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Two Marriott Hotels Introduce New Junk Fee
- josephcsible 4y agoThe golden rule of fees: if there are no circumstances under which you won't be charged the fee, then it should instead be incorporated into the base price. This sort of deception should be illegal.
- prvit 4y agoThis seems to be a government tax, not a fee made up by the hotel.
- blamazon 4y agoNot a tax. This article outlines the impact of the ordinance: https://www.fisherphillips.com/news-insights/8-things-los-angeles-hotels-comply-new-worker-protection-ordinance.html https://www.fisherphillips.com/news-insights/8-things-los-an... In short: it's worker protections. Is there a "food safety fee" for following food safety requirements? Is there a "this building has adequate fire suppression" fee? This is basically a "we follow local labor laws" fee. The cost of business increasing is not the issue here, although some people here may feel strongly about that. Passing that increase on as a fee is the deception we're discussing. The cost of doing business should be baked into the overall nightly rate, (which is algorithmic and highly variable already, so there is no excuse not to) so that the price is upfront to the consumer and hotels can be compared apples to apples, rather than the consumer having to unravel whatever hollywood accounting scheme each hotel comes up with to make their rate appear as low as possible.
- lzazz 4y agoI don't like the idea of the price of a service being increased during checkout, but it's good that people are shown what part of the price that they pay goes to complying with regulations, city taxes, etc - that information allows them to vote better.
- ok_dad 4y agoThat’s so naive, who says how much complying with labor laws costs? A business owner will lie and say it cost two times as much to gain advantage. Business owners should charge an up front price and if they can’t survive because they’re following the law then they can shut down and find a job. Owning a business isn’t a right bestowed by god.
- tehwebguy 4y agoYeah and even for the actual taxes this justification is untrue anyway. Nobody hides the price do that users will be like “Oh good, Marriott is treating me right but that damn government is making them add a tax,” they do it to get you past the first few decision points and correctly expect many will just admit defeat on the checkout page.
- dsfyu404ed 4y ago>who says how much complying with labor laws costs? When you run an otherwise stable business and have records going back far enough it's pretty easy to see the "cost" of a any given change in how you run things especially if that change has a labor/materials impact that is pretty isolated and countable.
- floor2 4y ago> who says how much complying with labor laws costs? Basic accounting? If you used to pay $X for something and a new tax goes into effect that makes it $X * 5% tax, you can hide that into the overall price or be transparent to your customers about why your prices are increasing. > they can shut down and find a job Love it. The financial equivalent of "Why should I care about farmers? I buy my food at the store". > Owning a business isn’t a right If you're not allowed to independently make a living, but must be a wage slave for a different entity, then none of your other fundamental human rights really matter. The right to start your own business is one of the most fundamental human rights.
- Scharkenberg 4y agoEven if we assume you have a point there, are people staying at city A's hotels the ones voting in city A's elections?
- Ekaros 4y agoEven if the thing is always expected it should be in the price. Like "gratuities". Just insane, that there is expected level and it is not included and paid through by company by default.
- exabrial 4y agoThis is not a junk fee, it's a junk law. Stupid in, stupid out.
- blamazon 4y agoWhat's stupid about the law? Do you perhaps have experience in hospitality in the LA area and/or can help illuminate the situation for us, so as to try to persuade us of your opinion? Here's a summary of the ordinance for anyone who's not familiar: https://wagesla.lacity.org/sites/g/files/wph1941/files/2022-08/Hotel%20Worker%20Protection%20Ordinance%20Official%20Notice%20ENG.pdf https://wagesla.lacity.org/sites/g/files/wph1941/files/2022-... And what I think is the full text: https://wagesla.lacity.org/sites/g/files/wph1941/files/2022-08/Hotel%20Worker%20Protection%20Ordinance%20Rules%20and%20Regulations_0.pdf https://wagesla.lacity.org/sites/g/files/wph1941/files/2022-... Doesn't seem that stupid to me as a layperson, reading through it. I'm curious what you see at issue here. There's even a one-year waiver available for financial hardship, and it appears some or all of the protections could be waived under a collective bargaining agreement.
