4 ms·

I don't get why people think this is an editor feature, and not an OS feature. When I want to view two files at the same time, I open two windows, and put them

by e1ven 15y ago

I don't get why people think this is an editor feature, and not an OS feature. When I want to view two files at the same time, I open two windows, and put them side by side. Not everything needs to be fullscreen all-the-time. Let the OS manage windows. It's better at it! Besides, having windows automatically become half-maximized is easy with the right tools, like BetterTouchTool (Do it with a gesture!), or Divvy.

frou_dh 15y ago
The OS isn't better at it if there is none or limited ability to manipulate the windows in a keyboard driven way. I use and love the 3rd party tool SizeUp, but SublimeText2's integrated pane management (including moving tabs between them) is far better than plain windows.
- e1ven 15y ago
  Can you help me understand how it's better? SizeUp looks perfect for something like this. Want to view two files? Ctrl-right on one, it's now on the right side of the screen. Command-O, chose the new file, Ctrl-left on it, it's now on the left side. I'm honestly very curious what Sublime/etc offer that is better than what you can do with the OS?
  - frou_dh 15y ago
    What's the key to add a third column and have the others automatically resized? Do other windows start inheriting the project drawer if older windows are closed? Each window has multiple tabs - how do you tear off and replant them using the keyboard? Doh, now the temporary horizontal split panes like find-in-project, the python console, etc, must be attached to a specific narrow window. And so on. I like a multi window desktop and am certainly not a maximise-everything guy. But relying on the OS for everything is not optimal.
  - hesitz 15y ago
    In Vim there are many benefits from having multiple buffers open within the same Vim instance. Buffers share session data of the Vim instance they're in. This has a lot of different benefits, including automatically sharing whatever options or settings have been set (many dynamically or temporarily set), sharing of Vim registers, macros, and command history, all of which are heavily used when editing (if OS handled they would generally share a single clipboard register), Vim-controlled navigation between buffers and windows, Vim-controlled scripting between multiple buffers, Vim-controlled searches of multiple buffers, and more. Because there are so many benefits of having multiple buffers/files open within the same Vim instance it makes sense to have multiple buffers viewable at once, not to have only one viewable at a time. You lose a lot of editing power if buffers are not open in same Vim instance; it doesn't make sense to open a new file separately in different Vim instance. Moreover, many times split windows are useful to show two different views of the _same_ buffer at once.
  - danielsoneg 15y ago
    Because then I've gotta deal with two windows. Cmd+~ : One's now in the background, the other isn't. Switch apps, one comes back, the other doesn't. Switch monitors, the sizing's off. Try to do anything other than 50/50 split, have to adjust manually. Try to use TM's project browser (seriously), doesn't work. Try to swap that second file for a different one, have to close the window, open a new window & reposition. It's generally a much clunkier workflow. Granted, I only know that from using VIM (and occasionally SublimeText), but it's been one of my "Dear GOD Give Me This in TM" requests for a while. I've got SizeUp and love it - truly one of my must-have apps - but to me it's a hack, not a solution.
  - danielsoneg 15y ago
    Because then I've gotta deal with two windows. Cmd+~ : One's now in the background, the other isn't. Switch apps, one comes back, the other doesn't. Switch monitors, the sizing's off. Try to do anything other than 50/50 split, have to adjust manually. Try to use TM's project browser (seriously), doesn't work. Try to swap that second file for a different one, have to close the window, open a new window & reposition. It's generally a much clunkier workflow. Granted, I only know that from using VIM (and occasionally SublimeText), but it's been one of my "Dear GOD Give Me This in TM" requests for a while. I've got SizeUp and love it - truly one of my must-have apps - but to me it's a hack, not a solution.
- dkersten 15y ago
  On linux, I've been using tiled window managers exclusively for about three years now and the lack of good tiling features is almost painful when I use windows (though the win7 tiling features certainly were a welcome addition). I personally hate having to reach for the mouse if I'm typing, so tiled window managers are a perfect fit for me.
  - dorian-graph 15y ago
    Which tiling window manager have you settled on?
    - dkersten 15y ago
      I've been using musca[1] because out of the bocks, it works exactly how I wanted a window manager to work and at the time it was well maintained. Though it doesn't seem to be maintained anymore, but I have not had any problems with it (plus the source is available anyway, so I could always attempt to extend it myself should I ever need to). [1] http://aerosuidae.net/musca.html http://aerosuidae.net/musca.html
js2 15y ago
It's not necessarily about having two files open at once. More often than not I want the same file open in two windows so I can reference one part while I work on another. This can be done in TextMate but not easily. TextMate also doesn't quite make it easy to open different files in the same project in different windows: It's something like Go to File (command-t), Reveal in Project (command-control-r), right-click on the file and select Open in New Window (no keyboard shortcut). You should be able to do this entirely from the keyboard but you can't within the confines of TextMate. I also happen to work on a project with 24k+ files, which even with an SSD TextMate does not do well with. I have a script to generate a tmproj file[1] that contains the files I want to make it manageable. [1] https://gist.github.com/1473107 https://gist.github.com/1473107
scott_s 15y ago
Because ":split otherfile" is faster, easier and provides a better result. I don't need to fuss with windows or even take my fingers off the keyboard.
math0ne 15y ago
Having two windows open at the same time, at least for me in EMACs is all about running command on the two windows at the same time, I don't think you can do that with two windows open.
nocman 15y ago
vimdiff, that's why. (or whatever your editor of choice calls its synchronized side-by-side diff mode)
sjs 15y ago
The problem is if you open a new window with "Open "filename.ext" in a New Window" and then try to do something like Cmd-T or Find in Project in the 2nd window it doesn't work. So you'd have to open the project again, jump to the file you want, and hide the drawer. New windows should be a part of the same project they were opened from.
pbreit 15y ago
I used to think that about tabs but, boy, was I wrong.

