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Devil's advocate: In the post, he himself says he would've earned more by doing a show for HBO/Comedy Central/other (also note that he mentions, but doesn't fac

Devil's advocate: In the post, he himself says he would've earned more by doing a show for HBO/Comedy Central/other (also note that he mentions, but doesn't factor in the cost of his own time in putting this all together). Given that a lot of people purchased this only to support "the experiment" (i.e. they might not buy the next time he or someone else does this), does this really demonstrate the success of selling independently? Yes, he still owns the material and can resell it to Netflix or whoever. Yes, he will continue to earn money from it. But I imagine most of his true fan base will have already purchased it by now, so how many people are there really left to reach? Don't get me wrong, I would love to see this all become the standard way of distributing content. I think it will eventually happen. But what does it say that today's most most popular working comedian makes less money selling independently? EDIT: Based on these numbers, yes, Louis CK will end up making more money this way. But to say he hasn't done any publicity to this point is stretching the truth - he's promoted it all over his Twitter, gone on Reddit, did an interview on NPR, etc. It's not like he just dropped this out of the blue without warning. But my overall point isn't whether it will work out financially for Louis CK (clearly, it will) - it's that the circumstances of this business model work for Louis CK, but not necessarily others following in his footsteps. EDIT2: Also, it's not as if others going the traditional route wouldn't make money in perpetuity. Maybe Eddie Murphy only got a standard fee for his Raw standup special, but surely he's getting residuals from DVD sales.

