4 ms·

Don't discount the fact that many europeans are actively trying to conserve and refuse to heat their house until absolutely necessary. I have 65 yr old friends

by kristo 4y ago

Don't discount the fact that many europeans are actively trying to conserve and refuse to heat their house until absolutely necessary. I have 65 yr old friends in amsterdam taking spongebaths because they don't want to support russia

somedude895 4y ago
Is that just an anecdote though? In Switzerland the govt has been running an energy conservation awareness campaign for about 6 weeks now and the stats say it's had zero effect so far.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- Tarsul 4y ago
  I think it helps but it's hard to measure as long as the outside temparatures are not comparable to last years. I follow the diagrams for Germany and right now consumers use about 30% less than the average of 2018-2021[1]. I think many people reduce their heating not just to help Ukraine etc. but also because they (we) know that it's way too expensive and we certainly weren't looking for much cost savings before. I thought I did last year (remember: already 2021 there was news that russia was not delivering as much gas as they usually do) but I'm actually on track to use like 50% less than last year. But yeah, thats just anecdata. [1]https://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/erdgas-versorgung-europas-im-live-tracker-speicher-pipelines-lng-a-e2986967-51d2-4c8c-9607-f3ff3e333361 https://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/erdgas-versorgung-europas-...
  - oezi 4y ago
    Many German newspapers have data visualization on the topic: Frankfurter Allgemeine: https://m.faz.net/aktuell/wirtschaft/zahlen-zu-strom-und-gas-so-hart-trifft-die-krise-deutschland-18232227.html https://m.faz.net/aktuell/wirtschaft/zahlen-zu-strom-und-gas... Zeit Online: https://www.zeit.de/wirtschaft/energiemonitor-deutschland-gaspreis-spritpreis-energieversorgung https://www.zeit.de/wirtschaft/energiemonitor-deutschland-ga... It seems clear to me that German are trying to save energy both in private households and in industry. This seem quite reasonable given that gas prices for many end customers are double of last year's prices.
- slim 4y ago
  Maybe it has an effect but not the one you expect (it makes people hate Russians)
- benj111 4y ago
  Electricity usage in the UK is low compared to last year. Https://grid.iamkate.com If you look at past year demand it's currently 28.1gw weekly average v 31.6gw last year so that's a roughly 10% drop.
- guerrilla 4y ago
  It depends on the country. Last I read here it was down 7%, other places down around 15%... Germany has had legislation since at least Sept. but I'm not sure where to find the results of that. My personal consumption is down 66% for October and I think my neighbor's is yet more. Also note, it's the warmest winter on record in many places in Europe.
- yakak 4y ago
  Older people I know in Switzerland are definitely taking action, I've seen no action in businesses which use considerably more energy, though there are less businesses overall.
- hnbad 4y ago
  I think the problem may be that (at least in Germany, not sure about Switzerland) we've had awareness campaigns about conserving energy and water for ecological reasons since at least the 1990s. I recall learning in school ca. 2000 to turn off the light when leaving a room, to take short showers instead of using the bathtub, to turn thermostats to 19°C or less, to soap my hands before turning on the faucet and to use the water-saving flush after only peeing. This wasn't related to any particular shortage.

by kristo 4y ago

somedude895 4y ago

Is that just an anecdote though? In Switzerland the govt has been running an energy conservation awareness campaign for about 6 weeks now and the stats say it's had zero effect so far.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
Tarsul 4y ago
I think it helps but it's hard to measure as long as the outside temparatures are not comparable to last years. I follow the diagrams for Germany and right now consumers use about 30% less than the average of 2018-2021[1]. I think many people reduce their heating not just to help Ukraine etc. but also because they (we) know that it's way too expensive and we certainly weren't looking for much cost savings before. I thought I did last year (remember: already 2021 there was news that russia was not delivering as much gas as they usually do) but I'm actually on track to use like 50% less than last year. But yeah, thats just anecdata. [1]https://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/erdgas-versorgung-europas-im-live-tracker-speicher-pipelines-lng-a-e2986967-51d2-4c8c-9607-f3ff3e333361 https://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/erdgas-versorgung-europas-...
- oezi 4y ago
  Many German newspapers have data visualization on the topic: Frankfurter Allgemeine: https://m.faz.net/aktuell/wirtschaft/zahlen-zu-strom-und-gas-so-hart-trifft-die-krise-deutschland-18232227.html https://m.faz.net/aktuell/wirtschaft/zahlen-zu-strom-und-gas... Zeit Online: https://www.zeit.de/wirtschaft/energiemonitor-deutschland-gaspreis-spritpreis-energieversorgung https://www.zeit.de/wirtschaft/energiemonitor-deutschland-ga... It seems clear to me that German are trying to save energy both in private households and in industry. This seem quite reasonable given that gas prices for many end customers are double of last year's prices.
slim 4y ago
Maybe it has an effect but not the one you expect (it makes people hate Russians)
benj111 4y ago
Electricity usage in the UK is low compared to last year. Https://grid.iamkate.com If you look at past year demand it's currently 28.1gw weekly average v 31.6gw last year so that's a roughly 10% drop.
guerrilla 4y ago
It depends on the country. Last I read here it was down 7%, other places down around 15%... Germany has had legislation since at least Sept. but I'm not sure where to find the results of that. My personal consumption is down 66% for October and I think my neighbor's is yet more. Also note, it's the warmest winter on record in many places in Europe.
yakak 4y ago
Older people I know in Switzerland are definitely taking action, I've seen no action in businesses which use considerably more energy, though there are less businesses overall.
hnbad 4y ago
I think the problem may be that (at least in Germany, not sure about Switzerland) we've had awareness campaigns about conserving energy and water for ecological reasons since at least the 1990s. I recall learning in school ca. 2000 to turn off the light when leaving a room, to take short showers instead of using the bathtub, to turn thermostats to 19°C or less, to soap my hands before turning on the faucet and to use the water-saving flush after only peeing. This wasn't related to any particular shortage.