4 ms·

oi hent had that praablem boh. I cun talk loike I do at hum, withoout much hoohar.[1] I have lost my "cuntree" accent, because that shit is a far bigger impedi

oi hent had that praablem boh. I cun talk loike I do at hum, withoout much hoohar.[1] I have lost my "cuntree" accent, because that shit is a far bigger impediment to getting a job than actual class. (and in some cases race, but thats more complex) but, for those who are outside of the UK and want to understand, its hard to translate. There are three things that you are judged on here in the UK, and they are all sort of related to class: o Your clothes o your attitude o your accent All of these are proxies for class. The most important thing to be aware of is that race is not normally a signifier for class. to use a recent example: Rishi, our new prime minister, is posh as fuck. Posher, but not by much, than Liz truss. However less posh than Boris, as he is a no fooling aristocrat. If we compare Rishi to Priti Patel, former Home secretary, who is middle-middle class at best. The differentiator is accent, not wealth. Rishi is richer than the king, but thats not why he's posh. That is not to say that race is not a factor. its just nowhere near as big of a thing as it is in america. The advantage is that you can change your class, its much harder to change your race. However your class at the time of your birth leaves an inprint/set of habits that are difficult to overcome. I do know someone who was raised on a london estate with a strong SAAAAAF LAAANDEN accent, who now is a QC/KC (senior lawyer) and has a received pronunciation accent. It wasnt until I met her parents and sister that I realised how much she'd changed. [1] https://youtu.be/Feb-CdHBXc8?t=114 https://youtu.be/Feb-CdHBXc8?t=114 Although the mum has quite a soft central norfolk possibly norwich accent.

idkwhoiam 4y ago
Are foreigners assigned a class too or is it a native thing only?
- toyg 4y ago
  Like gaijins in Japan, foreigners in UK are not typically expected to participate in the system at all.
  - dreen 4y ago
    I spent the last 15 years in London and I strongly disagree. Not only are foreigners judged (perhaps subconsciously) on how British they can be, where you came from initially matters a great deal as well, which is why I worked on loosing my Eastern European accent. That being said, over those 15 years, I was only openly discriminated against once.
  - KaiserPro 4y ago
    Naa, you're expected to queue. if you go to the countryside, you will be treated as a rare and unusual person of status. but you still have to queue.
    - toyg 4y ago
      That's not the class system, lol.
- Balero 4y ago
  You aren't assigned one, its just a thing people pick up on. Everywhere has it to some degree, for example "White trash" in the US compared to "Frat boys".
  - pcthrowaway 4y ago
    > for example "White trash" in the US compared to "Frat boys". As someone who grew up in the U.S., those have a pretty large overlap to me
- throwaway22032 4y ago
  I had a think about this. Example: our PM, a man of Indian heritage (though British) who speaks RP. An Indian man with a really strong accent is going to be judged as being significantly lower status. I think it'd be the same pretty much across the scale. Like imagining a Polish software developer vs a builder and the latter would probably have a rougher accent. A strong southern American accent, etc.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- Barrin92 4y ago
  as a German guy who had the outside look in living in the UK for a while, not really. A lot of the markers of class that Brits are used to picking up just don't really apply. That said I found it absolutely wild how much of a sixth sense Brits have to figure out where someone hails from. And also the extent to which people unlearn behaviors.
- KaiserPro 4y ago
  Yes and no. A french person of any colour or location is instantly stylish and metropolitan. It doesn't matter if you come from the slums of Paris or Marseille, or some 4 house village in the middle, you, as a french person represent fashion, food, cutting remarks and wine. Germany: (dont mention the war) represent punctuality, lack of humour, process engineering. Artists are not german. Italian: hand waving, sun glasses, food. USA: crassness with a lack of class (which is subtly different from being working class) Japanese: The person you are speaking to is from a long an famous line of culturally important families. Now, those are the fun ones. This is where it gets a bit dicey, so please don't think I share these opinions. these are illustrative generalisations Eastern europeans: Imagine you are a family that has the same name as the villiage you live near. You own an estate, its been in the family for years, and you have labourers that have also been with the family for years. You hold them in high esteem, but they are very much working class. THats how they are viewed. "useful working class" Anyone from the indian subcontinent(pakistan, india, bangladesh) or looks like they are from there (see Ugandan expulsion) with a non received pronunciation accent, will generally be treated as working class. Its not universal, but its a strong assumption. Think small shop owner, pharmacist, etc etc etc. North african: Good question not sure west african: Instantly assume they are from an estate in lAAANDEN. East african: Also not sure.
  - rswskg 4y ago
    yikes.
  - hdjjhhvvhga 4y ago
    > ...not sure... Also not sure. Well, you are being quite polite here. Some people would say "working class", and some would suggest the contrary.
    - KaiserPro 4y ago
      Which in it's self is an interesting point, britians are wonderfully crap at spotting class in other nations. But to your other point, yes, I am deliberately avoiding writing that viewpoint down....
  - 4y ago
MaxPengwing 4y ago
I find that UK businessmen tend to always first look at your shoes, and I have seen peoples behaviours change based on the type, perceived exclusivity and cost of the shoes. "Suits should look decent, but the shoes makes the man" is what I found to be true.

