4 ms·

that's exactly elons problem now. every unpopular action will be pinned on him personally. https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/28/23428132/elon-musk-twitter-acqui

by stefs 4y ago

that's exactly elons problem now. every unpopular action will be pinned on him personally. https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/28/23428132/elon-musk-twitter-acquisition-problems-speech-moderation https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/28/23428132/elon-musk-twitt...

dmix 4y ago
Facebook's ire seems to always be focused on Zuckerberg. It was always that way, especially after the Social Network movie. And despite about a decade of similar whining on HN about deleting Facebook they are still the most popular social network around.
- tchaffee 4y ago
  What's your source for popularity and does it do a breakdown by demographics advertisers are most interested in? Because I think that tells a very different story from "still most popular with boomers". Their earnings and stock price also tell a different story from "still most popular".
  - dmix 4y ago
    Just go through the list of most popular Twitter users and ask yourself where else are they going to go? I personally wouldn't gamble the farm on corporation ad spending's adherence to social justice if those eyeballs are all in one place... at least long term. At least FB has to compete with messaging apps and Instagram/TikTok. Twitter doesn't have a good #2. It's probably a mistake to take the emotional outrage news cycles over the next month (or 3) as much more than the exact thing people will keep going back to Twitter for... ironically this outrage at Musk is the exactly what drives people to use Twitter.
    - tchaffee 4y ago
      You avoided my question. Can you provide your source for your claim about Facebook?
      - dmix 4y ago
        Oh sorry I didn't read your comment clearly. And no I don't think I need to support such a statement with a source. I'm sure you can find one.
        tchaffee 4y ago
        > And no I don't think I need to support such a statement with a source. I'm sure you can find one. What I've found is Facebook is not popular with young people: the audience many advertisers are the most interested in. The stock market is certainly not happy with their latest results. So sure, I can easily find a source that says Facebook is still the most popular platform. The details matter. Is it growth in Asia that's keeping their numbers up while US users shrink? Are they failing to attract young people? Have they lost users among the HN demographics? These details matter if you want the actual story.
        dmix 4y ago
        User-wise Facebook seems to be doing fine: > One area where Meta showed promise was in adding to Facebook’s massive user base > Facebook has 2.93 billion monthly active users. 1.98 billion daily active users. That was up from 1.97 billion three months ago. > Facebook has 264 million monthly active users in the United States and Canada alone. The majority of Facebook’s users belong to the 25 to 34 age group. > Twitter has 206 million daily active users. > TikTok has 1 billion monthly active users (MAU’s). Facebook is going through a massive pivot and spending a wild amount of $$ on the Metaverse. All tech stocks are down. So I wouldn't put too much weight on stock price. The other major thing is how Apple changed ad tracking works which reduce ad prices by 20% on average. That's a major decline in revenue for any company ("Advertising represented 98.2% of the company’s total revenue"). But YoY revenue only declined by 4%. https://www.wsj.com/articles/meta-facebook-q3-earnings-report-2022-11666753938 https://www.wsj.com/articles/meta-facebook-q3-earnings-repor... https://www.demandsage.com/facebook-statistics/ https://www.demandsage.com/facebook-statistics/
        tchaffee 4y ago
- stefs 4y ago
  there might be a difference in public perception: zuckerberg built his platform in the first place, so he's got a legitimate claim to destroy it in whatever way he seems fit (even if that's not really true). musk just walzed in; his aquisition looks like a hostile takeover and now seems a bit clueless about how to proceed ("20$ too much? how about 8?").
  - dmix 4y ago
    All of this seems to assume what people care about right now is what matters. The news cycle will move on in a couple weeks. That's when the real test will be for how much people really give a shit.
woojoo666 4y ago
I wonder how Steve Jobs avoided this. Perhaps by being less political I guess
- ben_w 4y ago
  I think it also helped that Apple was still an underdog even after he got cancer, and very few people direct vitriol at underdogs or cancer victims.
- throwntoday 4y ago
  Steve was almost universally mocked/hated by anyone that didn't use Apple products. He was also had an ornery personality that didn't mesh well with many.
- medion 4y ago
  I really don’t think Jobs would have created and maintained a presence through social media - I don’t think he needed or desired the attention like Musk does... But anyway, who can ever know.
- bee_rider 4y ago
  It was a different time, "CEO of an unsuccessful tech company" wasn't a person you had to have an opinion on. And then once Apple became successful with iPods and iPhones, their business model was "give us money in exchange for this neat thing," which is sort generally likeable and also opt-in (technically Twitter is opt in, I guess, but all the news reporters take it very seriously for some reason, so it tends to impose even if you don't opt in).
- wccrawford 4y ago
  I think it's because so many of Apple's customers idolized him. He was seen as a hero that could do no wrong, and all the poor decisions that Apple made were somehow someone else's fault. Even when I saw people complaining that Apple was making things harder for developers, Steve's name was not mentioned.
- acdha 4y ago
  That’s mostly it. He got his share of criticism but it was almost entirely for what he did in his official capacity at Apple and he didn’t seem to crave the limelight or expect to influence works affairs anything like Musk, Zuckerberg, etc. do. The changing the world talk was mostly about making computers people wanted to use, and if you disagreed on whether they did that it wasn’t something which you needed to spend any time thinking about.
polishdude20 4y ago
And at the same time, any of his company's accomplishments are often attributed to him. You become an idol so you receive the good and the bad feedback.

