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> Pretty ironic how lack of access to capitalism can be such an important issue to a communist state. Lack of capitalism or lack of resources? One doesn't "imp
by orthecreedence 4y ago
> Pretty ironic how lack of access to capitalism can be such an important issue to a communist state.
Lack of capitalism or lack of resources? One doesn't "import capitalism" after an embargo is lifted.
- tick_tock_tick 4y agoI mean doesn't "Lack of capitalism" basically guarantee you'll have a "lack of resources". History seems to think so.
- orthecreedence 4y agoSpeaking of history, humanity existed for tens of thousands of years without capitalism, so no, "lack of capitalism" does not guarantee "lack of resources."
- tick_tock_tick 4y agoMost of human history is defined by frequent lacks of resource.....
- legitster 4y agoWell, by that logic, people lived on Cuba for thousands of years without access to American goods and services.
- orthecreedence 4y agoFair enough. My point is that capitalism doesn't materialize resources, as some people believe it to. It might be better than many other methods of organization to distribute resources, but only resources that are already available.
- BobbyJo 4y agoNo, but capitalism is the sole source of international trade. So those resources only come when they engage in voluntary exchange. International trade is the most libertarian of all markets, because there is no centralized oversight, so all parties basically bring their own gun. I don't agree with GPs framing though, as I think scale is important when comparing economic systems. You wouldn't want capitalism in your house, but it's the best thing at scale.
- orthecreedence 4y ago> You wouldn't want capitalism in your house, but it's the best thing at scale. Interestingly, I think it's the best thing at low to mid-scale. Once it reaches our current scale, the externalities of profit-driven production cross various thresholds that plunge us into existential crises. At-scale, we need some form of production that much more closely measures potential for externalities and allows assigning direct costs to these. Prices are incapable of doing this directly, and the promise of the liberal state to reign in externalities is more and more clearly an empty promise.
- BobbyJo 4y agoExternalities and profit pursuit are exactly why it functions at large scale. Those things exist in every economic system, capitalism streamlines how you direct them. > At-scale, we need some form of production that much more closely measures potential for externalities and allows assigning direct costs to these. Prices are incapable of doing this directly, and the promise of the liberal state to reign in externalities is more and more clearly an empty promise. That's the role of money and taxes. You price the externalities. The reality is, every capitalist country is perfectly capable of reigning in externalities, the just don't, because we're playing a huge game where we try to maximize our living standards without killing ourselves. If we priced CO2, living wages, and plastic cleanup into our lives, it would be a huge set back to our daily lives.
- legitster 4y ago> You wouldn't want capitalism in your house, but it's the best thing at scale. Although, growing up my dad literally did a weekly auction for chores. Actually worked pretty well too, lol.
- legitster 4y agoI mean, if Cuba lacks resources, then trading isn't beneficial to them anyway. What they want is access to capital. Either to international credit pools (to bring in equipment), or straight up cash infusion via US Tourism. Neither requires them to actually liberalize their economy, but they would certainly benefit from capitalism.