idkwhoiam 4y ago

Are foreigners assigned a class too or is it a native thing only?

toyg 4y ago
Like gaijins in Japan, foreigners in UK are not typically expected to participate in the system at all.
- dreen 4y ago
  I spent the last 15 years in London and I strongly disagree. Not only are foreigners judged (perhaps subconsciously) on how British they can be, where you came from initially matters a great deal as well, which is why I worked on loosing my Eastern European accent. That being said, over those 15 years, I was only openly discriminated against once.
- KaiserPro 4y ago
  Naa, you're expected to queue. if you go to the countryside, you will be treated as a rare and unusual person of status. but you still have to queue.
  - toyg 4y ago
    That's not the class system, lol.
Balero 4y ago
You aren't assigned one, its just a thing people pick up on. Everywhere has it to some degree, for example "White trash" in the US compared to "Frat boys".
- pcthrowaway 4y ago
  > for example "White trash" in the US compared to "Frat boys". As someone who grew up in the U.S., those have a pretty large overlap to me
throwaway22032 4y ago
I had a think about this. Example: our PM, a man of Indian heritage (though British) who speaks RP. An Indian man with a really strong accent is going to be judged as being significantly lower status. I think it'd be the same pretty much across the scale. Like imagining a Polish software developer vs a builder and the latter would probably have a rougher accent. A strong southern American accent, etc.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
Barrin92 4y ago
as a German guy who had the outside look in living in the UK for a while, not really. A lot of the markers of class that Brits are used to picking up just don't really apply. That said I found it absolutely wild how much of a sixth sense Brits have to figure out where someone hails from. And also the extent to which people unlearn behaviors.
KaiserPro 4y ago
Yes and no. A french person of any colour or location is instantly stylish and metropolitan. It doesn't matter if you come from the slums of Paris or Marseille, or some 4 house village in the middle, you, as a french person represent fashion, food, cutting remarks and wine. Germany: (dont mention the war) represent punctuality, lack of humour, process engineering. Artists are not german. Italian: hand waving, sun glasses, food. USA: crassness with a lack of class (which is subtly different from being working class) Japanese: The person you are speaking to is from a long an famous line of culturally important families. Now, those are the fun ones. This is where it gets a bit dicey, so please don't think I share these opinions. these are illustrative generalisations Eastern europeans: Imagine you are a family that has the same name as the villiage you live near. You own an estate, its been in the family for years, and you have labourers that have also been with the family for years. You hold them in high esteem, but they are very much working class. THats how they are viewed. "useful working class" Anyone from the indian subcontinent(pakistan, india, bangladesh) or looks like they are from there (see Ugandan expulsion) with a non received pronunciation accent, will generally be treated as working class. Its not universal, but its a strong assumption. Think small shop owner, pharmacist, etc etc etc. North african: Good question not sure west african: Instantly assume they are from an estate in lAAANDEN. East african: Also not sure.
- rswskg 4y ago
  yikes.
- hdjjhhvvhga 4y ago
  > ...not sure... Also not sure. Well, you are being quite polite here. Some people would say "working class", and some would suggest the contrary.
  - KaiserPro 4y ago
    Which in it's self is an interesting point, britians are wonderfully crap at spotting class in other nations. But to your other point, yes, I am deliberately avoiding writing that viewpoint down....
- 4y ago

MaxPengwing 4y ago

I find that UK businessmen tend to always first look at your shoes, and I have seen peoples behaviours change based on the type, perceived exclusivity and cost of the shoes. "Suits should look decent, but the shoes makes the man" is what I found to be true.