- CamperBob2 4y agoThe correct question isn't "What's stupid about this law," it's "What's necessary about this law?" Failure to ask this question is how you end up with idiotic, counterproductive Proposition 65 warnings all over everything in sight.
- blamazon 4y agoA bit of online research suggests that hotel staff that were sexually harassed/assaulted at work and subsequently not taken seriously by their management, or not allowed to file a police report on 'company time', were primary originators of the push for this ordinance. The rest of the law focuses on things like: any work over 10 hours in one day is voluntary. Hmm, I wonder why that is necessary?
- josephcsible 4y agoSure, the law is stupid, but that doesn't make the fee okay. Complying with laws, even stupid ones, is a cost of doing business.
- jlawer 4y agoI am really glad in Australia companies aren't typically allowed to advertise prices ex taxes / fees. They are allowed to mention the costs as a line item, but can't advertise only part of the cost (i.e. if they advertise its a $89 room, you need to be able to get it for $89)
- fps-hero 4y agoThankfully we have great consumer laws in Australia. This is referred to as drip pricing. It also makes practices such as mandatory minimum tips illegal, which would make someone from the US’s head spin. https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/pricing/price-displays https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/pricing/price-displays
- jjeaff 4y agoThe only case I can think of where there is a mandatory minimum tip in the US is that a lot of restaurants will charge a minimum gratuity for parties larger than 6-8.
- CaptainZapp 4y agoYou are expected to tip 15% for service, even if mediocre or outright bad. You're expected to tip north of 20% for good service. Sure, in theory this is not strictly mandatory. Socially, if you don't play the game you're a leeching pariah.
- blamazon 4y agoTo put it explicitly: if you don't tip, you're personally choosing for that person to make as little as $2.13 an hour for that transaction. Most would balk at pulling that lever.
- jjeaff 4y agoWell, you are actually pushing their wage downward, but not to $2.13. The lowest would be the minimum wage of the area since the company is required by law to make up the difference.
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- anon291 4y agoI don't know the details but if this fee is required even for rewards redemptions, is it a local tax? If so .. i wouldn't necessarily expect tax to be included in the rate.
- akerl_ 4y agoAm I missing something? The article text suggests these are "mandatory fees and surcharges that are not included in the headline price", but all the screenshots from Marriott's site show the all-in total, inclusive of the fees, when you're searching, and then break down the elements of that price when you pay. What's being hidden here?
- josephcsible 4y agoEven if nothing were being hidden, there's still the issue that the hotels make you pay these sorts of junk fees even when you're supposed to be getting the room for free with points.
- WildGreenLeave 4y agoI used the Marriott app inside the US and what I found is that you have to specifically select the price to include everything. By default it is the rate without all other required items (e.g. tax). Maybe this is the difference?
- renewiltord 4y agoSF is full of these. Every restaurant bill will have some SF Healthcare Ordinance or something else on it. Now that would be a useful proposition: all visible prices must have local taxes and fees built-in. We all know everything is going to switch to the tip entry, though. A tip for directing you to the self-checkout, no doubt.
- macinjosh 4y agoI don’t see the issue they aren’t charging the fee. The government is. The anger is severely misplaced here. Consumers should know why prices go up.
- nirimda 4y agoDo you seriously think any company is ever going to give you a fully accurate and itemised bill, that identifies which costs were incurred because of legal compliance, which costs were incurred in the pursuit of profit, which costs are pay and benefits for employees, which costs were incurred to acquire consumable resources etc? This is not how ordinary businesses act, and it's dishonest to imply that that's all they're doing here.
- quacksilver 4y agoThe title made me think people were leaving trash in their hotel rooms (quickly resolved by visiting and reading it) I wonder if you would get billed for forgetting your CRTs / tyres / hazardous waste / bags of asbestos when you checked out, if that was not explicitly in the contract...
- JustLurking2022 4y agoI've never understood how it isn't false advertising to have non-tax/non-optional fees stacked on top of the "price".
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]