5 ms·

I politely disagree: you just pick an "entry node", similar to picking an ISP or an email provider. You can interact with everyone in the Fediverse just fine. H

I politely disagree: you just pick an "entry node", similar to picking an ISP or an email provider. You can interact with everyone in the Fediverse just fine. Having a newsfeed for your chosen "entry node" is an additional nice-to-have imho but not the defining criteria.

_ph_ 4y ago
Picking an ISP should be transparent - my usage of internet services, like with whom I communicate - isn't influenced by it. I can change my ISP any time and no one will even notice, no one will have to be informed about a changed address. Picking an email provider is quite critical - if you change your email address, you can be only reached if everyone knows your new address, lets not even get started about where the email is used to identify you with other serviced. I think your choice of a a mastodon server falls in the middle ground between those examples, at minimum, there needs to be a bit more education of users to overcome (perceived?) hurdles there. I can confirm that while I noticed mastodon before, earlier attempts to use it stopped at the question on how to select the proper node and what consequences that has. That might be a perceived problem, but one that needs to be overcome if mastodon should be a popular Twitter alternative.
stewbrew 4y ago
No, it's more like picking your community. Compare an account on mastodon.social vs an instance localated in your hometown to see the difference.
- the_mitsuhiko 4y ago
  What is the difference? From my limited exposure to Mastodon at the moment I don't actually interact with "my instance", i just follow a bunch of people most of which are not actually on my instance. Not sure what I would be missing out on.
  - stewbrew 4y ago
    You can use mastodon this way of course and ignore the local feed.
    - the_mitsuhiko 4y ago
      I mean coming from Twitter the entire idea of a "local feed" is already so weird. Why would I want to follow random people?
      - wrycoder 4y ago
        Because you happened to notice they were interesting?
  - toofy 4y ago
    yeah, the panic people are putting forward about server choice is really strange. my account is on a friends invite server and 99% of the people i follow and interact with are on all kinds of other servers. my timeline is almost entirely people from dozens of other servers. im not at all sure why people are panicked about this.
    - pwinnski 4y ago
      The key phrase in your statement is "on a friends invite server." Okay, so if you don't already have a friend on Mastodon, then what? Have you actually looked at the list on https://joinmastodon.org/servers https://joinmastodon.org/servers recently? Half the comments here say it doesn't matter what server you choose, and half are saying to be sure to choose the one that aligns with your interests, which... see the list above for why that's an issue. Panic? No. It's just an example of mastodon needlessly limiting itself in terms of usability right at the starting gate.
      - toofy 4y ago
        > The key phrase in your statement is "on a friends invite server." why is this a key statement? my point is that being on a friends server hasn't altered the experience at all. i migrated to my friends server a couple days ago from mastodon.social--i literally haven't noticed any difference at all, the experience from everything i can tell has been identical as it was prior. the server im on made literally no difference. i still follow the same people. i still have the exact same followers. my timeline is identical. i still see all of tehir posts. they still see mine. i still see posts they repost. again, i have noticed absolutely nothing meaningfully different. other than maybe the address i type into the address bar to reach the site, but i dont think thats "meaningful" in any meaningful ;) way.
        pwinnski 4y ago
        Today, I cannot sign up at "your friend's server" nor mastodon.social, so neither of those things help me. The phrase is key because it reflects a familiarity which new users do not have. Have you never in your life been introduced to an environment you didn't understand and felt put off by everybody using words you didn't know, or words you did know in ways you didn't understand? Never, in any situation? Because that's exactly how it feels for many, many, many new users of mastodon now.
nr2x 4y ago
If I own a domain I can host my email anywhere. I own the name, and every possible address. Mastodon does not have nearly the same level of portability and ownership. This is why I think AT is more promising.
- toofy 4y ago
  > Mastodon does not have nearly the same level of portability and ownership. how so? its just a protocol, just like email. which concerns do you have that it is not as portable as email?
  - nr2x 4y ago
    I can move my email host and my mail keeps coming to me. Mastodon you need to set up some weird redirects from one server to another. It’s the difference between forwarding your Hotmail to your new gmail vs just swapping your provider and keeping your domain the same.
pwinnski 4y ago
People "pick" an ISP based on price. They pick an email provider based on UI, or features, or price, or cachet. How should I pick an entry node? I go to https://mastodon.social/ https://mastodon.social/ because that's where people say things are happening, and I click "Create Account." I'm told I can't sign up here, but I can "Find another server" You've already lost a huge percentage of potential users, but let's say I press on. I click through to https://joinmastodon.org/servers https://joinmastodon.org/servers and see things like glasgow.social and metalhead.club. I'm neither Glaswegian nor a metalhead, so what do I choose? On what basis do I make this choice? It's immediately overwhelming, with a very real fear of picking the "wrong" server and somehow missing out on, well, I don't know, because how would I?

