and almost (or does) hit me. Try signalling. One of two things will happen: they will either realize that you are coming to a stop or they won't have a clue what the signal means (even though it is in the driver's manual, at least around here). Either way, they will slow down.
- avianlyric 4y ago
  Signalling how? If they’re coming to a stop at stop sign, and intending to continue ahead, how do you suggest they signal?
  - II2II 4y ago
    It appears to vary from region to region, but it is left arm out then bend down at the elbow in my neck of the woods. It's the same signal that drivers are supposed to use if the need ever arises. (Though the only reason I can think of a driver needing hand signals is if their turn signal is damaged, in which case they shouldn't have the vehicle on the road!)
    - giantg2 4y ago
      You're describing a stop signal. They're asking how to signal continuous travel through an intersection.
      - II2II 4y ago
        I don't think there is a proper signal, but I used to signal my intention of continuous travel to oncoming traffic by pointing straight ahead. My city, in it's infinite wisdom, decided that bike traffic was supposed to go straight through an intersection while all motor vehicles had to turn onto the main street. The road markings were only for motor vehicles, while far less noticable road signs were for bikes. It got interesting at times, since some motorists assumed everyone had to turn. The city has since resolved that with a clearly marked bike lane. (Though it's fun watching vehicles as large as semi's try to fit into the bike lane, thinking it gives them the right to go straight through.)
      - lsaferite 4y ago
        > 1. The driver behind me doesn't expect me to stop and almost (or does) hit me. > They're asking how to signal continuous travel through an intersection. No, they are not.
        giantg2 4y ago
        Ah, I see. I misread what they were saying.
- giantg2 4y ago
  I would guess the majority of people have no idea what manual signals are, or that they even exist. I would bet that there is a sizable percent of people who think a manual left turn signal is somebody waving them past.
- kgermino 4y ago
  Signaling while stopping is hard since the "proper" way is to use your left hand is signal a stop and that's also the hand that controls the good brake. But even then, I'd be surprised if the driver who's reckless/inattentive enough not to pay attention to the person in front of them at a stop sign both noticed and understood what the signal meant. Worth a shot though.
  - II2II 4y ago
    > But even then, I'd be surprised if the driver who's reckless/inattentive enough not to pay attention to the person in front of them at a stop sign both noticed and understood what the signal meant. I have used it in several circumstances where I am fairly certain the driver was responding to the signal. Whether the understood the signal or not is an open question. If they didn't, it seemed to be enough to get them to slow down -- which is all that I can really ask for. As for the whole signalling while braking situation on bikes, it's kinda nuts. I have to make a left turn while going down hill at one point of my commute. It's pretty much signal, brake with both hands, signal and turn. I understand why bikes don't apply both brakes with one lever, but it is awkward at times.
mynegation 4y ago
“No moving cars”. This is exactly a kind of language that makes for ambiguity and misinterpretations of Idaho stop. If I am a car that has just stopped at the all way stop before you reached your stop line, am I a “moving” car or not?
- kgermino 4y ago
  That's talking about red lights not stop signs, maybe I should be more clear. My point is that the rule allows me to either go mid-cycle when the cross traffic is clear or at least jump the gun a bit and start moving during the all-red phase. Either way it's safer for me since I'm not having to start with a bunch of cars that can accelerate faster than me in a space where "unexpected" movements are common.

II2II 4y ago

> 1. The driver behind me doesn't expect me to stop and almost (or does) hit me. Try signalling. One of two things will happen: they will either realize that you are coming to a stop or they won't have a clue what the signal means (even though it is in the driver's manual, at least around here). Either way, they will slow down.

avianlyric 4y ago
Signalling how? If they’re coming to a stop at stop sign, and intending to continue ahead, how do you suggest they signal?
- II2II 4y ago
  It appears to vary from region to region, but it is left arm out then bend down at the elbow in my neck of the woods. It's the same signal that drivers are supposed to use if the need ever arises. (Though the only reason I can think of a driver needing hand signals is if their turn signal is damaged, in which case they shouldn't have the vehicle on the road!)
  - giantg2 4y ago
    You're describing a stop signal. They're asking how to signal continuous travel through an intersection.
    - II2II 4y ago
      I don't think there is a proper signal, but I used to signal my intention of continuous travel to oncoming traffic by pointing straight ahead. My city, in it's infinite wisdom, decided that bike traffic was supposed to go straight through an intersection while all motor vehicles had to turn onto the main street. The road markings were only for motor vehicles, while far less noticable road signs were for bikes. It got interesting at times, since some motorists assumed everyone had to turn. The city has since resolved that with a clearly marked bike lane. (Though it's fun watching vehicles as large as semi's try to fit into the bike lane, thinking it gives them the right to go straight through.)
    - lsaferite 4y ago
      > 1. The driver behind me doesn't expect me to stop and almost (or does) hit me. > They're asking how to signal continuous travel through an intersection. No, they are not.
      - giantg2 4y ago
        Ah, I see. I misread what they were saying.
giantg2 4y ago
I would guess the majority of people have no idea what manual signals are, or that they even exist. I would bet that there is a sizable percent of people who think a manual left turn signal is somebody waving them past.
kgermino 4y ago
Signaling while stopping is hard since the "proper" way is to use your left hand is signal a stop and that's also the hand that controls the good brake. But even then, I'd be surprised if the driver who's reckless/inattentive enough not to pay attention to the person in front of them at a stop sign both noticed and understood what the signal meant. Worth a shot though.
- II2II 4y ago
  > But even then, I'd be surprised if the driver who's reckless/inattentive enough not to pay attention to the person in front of them at a stop sign both noticed and understood what the signal meant. I have used it in several circumstances where I am fairly certain the driver was responding to the signal. Whether the understood the signal or not is an open question. If they didn't, it seemed to be enough to get them to slow down -- which is all that I can really ask for. As for the whole signalling while braking situation on bikes, it's kinda nuts. I have to make a left turn while going down hill at one point of my commute. It's pretty much signal, brake with both hands, signal and turn. I understand why bikes don't apply both brakes with one lever, but it is awkward at times.

mynegation 4y ago

“No moving cars”. This is exactly a kind of language that makes for ambiguity and misinterpretations of Idaho stop. If I am a car that has just stopped at the all way stop before you reached your stop line, am I a “moving” car or not?

kgermino 4y ago
That's talking about red lights not stop signs, maybe I should be more clear. My point is that the rule allows me to either go mid-cycle when the cross traffic is clear or at least jump the gun a bit and start moving during the all-red phase. Either way it's safer for me since I'm not having to start with a bunch of cars that can accelerate faster than me in a space where "unexpected" movements are common.