reustle 15y ago
I completely agree, but don't think most others would spend almost $200k on production.
radley 15y ago
It's been 4 days. Think George Carlin or Richard Pryor - i.e. watching great old stand-up 20 years later. No royalties - all self-owned. He could sell for $1 ea and still make more than the flat fee.
- MikeCapone 15y ago
  Exactly. This is a pretty timeless show. It won't get stale quickly. If it's already considered a success after 4 days, imagine in 4 years.
DaveMebs 15y ago
I don't think there is any evidence to support the notion that "a lot of people purchased this only to support the experiment." Sure, some folks on a HN thread commented to this effect, but I think that the vast majority of the 111000+ people who bought this probably like Louis CK. I recognize that I don't have any data to support my assertion either, but given the options of "buy this because I like Louis CK" and "buy this because I like alternative distribution models," I am fairly confident that more people are on the side of the former. I also don't know why you think most of his "true fan base" would have bought this already. I love Louis CK and only found out about this because I am an HN reader. Why would you think most non-HN readers even know this is available? I mean really, I think you should at least wait a week before decreeing that "today's most most popular working comedian makes less money selling independently."
- wastedbrains 15y ago
  I bought to support the experiment, same with rainbows, NIN and others. I do agree that most purchases aren't this way and the long tail should be significant.
- sirclueless 15y ago
  Well, almost all of the facebook shares about this that I have seen are exclusively about the novelty and experiment. I didn't see anything that just left it at "Oh, Louis C.K. is awesome. Check out his new thing." So at least anecdotally, a lot of people around me bought this because of novelty and to support this business model instead of because they like standup or Louis CK.
  - philhippus 15y ago
    I think that says something about his target audience. People are capable of more complex thought than "funny man is funny" and the usual base instincts that marketers have exploited to great effect. This marketing ploy adds an extra layer to customer involvement, just mildly stimulating the slightly higher faculties of the consumer base cognisance. As sentient biological super-computers that human beings are, they easily comprehend the concept and gladly exchange money to support it.
r0s 15y ago
I can only imagine the overhead is much lower compared to a HBO production. Compound that against every future sale as well.
sliverstorm 15y ago
You'd need to know what conglomerates pay him. If the differential is not large, I could see the difference residing in the costs he paid. HBO doesn't have to develop a new website from scratch every time, and they probably have in-house production, reducing cost.
cookiecaper 15y ago
>it's that the circumstances of this business model work for Louis CK, but not necessarily others following in his footsteps. I fully agree with this. If you have your own cable TV show, you can make a lot of money by selling your wares independently online. The platform is a lot different for those of us that can't start an AMA on Reddit and have it shoot up to 10,000 comments in a few hours. This mentality is reminiscent of the first tech bubble. People, if you aren't already a famous figure or brand, it is difficult to get traffic and it is really difficult to get $500k in sales in four days. I'm not saying it never happens, but you shouldn't go into anything with that kind of expectation.
- tankenmate 15y ago
  Personally I had never heard of Louis C.K. before. What I did do though is watch the quick taster on his site and liked what I saw; sold.
- icebraining 15y ago
  Yes, but if you're unknown, you won't be able to get the same contract he could with a large company neither. It may still be worth it.
BrandonM 15y ago
> But to say he hasn't done any publicity to this point is stretching the truth - he's promoted it all over his Twitter, gone on Reddit, did an interview on NPR, etc. This is all stuff that he was able to do from the comfort of his own home. An HBO/Comedy Central/other contract would also stipulate that he make the rounds of Conan O'Brien, Jay Leno, David Letterman, and numerous radio shows to promote the material. Those kinds of appearances are critical for expanding your fan base, since they give an essentially captive audience a chance to be exposed to a performer's material. Just look at his viral "Everything's Amazing and Nobody's Happy" routine that helped get a lot of his current fan base. The point is, he hasn't even begun to do the type of promotion that he typically would be contractually obligated to do, yet he's already closing in on the amount he usually expects to make. This looks like a wildly successful experiment.
- manpat 15y ago
  Actually, he has already done Conan (all week-special in NY back in October) where he clearly stated some details about his upcoming "$5-show". Also, today he's doing Leno.
paolomaffei 15y ago
It got first link on front page of reddit BECAUSE he was distributing this way. This won't happen the next times if this method of distribution becomes the norm.
- tdoggette 15y ago
  A comedy special isn't an every-couple-of-weeks thing, and the front page of reddit isn't a very exclusive club. I'd bet five bucks that his next $5 special enjoys a great deal of attention from there.
maximusprime 15y ago
> " today's most most popular working comedian" Are you serious? Most popular on Reddit and other liberal political communities maybe. I don't think anyone would claim he's the most popular comedian working today.
dasil003 15y ago
I don't disagree, but I think the more interesting angle is not that people are "supporting an experiment", but that so few A-listers are doing it this way so it stands out and attracts attention without any marketing effort. If everyone did it this way then no one would be impressed and he would have to fight for attention just like everything else in the normal marketplace. That said, the normal marketplace has completely lost sight of pleasing the consumer, and instead they're trying to fleece us for everything they can get. An example is the price of Blu-rays and the fact that they still force you to sit through 20 mins of ads every fucking time you want to watch the movie you paid an arm and a leg for. So even though I'm cynical about the industry, it's refreshing that Louis can do something like this in such a plainspoken way and really move the needle, giving the industry execs something to think about at least.
ianstormtaylor 15y ago
Just as far as this goes: "Yes, he will continue to earn money from it. But I imagine most of his true fan base will have already purchased it by now, so how many people are there really left to reach?" Fan bases are always growing/shrinking. That statement is the equivalent of saying that Michael Jackson's "Bad" album probably saturated his fan base in 1987, and he probably didn't make much money off of it in the 24 years since. I wouldn't underestimate the long tail.

reustle 15y ago

I completely agree, but don't think most others would spend almost $200k on production.

radley 15y ago

It's been 4 days. Think George Carlin or Richard Pryor - i.e. watching great old stand-up 20 years later. No royalties - all self-owned. He could sell for $1 ea and still make more than the flat fee.

MikeCapone 15y ago
Exactly. This is a pretty timeless show. It won't get stale quickly. If it's already considered a success after 4 days, imagine in 4 years.

DaveMebs 15y ago

I don't think there is any evidence to support the notion that "a lot of people purchased this only to support the experiment." Sure, some folks on a HN thread commented to this effect, but I think that the vast majority of the 111000+ people who bought this probably like Louis CK. I recognize that I don't have any data to support my assertion either, but given the options of "buy this because I like Louis CK" and "buy this because I like alternative distribution models," I am fairly confident that more people are on the side of the former. I also don't know why you think most of his "true fan base" would have bought this already. I love Louis CK and only found out about this because I am an HN reader. Why would you think most non-HN readers even know this is available? I mean really, I think you should at least wait a week before decreeing that "today's most most popular working comedian makes less money selling independently."