by stefs 4y ago

dmix 4y ago

Facebook's ire seems to always be focused on Zuckerberg. It was always that way, especially after the Social Network movie. And despite about a decade of similar whining on HN about deleting Facebook they are still the most popular social network around.

tchaffee 4y ago
What's your source for popularity and does it do a breakdown by demographics advertisers are most interested in? Because I think that tells a very different story from "still most popular with boomers". Their earnings and stock price also tell a different story from "still most popular".
- dmix 4y ago
  Just go through the list of most popular Twitter users and ask yourself where else are they going to go? I personally wouldn't gamble the farm on corporation ad spending's adherence to social justice if those eyeballs are all in one place... at least long term. At least FB has to compete with messaging apps and Instagram/TikTok. Twitter doesn't have a good #2. It's probably a mistake to take the emotional outrage news cycles over the next month (or 3) as much more than the exact thing people will keep going back to Twitter for... ironically this outrage at Musk is the exactly what drives people to use Twitter.
  - tchaffee 4y ago
    You avoided my question. Can you provide your source for your claim about Facebook?
    - dmix 4y ago
      Oh sorry I didn't read your comment clearly. And no I don't think I need to support such a statement with a source. I'm sure you can find one.
      - tchaffee 4y ago
        > And no I don't think I need to support such a statement with a source. I'm sure you can find one. What I've found is Facebook is not popular with young people: the audience many advertisers are the most interested in. The stock market is certainly not happy with their latest results. So sure, I can easily find a source that says Facebook is still the most popular platform. The details matter. Is it growth in Asia that's keeping their numbers up while US users shrink? Are they failing to attract young people? Have they lost users among the HN demographics? These details matter if you want the actual story.
        dmix 4y ago
        User-wise Facebook seems to be doing fine: > One area where Meta showed promise was in adding to Facebook’s massive user base > Facebook has 2.93 billion monthly active users. 1.98 billion daily active users. That was up from 1.97 billion three months ago. > Facebook has 264 million monthly active users in the United States and Canada alone. The majority of Facebook’s users belong to the 25 to 34 age group. > Twitter has 206 million daily active users. > TikTok has 1 billion monthly active users (MAU’s). Facebook is going through a massive pivot and spending a wild amount of $$ on the Metaverse. All tech stocks are down. So I wouldn't put too much weight on stock price. The other major thing is how Apple changed ad tracking works which reduce ad prices by 20% on average. That's a major decline in revenue for any company ("Advertising represented 98.2% of the company’s total revenue"). But YoY revenue only declined by 4%. https://www.wsj.com/articles/meta-facebook-q3-earnings-report-2022-11666753938 https://www.wsj.com/articles/meta-facebook-q3-earnings-repor... https://www.demandsage.com/facebook-statistics/ https://www.demandsage.com/facebook-statistics/
        tchaffee 4y ago
stefs 4y ago
there might be a difference in public perception: zuckerberg built his platform in the first place, so he's got a legitimate claim to destroy it in whatever way he seems fit (even if that's not really true). musk just walzed in; his aquisition looks like a hostile takeover and now seems a bit clueless about how to proceed ("20$ too much? how about 8?").
- dmix 4y ago
  All of this seems to assume what people care about right now is what matters. The news cycle will move on in a couple weeks. That's when the real test will be for how much people really give a shit.

woojoo666 4y ago

I wonder how Steve Jobs avoided this. Perhaps by being less political I guess

ben_w 4y ago
I think it also helped that Apple was still an underdog even after he got cancer, and very few people direct vitriol at underdogs or cancer victims.
throwntoday 4y ago
Steve was almost universally mocked/hated by anyone that didn't use Apple products. He was also had an ornery personality that didn't mesh well with many.
medion 4y ago
I really don’t think Jobs would have created and maintained a presence through social media - I don’t think he needed or desired the attention like Musk does... But anyway, who can ever know.
bee_rider 4y ago
It was a different time, "CEO of an unsuccessful tech company" wasn't a person you had to have an opinion on. And then once Apple became successful with iPods and iPhones, their business model was "give us money in exchange for this neat thing," which is sort generally likeable and also opt-in (technically Twitter is opt in, I guess, but all the news reporters take it very seriously for some reason, so it tends to impose even if you don't opt in).
wccrawford 4y ago
I think it's because so many of Apple's customers idolized him. He was seen as a hero that could do no wrong, and all the poor decisions that Apple made were somehow someone else's fault. Even when I saw people complaining that Apple was making things harder for developers, Steve's name was not mentioned.
acdha 4y ago
That’s mostly it. He got his share of criticism but it was almost entirely for what he did in his official capacity at Apple and he didn’t seem to crave the limelight or expect to influence works affairs anything like Musk, Zuckerberg, etc. do. The changing the world talk was mostly about making computers people wanted to use, and if you disagreed on whether they did that it wasn’t something which you needed to spend any time thinking about.

polishdude20 4y ago

And at the same time, any of his company's accomplishments are often attributed to him. You become an idol so you receive the good and the bad feedback.