_ph_ 4y ago

Picking an ISP should be transparent - my usage of internet services, like with whom I communicate - isn't influenced by it. I can change my ISP any time and no one will even notice, no one will have to be informed about a changed address. Picking an email provider is quite critical - if you change your email address, you can be only reached if everyone knows your new address, lets not even get started about where the email is used to identify you with other serviced. I think your choice of a a mastodon server falls in the middle ground between those examples, at minimum, there needs to be a bit more education of users to overcome (perceived?) hurdles there. I can confirm that while I noticed mastodon before, earlier attempts to use it stopped at the question on how to select the proper node and what consequences that has. That might be a perceived problem, but one that needs to be overcome if mastodon should be a popular Twitter alternative.

stewbrew 4y ago

No, it's more like picking your community. Compare an account on mastodon.social vs an instance localated in your hometown to see the difference.

the_mitsuhiko 4y ago
What is the difference? From my limited exposure to Mastodon at the moment I don't actually interact with "my instance", i just follow a bunch of people most of which are not actually on my instance. Not sure what I would be missing out on.
- stewbrew 4y ago
  You can use mastodon this way of course and ignore the local feed.
  - the_mitsuhiko 4y ago
    I mean coming from Twitter the entire idea of a "local feed" is already so weird. Why would I want to follow random people?
    - wrycoder 4y ago
      Because you happened to notice they were interesting?
- toofy 4y ago
  yeah, the panic people are putting forward about server choice is really strange. my account is on a friends invite server and 99% of the people i follow and interact with are on all kinds of other servers. my timeline is almost entirely people from dozens of other servers. im not at all sure why people are panicked about this.
  - pwinnski 4y ago
    The key phrase in your statement is "on a friends invite server." Okay, so if you don't already have a friend on Mastodon, then what? Have you actually looked at the list on https://joinmastodon.org/servers https://joinmastodon.org/servers recently? Half the comments here say it doesn't matter what server you choose, and half are saying to be sure to choose the one that aligns with your interests, which... see the list above for why that's an issue. Panic? No. It's just an example of mastodon needlessly limiting itself in terms of usability right at the starting gate.
    - toofy 4y ago
      > The key phrase in your statement is "on a friends invite server." why is this a key statement? my point is that being on a friends server hasn't altered the experience at all. i migrated to my friends server a couple days ago from mastodon.social--i literally haven't noticed any difference at all, the experience from everything i can tell has been identical as it was prior. the server im on made literally no difference. i still follow the same people. i still have the exact same followers. my timeline is identical. i still see all of tehir posts. they still see mine. i still see posts they repost. again, i have noticed absolutely nothing meaningfully different. other than maybe the address i type into the address bar to reach the site, but i dont think thats "meaningful" in any meaningful ;) way.
      - pwinnski 4y ago
        Today, I cannot sign up at "your friend's server" nor mastodon.social, so neither of those things help me. The phrase is key because it reflects a familiarity which new users do not have. Have you never in your life been introduced to an environment you didn't understand and felt put off by everybody using words you didn't know, or words you did know in ways you didn't understand? Never, in any situation? Because that's exactly how it feels for many, many, many new users of mastodon now.

nr2x 4y ago

If I own a domain I can host my email anywhere. I own the name, and every possible address. Mastodon does not have nearly the same level of portability and ownership. This is why I think AT is more promising.

toofy 4y ago
> Mastodon does not have nearly the same level of portability and ownership. how so? its just a protocol, just like email. which concerns do you have that it is not as portable as email?
- nr2x 4y ago
  I can move my email host and my mail keeps coming to me. Mastodon you need to set up some weird redirects from one server to another. It’s the difference between forwarding your Hotmail to your new gmail vs just swapping your provider and keeping your domain the same.

pwinnski 4y ago

People "pick" an ISP based on price. They pick an email provider based on UI, or features, or price, or cachet. How should I pick an entry node? I go to https://mastodon.social/ https://mastodon.social/ because that's where people say things are happening, and I click "Create Account." I'm told I can't sign up here, but I can "Find another server" You've already lost a huge percentage of potential users, but let's say I press on. I click through to https://joinmastodon.org/servers https://joinmastodon.org/servers and see things like glasgow.social and metalhead.club. I'm neither Glaswegian nor a metalhead, so what do I choose? On what basis do I make this choice? It's immediately overwhelming, with a very real fear of picking the "wrong" server and somehow missing out on, well, I don't know, because how would I?