wastedbrains 15y ago
I bought to support the experiment, same with rainbows, NIN and others. I do agree that most purchases aren't this way and the long tail should be significant.
sirclueless 15y ago
Well, almost all of the facebook shares about this that I have seen are exclusively about the novelty and experiment. I didn't see anything that just left it at "Oh, Louis C.K. is awesome. Check out his new thing." So at least anecdotally, a lot of people around me bought this because of novelty and to support this business model instead of because they like standup or Louis CK.
- philhippus 15y ago
  I think that says something about his target audience. People are capable of more complex thought than "funny man is funny" and the usual base instincts that marketers have exploited to great effect. This marketing ploy adds an extra layer to customer involvement, just mildly stimulating the slightly higher faculties of the consumer base cognisance. As sentient biological super-computers that human beings are, they easily comprehend the concept and gladly exchange money to support it.

r0s 15y ago

I can only imagine the overhead is much lower compared to a HBO production. Compound that against every future sale as well.

sliverstorm 15y ago

You'd need to know what conglomerates pay him. If the differential is not large, I could see the difference residing in the costs he paid. HBO doesn't have to develop a new website from scratch every time, and they probably have in-house production, reducing cost.

cookiecaper 15y ago

>it's that the circumstances of this business model work for Louis CK, but not necessarily others following in his footsteps. I fully agree with this. If you have your own cable TV show, you can make a lot of money by selling your wares independently online. The platform is a lot different for those of us that can't start an AMA on Reddit and have it shoot up to 10,000 comments in a few hours. This mentality is reminiscent of the first tech bubble. People, if you aren't already a famous figure or brand, it is difficult to get traffic and it is really difficult to get $500k in sales in four days. I'm not saying it never happens, but you shouldn't go into anything with that kind of expectation.

tankenmate 15y ago
Personally I had never heard of Louis C.K. before. What I did do though is watch the quick taster on his site and liked what I saw; sold.
icebraining 15y ago
Yes, but if you're unknown, you won't be able to get the same contract he could with a large company neither. It may still be worth it.

BrandonM 15y ago

> But to say he hasn't done any publicity to this point is stretching the truth - he's promoted it all over his Twitter, gone on Reddit, did an interview on NPR, etc. This is all stuff that he was able to do from the comfort of his own home. An HBO/Comedy Central/other contract would also stipulate that he make the rounds of Conan O'Brien, Jay Leno, David Letterman, and numerous radio shows to promote the material. Those kinds of appearances are critical for expanding your fan base, since they give an essentially captive audience a chance to be exposed to a performer's material. Just look at his viral "Everything's Amazing and Nobody's Happy" routine that helped get a lot of his current fan base. The point is, he hasn't even begun to do the type of promotion that he typically would be contractually obligated to do, yet he's already closing in on the amount he usually expects to make. This looks like a wildly successful experiment.

manpat 15y ago
Actually, he has already done Conan (all week-special in NY back in October) where he clearly stated some details about his upcoming "$5-show". Also, today he's doing Leno.

paolomaffei 15y ago

It got first link on front page of reddit BECAUSE he was distributing this way. This won't happen the next times if this method of distribution becomes the norm.

tdoggette 15y ago
A comedy special isn't an every-couple-of-weeks thing, and the front page of reddit isn't a very exclusive club. I'd bet five bucks that his next $5 special enjoys a great deal of attention from there.

maximusprime 15y ago

> " today's most most popular working comedian" Are you serious? Most popular on Reddit and other liberal political communities maybe. I don't think anyone would claim he's the most popular comedian working today.

dasil003 15y ago

I don't disagree, but I think the more interesting angle is not that people are "supporting an experiment", but that so few A-listers are doing it this way so it stands out and attracts attention without any marketing effort. If everyone did it this way then no one would be impressed and he would have to fight for attention just like everything else in the normal marketplace. That said, the normal marketplace has completely lost sight of pleasing the consumer, and instead they're trying to fleece us for everything they can get. An example is the price of Blu-rays and the fact that they still force you to sit through 20 mins of ads every fucking time you want to watch the movie you paid an arm and a leg for. So even though I'm cynical about the industry, it's refreshing that Louis can do something like this in such a plainspoken way and really move the needle, giving the industry execs something to think about at least.

ianstormtaylor 15y ago

Just as far as this goes: "Yes, he will continue to earn money from it. But I imagine most of his true fan base will have already purchased it by now, so how many people are there really left to reach?" Fan bases are always growing/shrinking. That statement is the equivalent of saying that Michael Jackson's "Bad" album probably saturated his fan base in 1987, and he probably didn't make much money off of it in the 24 years since. I wouldn't underestimate the long tail.