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I don't think it's crazy that you don't get evergreen upgrades to a system you've already bought, especially when you can just upgrade the motherboard to the 12

I don't think it's crazy that you don't get evergreen upgrades to a system you've already bought, especially when you can just upgrade the motherboard to the 12th gen (which is actually the core value proposition of framework) https://frame.work/marketplace/mainboards https://frame.work/marketplace/mainboards They do address it in the post: > For 11th Gen systems, we also have a firmware update in progress to bring in the security updates and power consumption improvements, but not retroactively certify Thunderbolt (there are some test cases we don’t believe we can resolve on that generation, unfortunately). Sounds like a hardware thing, which again you can upgrade

javajosh 4y ago
Yeah, well replacing your whole laptop is an upgrade too. The mainboard is by far the most expensive component, so saying "you can just replace it" obviates the point of the frameowork.
- ketralnis 4y ago
  I'm honestly baffled by this. That's not their claim at all, I don't see them claiming that evergreen software updates are "the point" anywhere. They talk about repairability and upgradeability. They never claimed the 11th (or 12th!) gen had or would ever have Thunderbolt 4. I don't see at all why you think that software updates are "the point" of Framework.
  - javajosh 4y ago
    My concern isn't about Framework's claim, but about their behavior. It seems like they are abandoning the 11th gen mainboards, which were still being sold until just a few months ago. This points to a business strategy of planned obsolescence for mainboards. My concern is that this isn't so different, from a price or environmental perspective, from the more common strategy of making the whole laptop obsolete.
    - ketralnis 4y ago
      Their behaviour of... not being able to change the hardware that's currently in your laptop?
- shimon 4y ago
  You're still generating a lot less trash than replacing the whole laptop, but I have a hard time imagining how you can get the level of consumer-upgradeability you seem to want in a laptop form factor. You have to compromise somewhere.

javajosh 4y ago

Yeah, well replacing your whole laptop is an upgrade too. The mainboard is by far the most expensive component, so saying "you can just replace it" obviates the point of the frameowork.

ketralnis 4y ago
I'm honestly baffled by this. That's not their claim at all, I don't see them claiming that evergreen software updates are "the point" anywhere. They talk about repairability and upgradeability. They never claimed the 11th (or 12th!) gen had or would ever have Thunderbolt 4. I don't see at all why you think that software updates are "the point" of Framework.
- javajosh 4y ago
  My concern isn't about Framework's claim, but about their behavior. It seems like they are abandoning the 11th gen mainboards, which were still being sold until just a few months ago. This points to a business strategy of planned obsolescence for mainboards. My concern is that this isn't so different, from a price or environmental perspective, from the more common strategy of making the whole laptop obsolete.
  - ketralnis 4y ago
    Their behaviour of... not being able to change the hardware that's currently in your laptop?
shimon 4y ago
You're still generating a lot less trash than replacing the whole laptop, but I have a hard time imagining how you can get the level of consumer-upgradeability you seem to want in a laptop form factor. You have to compromise somewhere.