5 ms·

E2E encryption happens on the client side, not on the server side. Therefore, no need to trust anybody, as long as the software is open-source.

by krn 4y ago

hawski 4y ago
If you run binaries compiled by the author of the software it wouldn't matter that it is open source, so play store is out of the question. So then it must be open source and you must use distributor you trust: your distro maintainers and F-Droid. Also you must trust that people did really take a look at the code.
- krn 4y ago
  That's exactly how Signal and Keybase work, and nobody has any problems with that.
  - hawski 4y ago
    I had exactly this in mind. Mostly if I wouldn't trust the author with binaries I wouldn't really trust with source code either.
  - hamburglar 4y ago
    That’s because most people hear “E2E” and think that somehow means they can automatically trust the client app. It’s a panacea.
kube-system 4y ago
> Therefore, no need to trust anybody, as long as the software is open-source. Demonstrably untrue. You must trust that the contributors are trustworthy, they have implemented a strong security posture for their project, and that the code is reviewed by people who are trustworthy. Many open-source projects have been, and continue to be, compromised on a regular basis.
- krn 4y ago
  > You must trust that the contributors are trustworthy In theory, that's only the case if you are unable to review the code yourself. In practice, it's like saying that TLS encryption is pointless, because one needs to trust every single person who implements it.
  - hatware 4y ago
    We're sure you review all the code you run.
  - kube-system 4y ago
    That's only the case if I am unable to review the code myself, before any update, I fully understand the code, and I am smart enough that the contributors are unable to pull a fast one on me. Given that I'm not a cryptography expert, I have a limited number of hours in the day, and open-source supply chain attacks are typically obfuscated, I don't consider that to be a trivial statement.
beders 4y ago
Not on phones. You have 0 guarantee that the open source code is actually the code that runs on your device. And you have 0 guarantee that the device itself is not compromised. And you have 0 guarantee that the OS is not storing your data. E2E on mobile devices is a security blanket with holes the size of the solar system.

E2E encryption happens on the client side, not on the server side. Therefore, no need to trust anybody, as long as the software is open-source.

by krn 4y ago

E2E encryption happens on the client side, not on the server side. Therefore, no need to trust anybody, as long as the software is open-source.

hawski 4y ago

If you run binaries compiled by the author of the software it wouldn't matter that it is open source, so play store is out of the question. So then it must be open source and you must use distributor you trust: your distro maintainers and F-Droid. Also you must trust that people did really take a look at the code.

krn 4y ago
That's exactly how Signal and Keybase work, and nobody has any problems with that.
- hawski 4y ago
  I had exactly this in mind. Mostly if I wouldn't trust the author with binaries I wouldn't really trust with source code either.
- hamburglar 4y ago
  That’s because most people hear “E2E” and think that somehow means they can automatically trust the client app. It’s a panacea.

kube-system 4y ago

> Therefore, no need to trust anybody, as long as the software is open-source. Demonstrably untrue. You must trust that the contributors are trustworthy, they have implemented a strong security posture for their project, and that the code is reviewed by people who are trustworthy. Many open-source projects have been, and continue to be, compromised on a regular basis.

krn 4y ago
> You must trust that the contributors are trustworthy In theory, that's only the case if you are unable to review the code yourself. In practice, it's like saying that TLS encryption is pointless, because one needs to trust every single person who implements it.
- hatware 4y ago
  We're sure you review all the code you run.
- kube-system 4y ago
  That's only the case if I am unable to review the code myself, before any update, I fully understand the code, and I am smart enough that the contributors are unable to pull a fast one on me. Given that I'm not a cryptography expert, I have a limited number of hours in the day, and open-source supply chain attacks are typically obfuscated, I don't consider that to be a trivial statement.

beders 4y ago

Not on phones. You have 0 guarantee that the open source code is actually the code that runs on your device. And you have 0 guarantee that the device itself is not compromised. And you have 0 guarantee that the OS is not storing your data. E2E on mobile devices is a security blanket with holes the size of the solar system.