5 ms·

And all the Chinese got was 2.5x GDP per capita

onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
They also have 300% debt to GDP compared to 84% for India. We'll never know how much more advanced India would be if they invested as much in infrastructure.
- dirtyid 4y ago
  You're comparing national debt with total debt. PRC national debt gdp is ~70%, LOWER than India ~90%. Also PRC has 5.5x the GDP / per capita vs India.
  - onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
    That's including debt held by "private" corporations that are extensions of the state. All the mega banks in China are indistinguishable from the state - you're looking at 100% of debt to GDP on their balance sheets alone.
- Aunche 4y ago
  > They also have 300% debt to GDP compared to 84% for India. You're comparing the total debt of China with the national debt of India.
  - onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
    India doesn't have "private" corporations which are just an extension of the state. All the mega banks in China are indistinguishable from the state - you're looking at 100% of debt to GDP on their balance sheets alone.
    - scarmig 4y ago
      I think the relevant figures here would be how much of each countries' banks' balance sheets are de facto liabilities to the state. I can buy that Chinese banks incur more liability for their government than Indian banks do for theirs; I don't buy the idea that China is 100% liable for its banks' balance sheets while India is 0% liable for its banks' balance sheets.
      - onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
        AFAIK, ICBC is China's largest bank, and it's main purpose is to finance government construction and keep the debt off China's balance sheet. Such a bank does not exist in the US or any major EU countries. They issue bonds and keep the debts on their balance sheets. I'm skeptical India has any such equivalent. The same is true for all the major banks in China. The main difference in China is that - since the bank is an extension of the state - the state directly decides who does and very importantly WHO DOES NOT get funding. The companies that do get funding are often times GSEs. This is federal debt... Pretending otherwise is pedantic. Sure, I'm with you - count Fannie Mae's and Freddie Mac's debts as the US Federal Government's debt. India and almost every other country don't have any equivalents.
    - rippercushions 4y ago
      It actually does: Indian Railways, Coal India, Air India (until very recently), State Bank of India, Bharat Petroleum, BSNL, the list goes on and on.
svieira 4y ago
"That's a chain of office you are wearing; may I see it? Why Richard, it profits a man nothing to give his soul for the whole world ... but for Wales?" https://youtu.be/bLIsqYKDqY8?t=214 https://youtu.be/bLIsqYKDqY8?t=214 To put it another way - how many children are an acceptable sacrifice for mammon? I say "none".

They also have 300% debt to GDP compared to 84% for India. We'll never know how much more advanced India would be if they invested as much in infrastructure.

dirtyid 4y ago
You're comparing national debt with total debt. PRC national debt gdp is ~70%, LOWER than India ~90%. Also PRC has 5.5x the GDP / per capita vs India.
- onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
  That's including debt held by "private" corporations that are extensions of the state. All the mega banks in China are indistinguishable from the state - you're looking at 100% of debt to GDP on their balance sheets alone.
Aunche 4y ago
> They also have 300% debt to GDP compared to 84% for India. You're comparing the total debt of China with the national debt of India.
- onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
  India doesn't have "private" corporations which are just an extension of the state. All the mega banks in China are indistinguishable from the state - you're looking at 100% of debt to GDP on their balance sheets alone.
  - scarmig 4y ago
    I think the relevant figures here would be how much of each countries' banks' balance sheets are de facto liabilities to the state. I can buy that Chinese banks incur more liability for their government than Indian banks do for theirs; I don't buy the idea that China is 100% liable for its banks' balance sheets while India is 0% liable for its banks' balance sheets.
    - onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
      AFAIK, ICBC is China's largest bank, and it's main purpose is to finance government construction and keep the debt off China's balance sheet. Such a bank does not exist in the US or any major EU countries. They issue bonds and keep the debts on their balance sheets. I'm skeptical India has any such equivalent. The same is true for all the major banks in China. The main difference in China is that - since the bank is an extension of the state - the state directly decides who does and very importantly WHO DOES NOT get funding. The companies that do get funding are often times GSEs. This is federal debt... Pretending otherwise is pedantic. Sure, I'm with you - count Fannie Mae's and Freddie Mac's debts as the US Federal Government's debt. India and almost every other country don't have any equivalents.
  - rippercushions 4y ago
    It actually does: Indian Railways, Coal India, Air India (until very recently), State Bank of India, Bharat Petroleum, BSNL, the list goes on and on.

svieira 4y ago

"That's a chain of office you are wearing; may I see it? Why Richard, it profits a man nothing to give his soul for the whole world ... but for Wales?" https://youtu.be/bLIsqYKDqY8?t=214 https://youtu.be/bLIsqYKDqY8?t=214 To put it another way - how many children are an acceptable sacrifice for mammon? I say "none".