by e1ven 15y ago

frou_dh 15y ago

The OS isn't better at it if there is none or limited ability to manipulate the windows in a keyboard driven way. I use and love the 3rd party tool SizeUp, but SublimeText2's integrated pane management (including moving tabs between them) is far better than plain windows.

e1ven 15y ago
Can you help me understand how it's better? SizeUp looks perfect for something like this. Want to view two files? Ctrl-right on one, it's now on the right side of the screen. Command-O, chose the new file, Ctrl-left on it, it's now on the left side. I'm honestly very curious what Sublime/etc offer that is better than what you can do with the OS?
- frou_dh 15y ago
  What's the key to add a third column and have the others automatically resized? Do other windows start inheriting the project drawer if older windows are closed? Each window has multiple tabs - how do you tear off and replant them using the keyboard? Doh, now the temporary horizontal split panes like find-in-project, the python console, etc, must be attached to a specific narrow window. And so on. I like a multi window desktop and am certainly not a maximise-everything guy. But relying on the OS for everything is not optimal.
- hesitz 15y ago
  In Vim there are many benefits from having multiple buffers open within the same Vim instance. Buffers share session data of the Vim instance they're in. This has a lot of different benefits, including automatically sharing whatever options or settings have been set (many dynamically or temporarily set), sharing of Vim registers, macros, and command history, all of which are heavily used when editing (if OS handled they would generally share a single clipboard register), Vim-controlled navigation between buffers and windows, Vim-controlled scripting between multiple buffers, Vim-controlled searches of multiple buffers, and more. Because there are so many benefits of having multiple buffers/files open within the same Vim instance it makes sense to have multiple buffers viewable at once, not to have only one viewable at a time. You lose a lot of editing power if buffers are not open in same Vim instance; it doesn't make sense to open a new file separately in different Vim instance. Moreover, many times split windows are useful to show two different views of the _same_ buffer at once.
- danielsoneg 15y ago
  Because then I've gotta deal with two windows. Cmd+~ : One's now in the background, the other isn't. Switch apps, one comes back, the other doesn't. Switch monitors, the sizing's off. Try to do anything other than 50/50 split, have to adjust manually. Try to use TM's project browser (seriously), doesn't work. Try to swap that second file for a different one, have to close the window, open a new window & reposition. It's generally a much clunkier workflow. Granted, I only know that from using VIM (and occasionally SublimeText), but it's been one of my "Dear GOD Give Me This in TM" requests for a while. I've got SizeUp and love it - truly one of my must-have apps - but to me it's a hack, not a solution.
- danielsoneg 15y ago
  Because then I've gotta deal with two windows. Cmd+~ : One's now in the background, the other isn't. Switch apps, one comes back, the other doesn't. Switch monitors, the sizing's off. Try to do anything other than 50/50 split, have to adjust manually. Try to use TM's project browser (seriously), doesn't work. Try to swap that second file for a different one, have to close the window, open a new window & reposition. It's generally a much clunkier workflow. Granted, I only know that from using VIM (and occasionally SublimeText), but it's been one of my "Dear GOD Give Me This in TM" requests for a while. I've got SizeUp and love it - truly one of my must-have apps - but to me it's a hack, not a solution.
dkersten 15y ago
On linux, I've been using tiled window managers exclusively for about three years now and the lack of good tiling features is almost painful when I use windows (though the win7 tiling features certainly were a welcome addition). I personally hate having to reach for the mouse if I'm typing, so tiled window managers are a perfect fit for me.
- dorian-graph 15y ago
  Which tiling window manager have you settled on?
  - dkersten 15y ago
    I've been using musca[1] because out of the bocks, it works exactly how I wanted a window manager to work and at the time it was well maintained. Though it doesn't seem to be maintained anymore, but I have not had any problems with it (plus the source is available anyway, so I could always attempt to extend it myself should I ever need to). [1] http://aerosuidae.net/musca.html http://aerosuidae.net/musca.html

js2 15y ago

It's not necessarily about having two files open at once. More often than not I want the same file open in two windows so I can reference one part while I work on another. This can be done in TextMate but not easily. TextMate also doesn't quite make it easy to open different files in the same project in different windows: It's something like Go to File (command-t), Reveal in Project (command-control-r), right-click on the file and select Open in New Window (no keyboard shortcut). You should be able to do this entirely from the keyboard but you can't within the confines of TextMate. I also happen to work on a project with 24k+ files, which even with an SSD TextMate does not do well with. I have a script to generate a tmproj file[1] that contains the files I want to make it manageable. [1] https://gist.github.com/1473107 https://gist.github.com/1473107

scott_s 15y ago

Because ":split otherfile" is faster, easier and provides a better result. I don't need to fuss with windows or even take my fingers off the keyboard.

math0ne 15y ago

Having two windows open at the same time, at least for me in EMACs is all about running command on the two windows at the same time, I don't think you can do that with two windows open.

nocman 15y ago

vimdiff, that's why. (or whatever your editor of choice calls its synchronized side-by-side diff mode)

sjs 15y ago

The problem is if you open a new window with "Open "filename.ext" in a New Window" and then try to do something like Cmd-T or Find in Project in the 2nd window it doesn't work. So you'd have to open the project again, jump to the file you want, and hide the drawer. New windows should be a part of the same project they were opened from.

pbreit 15y ago

I used to think that about tabs but, boy, was I wrong.